Retribution

[quote name='Allamorph'][FONT=Arial]Quoted for truth, superiority, and emphasis. Also, please note that the sugar measurement is usually general, and that by [I]cup[/I] we usually mean [I]coffee mug[/I]. Darn Yankees don't have a clue what they're missing. :p[/FONT][/QUOTE] [size=1]Is Maryland south or north? I always feel lost... because we're south of the Mason-Dixon line and we do have a fair deal of southern culture. But at the same time, our politics are heavily northern. Sweet tea is awesome, but don't ever buy it in NYC. Terrible.[/size]

[size=1]I used to be hooked on this black pepper chai, which I'd fix with french vanilla and sugar. I broke the addiction though, and currently I stay away from coffee or tea. At work though, my throat was sore so I made some Earl Grey.[/size]

[quote name='Copycatalyst']Logic is not all we have in this world. . .I already know what I know so that's what I have, and you have whatever it is you have. Which is apparently a place I used to be a long time ago, and if you keep growing you may reach here. That's all your choice. [...] I really consider that our consciousness, and the way it has been used throughout our development, was just as insidious and stupidly used as say we love to talk about these animals as being barbarians in comparison to us.[/QUOTE] [size=1]I find this ironic. You're willing to patronize my knowledge and perceptions, yet criticize me for doing the same to animals. I'm done arguing with you. In the end, you and I operate on different principles -- I on logic, and you on some sort of higher state of being, and I say this cynically. We will never reach a consensus on what beauty is because we see other another's points of view as inferior and ill-informed.[/size]

[quote name='Fasteriskhead']I'm not sure if this is directed at me or someone else. If me, then, well, thanks![/QUOTE] [size=1]Certainly you. It was long (typical of you) but interesting as well. [QUOTE]I think you have a point, but it ignores a distinction of Kant's that I brought up just before the bit you quote when I said, "We never find anything beautiful because it's useful to us, or because we've been 'conditioned' to like certain things (on reflection that may seem likely, but you'll never find it in the experience itself)." I would have expanded on this more, except the post was too damn long already. This is the distinction Kant makes between [i]empirical realism[/i] - which is the stance we make when studying objects, when we test them and learn about them through experience - and [i]transcendental idealism[/i] - which is the stance necessary for studying [i]subjective facts[/i], things that have to be true for experience in general. The analysis of beauty, or (more accurately) the conditions for beauty's [i]possibility[/i], falls into the second area.[/QUOTE] I can't really argue any further without understanding what "transcendental idealism" entails (I never liked plain old transcendentalism to begin with). However, I think Kant's right when he says we never find something beautiful because of its utility. But I do think that our past experiences and conditioning contribute most heavily to each of our perceptions of beauty. [QUOTE]The moment the reason is added to the perception [i]itself[/i] (not just retroactively), somehow the experience of beauty crumbles.[/QUOTE] Not necessarily. I think if the reasoning is first experienced prior to the acknowledgment "this is beautiful" then you are right -- it's cheapened somehow. But if you see your daughter, think "this is beautiful" then realize you think that because you are biologically predisposed, I don't think you are necessarily compelled to then lose the feeling. [quote name='Copycatalyst']Sigh to Ret. Well, at least you know how to use what they've told you at school well. :D[/QUOTE] Logic is really all we've got in this world. Sorry to rely so heavily upon it, I just don't really jive with transcendent lines of thought. [QUOTE]So beauty is in the mind. . .well now we must ask [i]where is it in the mind[/i]? I don't know about you, but you can sit here and tell me "such and such a structure in the mind does such and such and there is beauty" until maybe you're rose-colored and tuft with frustration in your face. . .You still haven't told me what beauty is.[/QUOTE] Well, I was thinking about this earlier. The human body [i]is[/i] a gestalt machine in that we have this "mind" that arises out of our brain. How odd indeed. But, that doesn't [i]necessarily[/i] mean beauty can't be explained on some level by science. [QUOTE]When we say something is beautiful. . .that doesn't make it become beautiful. When we look at something and it is beautiful. . .it [b]is not[/b] a purely subjective experience. There are more than just your Ego being involved here; more than just you, looking at something. Some things look back. It's about interactions. . .not about laid-back observation. . .[/QUOTE] I personally disagree, but we'll never reach consensus on this. I personally think all objects are without definition until we assign it. A winding mountain path with pretty flowers might be beautiful to a hiker, but horrendous and painful to someone who was raped on a similar path. There is nothing beautiful [i]or[/i] horrendous about this path... the path is simply a path. [QUOTE]Here in America, and Western cultures, we enjoy physical beauty.[/QUOTE] All humans enjoy physical beauty. [QUOTE]The mind is a parser and a tuner of energies. . . It's not some machinated husk.[/QUOTE] I agree in that the mind is what animates us. It's what gives us autonomy and logic and free thought rather than being slave to instinct as most other animals are. [QUOTE]If we saw things as they were, without using schematas in our minds to distort what they were. If we took away our biases and our preconceptions, though not wholly, but as much as possible.[/QUOTE] But that is what creates beauty. All of the above create this perception of beauty. [QUOTE]When I look at things. . .personally, anyway, I do not label them anything.[/QUOTE] Absolutely untrue. No matter how much you want to escape it, you cannot do that without being brain dead. When you see a pillow, you assign it to a group of schema, and whatever it matches up with ("pillow") you perceive it as. If you did not do this, you would be totally unable to walk, to eat, to even think on a concrete level. No matter what you think you're doing, you're not. You're not walking around with no preconceptions, without any labels in your mind. Your subconscious is autonomous to a massive extent. [QUOTE]A car drives by; a bird twitters; all these things are happening all around me. . .and they are all beautiful to me, because I do not think beauty is in the mind. I think it is everywhere. It's everywhere because I do not put standards onto what must be beautiful and what isn't. And I don't call beauty subjective. Or in the eye of the beholder, whatever this phrase means. . .[/QUOTE] I hear what you're saying, but I consider this unity. I consider it ultimate harmony. Every law of mathematics and physics we know, and infinitely more we don't, are at work. It's what keeps us alive, from the atoms that bind me together to the normal force that keeps me from falling into the Earth's core. Every step I take is a force vector. The rock I kick is another set of ridiculously complex relations to the ground. [QUOTE]Beauty is in the mind? So what, a tiger can also see beauty because it has a mind too? What do you even necessarily mean by this? Also you should be careful. The mind and the brain are separate terms for the same thing, which needn't mean the same thing, for a reason.[/QUOTE] Well, we don't know if a tiger has a "mind" as humans do. Humans have the facility of logic and higher reasoning, whereas a tiger is totally bound by instinct and conditioning. It's within the capability to buck the solely primitive urges within us that we become a higher being... and with that, I think we are able to understand and see much more complex things than tigers. From the brain comes the mind. And humans know almost nothing of the mind at this point. [QUOTE]Your little brain is not all that you are. Consider that it's just utterly [i]impossible[/i] for it to keep all the data it has in it all on its own. There is something more to it all merely than just some brain, which processes the information, and some type of "consciousness" which alters this data, and makes it more. If you can step outside of your own mind in so many ways. . .not wholly but as much as is possible. . .then you'd realize beauty is not necessarily in the mind and that also, there's more to the human being than the brain. . .[/QUOTE] Well, at this point everything I'm going to say is mere speculation. But I think the mind is very heavily tied to the brain -- when your brain is damaged, your mind is as well. From within a heavily complex arrangement of synapses and nerve centers comes the mind, but if this 'hardware is damaged, the 'software' can't run. [QUOTE]I am not against science. I am against it when it becomes your religion.[/QUOTE] Science is not my religion. Humanism is as close to religion as I'll get at this point.[/size]

[size=1]My worst nightmares are when I?m running from someone trying to harm me, and no matter how much I strain, I cannot accelerate. It?s like the person pursuing me has a massive gravitational pull. Sometimes they have a gun, others they have a crude weapon (hatchet, sword, knives). And sometimes I have a gun as well, at which point I find a nice bunker and start exchanging fire. Another common theme for my nightmares is running around a convoluted version of my neighborhood, where I don?t know the roads exactly and houses are dilapidated. Oddly enough, these dreams occur in a daytime setting. As for regular dreams, well, they have a very odd plot to them. Most of the time they involve some sort of object I?ve been wanting for a while, or my social relationships are manifest (taking the form of what I think they are, or what I?d like them to be). But these days I rarely remember my dreams due to my really erratic sleep schedule.[/size]

[size=1]Great post, first of all. [quote name='Fasteriskhead'][SIZE="1"]Beauty simply means to experience something as profoundly delightful [i]in itself[/i]. If I suddenly experience the beauty of my daughter, I will never find in the [i]basic experience[/i] anything else behind it (biological necessity, etc.). She's beautiful just because she's beautiful. [/SIZE][/QUOTE] But that?s the thing though. Your daughter?s perceived beauty does not arise from a void ? it?s biological necessity. This is a prime example of an evolutionary process working powerfully to bond you to your offspring. In this vein of thought, I would go on to argue that many, if not all forms of beauty are seen as such because of previous experiences that shape your current ideals of the concept. Newborn infants do not see beauty because they can?t distinguish one form from the other. They have only an inbuilt mechanism that can recognize a crude face and are attached to their mother. Not because she is beautiful, but because it is human instinct to do so. This newborn does not see beauty in a sunset or a rose or charity, but if beauty arose from itself as you suggest, the newborn should be able to acknowledge an object/subject?s beauty. This newborn child grows into a culture and becomes a member of society, complete with their personal experiences and social norms imprinted onto them. With this comes the perception of beauty. Wherever they live, they are taught to value certain symbols (a rose or Mozart in the west would be prime examples) and their sense of beauty thus grows from this. But I do acknowledge the fact that we have a heavily complex mind, and because of this, I cannot adequately explain all instances of finding something beautiful. As a general trend, however, I stand by my argument. [quote name='Copycatalyst'] But is the object beautiful even before it is seen by the subject?[/QUOTE] Absolutely not, because beauty is assessed and measured within the mind. The object is always an object; we only assign value to it after observation. [QUOTE]If we could do this all the time, without distortion of the object. What would we see?[/QUOTE] Well, we would be dead husks if we could do this all the time. Our mind is what ?distorts? these objects, and if we did not have that distortion, that would mean our mind is not functioning. Certainly you admit you cannot look at an object without ?distorting it?. This is true [i]because that beauty is measured within our mind[/i].[/size]

[quote name='Copycatalyst']You're wrong. It's in the I of the beholder if you're going to say that. See my post prior. All is explained there. (Isn't it great how no one listens to what I say!)[/QUOTE] [size=1]You have good points, you just need to make them concise, digestible, and coherent. And hell, you also have a bunch of nonsense tossed in there too. It's like your intention is to talk above everyone -- like you derive some perverse pseudointellectual gratification when no one understands you.[/size]

[size=1]Physical beauty within humans has everything to do with facial proportions and symmetry. There is also a fair deal of subconscious shaping that occurs throughout your life that ends up having an immense impact on your standards. Most psychologists agree that men are attracted to women with hips (increases ease of childbirth), breasts (feeding offspring), and smooth/youthful skin (suggests lack of disease and proper nourishment). Serious deviations from the norm are seen as unattractive, probably because we think the women is incapable of producing a healthy, strong child. As for women, well, they're far more difficult and complex. Height and power (socioeconomic or physical) are general trends to attraction, again linking to ability to provide for offspring. But beauty in a larger sense... it's something humans have been struggling to define forever. It's in the eye of the beholder, really.[/size]

[quote name='Aaryanna_Mom']Now I am going to take to you to task about this bit on pride and honor. Pride and honor are in many ways every bit as stupid as the prejudice being directed towards you and your girlfriend. You mentioned pride for my people, just what does my people mean to you? I sincerely hope you are not talking about being white/black/etc. That's the same reason they are attacking you, implying that your race is not good enough for theirs.[/QUOTE] [size=1]I think that's an overstatement. There is nothing wrong with pride and honor at its purest. All this talk about "Pride goeth before the fall" is absolutely ridiculous. Sure, maybe facing insults with a violent threat isn't the best idea, but when The Boss takes this as a serious and personal affront, is it outrageous to think that he'd want to fight? I don't think anyone's really understanding his situation fully (with the exception of Mitch) by just telling him to turn the other cheek. I personally would verbally confront the person/people and ask what all the hate was about. I'd show them how idiotic they were being, and never acknowledge their presence again. Of course, it's pretty tough to find open minded people in the US south. Flee to the north where the [marginally] more sophisticated people live.[/size]

[size=1]I'm in an interracial relationship, and let me tell you, black males have it pretty badly. Our reputation is only compounded for the worst when your girlfriend is asian. Gotta love that subtle racism. But really, people who think "It aint right" need to wake up and realize we're not living in the 60s anymore. Or take a headdive from a 5 story building. Their choice.[/size]

[size=1]As a quick reference, [url=http://animepa.csusm.edu/galleries/][b]Anime Project Alliance Gallery[/b][/url] is invaluable for scans. I have a massive library of Gundam SEED scans that were pulled from other [pretty old] sites on my old computer. If I'm ever bored enough, I'll see if I can upload a few of them.[/size]

[size=1]Real quick -- [b]please only submit jpg files from here on out.[/b] Those pesky png files aren't rendered the same in different browsers (Des told me so), so we'll be getting rid of them. Thanks! As a fellow artist, I know how crappy it feels when you totally have to scrap a work because of a minor misstep. For that reason, I'll make an exception for you Darren and let your image into the Worm (even if it does have alignment/color deviations). For future reference, everyone, keep your PSD until you're sure you won't need it anymore. A good rule of thumb would be once the person after you has posted theirs without incident, you can trash it. So James, just add onto the end of Darren's.[/size]

[size=1]Do the hex codes match up, or are they totally different? I get the feeling they're totally different. Actually, I'm not even sure how this is happening... if the two's hex codes are the same, there should be no variance.[/size]

[size=1]Again, taken with my 1.3 megapixel camera. I really need my Nikon. :( [url=http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y170/retri_trib/P_00331.jpg]- Nightshot of the condo[/url] [url=http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y170/retri_trib/P_00342.jpg]- View of the sunset at the beach[/url] [url=http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y170/retri_trib/P_00349.jpg]- A light on the metro[/url] [url=http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y170/retri_trib/P_00350.jpg]- An empty car[/url] [url=http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y170/retri_trib/P_00295.jpg]- Capital building rotunda[/url] I look forward to seeing shots from the rest of you. Remember, it doesn't need to be artsy, good, or formal. Things you snap off randomly are perfectly fine.[/size]

[quote name='PhoenixClawth']Curses, is it too late to join this?[/quote] [size=1]Nope. If you want to sign up, just say "I call next" and I'll put you on the list (see first post, first page). I love you participate![/size]

[QUOTE=Keyblade Wielder][COLOR=DarkSlateBlue][SIZE=1][FONT=Tahoma] [CENTER] [URL=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c307/CloudsOnly189/IMG_1811.jpg]Statue of a Woman.[/URL][/CENTER][/FONT][/SIZE][/COLOR][/QUOTE] [size=1]That's Britannia, if I'm not mistaken. It the spirit of the statue's Greco-Roman heritage, I give you a photo of the [url=http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y170/retri_trib/P_00289.jpg][b]US Capitol building[/b][/url] (live). It's rare occasion to get that close post-9/11, but I did because I was with a Senator and his entourage. Being an intern has its perks.[/size]

[size=1]Only thing that really pisses me off about retail is the whole warranty thing. Especially return policies. Even if you have a problem with your product, they'll fight tooth and nail against a return.[/size]

[quote name='Copycatalyst']Also, Ret. I love it. :)[/quote] [size=1]Truth be told, it's fun to read your posts. There are usually some interesting ideas there, at least from what I can discern. Unfortunately, you also ramble and lose focus. Good times though.[/size]

[size=1]Why do you two care about his sense of style?[/size]

[QUOTE=Dagger]You mean.... [i]you don't[/i]? ~Dagger~[/QUOTE] [size=1]Hey Dagger, could we see a picture of you? C'mon, we [collective] promise no one will stalk you.[/size]

[QUOTE=Copycatalyst]It's different from high school because you're paying for it. And it's much more of a business than an education. And that's about all. It's worth it, though, so you can get that little piece of paper that says you went into debt (if you're middle class and didn't get scholarships) and when you have that piece of plant cells, there's nothing they can do; that cellophane is your ticket into the societyvein. If our society had its head on straight it would instead pay people to learn, learn, and endlessly learn. But it doesn't have its head on straight so we all know this isn't how it is. We all know that if we embraced that we weren't walking Darwintrons and actually decided, hey, despite all labels, or origins, we're still of the origin of human being, then maybe it wouldn't be such an every-man-for-himself herd-mentality system where you have to fight tooth and nail to not be crucified for just existing as who you are. But seeing as our society, and government, and America as it stands today has forgotten most of what the forefathers even said, and says it is all about "freedom, democracy, and liberty" (especially when they don't even know what they're saying when they say it and you don't know either but it eat it up like vomited paradise)--we all know those are pretty shattered in many ways. This isn't to say America isn't one of the highest places to live, or that it's some 3rd world country. But it sure makes itself a 3rd world country in its valuations of its people and how its entire system functions. I have only one last thing to say. It's pretty sad when we've made money of more worth than a human being. When a human being is secondary to paper, dead plant cells--cellophane. Well, you know, I know what has worth and value--and it isn't avarice, and it sure isn't some money, issued by fiat decree. It's my fellow human beings, their personalities, their quips and quirks, and the beauty of synchronicity--of coming together, as a people, and not acting like we're some United States of America when we know that's BS--we know the civil war is like the cold war within America's own soil, or that the War on the Youth happens by us taking them for so many pennies they have, of what little they have--we know the War on Drugs is just a sham in light of valid, scientific fact. We know that America is at war against itself, and it's high and mighty on its twisted idealism of what the forefathers even meant. We know we're all just human beings. But who wants to truly realize that, and bridge the gaps which schism and separate us and will be our undoing lest they change? The few who have tried are gone. Jesus? John Lennon? JFK? Malcolm X? Martin Luther King, Jr.? We killed them all. Now we've got some capitalistic education system running our children. And we wonder why they're so dispirited and violent. I mean, ask yourself: why are there school shootings? It has to be something more than Marilyn Manson or violent video games. Let's consider this. [i]It's not violence that is killing our children, it's that we're killing our children with the violence of our ignorance.[/i] You're born middle class? That means you're supposed to stay middle class. It's how the caste system works; we're free and have so much equality, yet can't even give each other economic equality. We're free, and we're all about learning, and we're all about growing, as long as it's a [i]status quo[/i]. People need to open their eyes. Something needs to change. Or it'll change by us losing everything mankind has ever garnered through the centuries of its existence on this Earth. They call people like me liberal, or commie, or pinko, or leftist, or progressive. I still call myself a human being. As human as you are right now. Maybe even more human because I'm not blind to the injustice, and pain, this society gives to many, for the ability for a few to be happy at the height of the powerstructure. All we have is a Master-Slave-Morality, plain and simple. All we have now is a caste system. Plain and simple. Our government right now is brimming on just being an oligarchy, and it's pretty far from being a democracy in many ways, not even a representative one. I don't know about you, but George Bush and almost all the people in our legislature do not represent what I have to say period. I know I may be kind of off-topic, but all the things I'm talking about are pretty related. Government decides how the education system runs. That's where that's related. But yeah, I went into a bit more of a general way about it, and I'm talking about America since that's where I live. If I'm a bit too off-topic perhaps you'll forgive me and just hear what I had to say there. If not you know, you can just skip what I've said like everyone skipped what Jesus even really said, or any and all men who have died for what they knew were.[/QUOTE] [CENTER][IMG]http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y170/retri_trib/mitchlolz.jpg[/IMG][/CENTER]

[quote name='Lunox][color=dimgray']I'll tell you this, though. College fairs are useless if you're not prepared for them. Single out several colleges and research them, and then write down all the questions you have before you go. If you go to a fair and just look around, it's the biggest waste of time ever (because it happened to me).[/color][/quote] [size=1]Aw c'mon. College fairs are useless no matter what. Research the school, talk to current students and alumni. Anything is better than the pristine, marketed, pre-packaged version of the college they sell at those fairs. I just urge you to keep things in perspective. Don't freak out about SATs or applications even when it's tempting to do so. Don't let the application process rule your life. Plan ahead, keep your head screwed on tight, and you should be good. Your parents are panicking unnecessarily, lol. Oh, and don't forget to enjoy your senior year![/size]

[size=1]Alright. The information was pulled from The Boss in an interview, so pardon the inaccuracy. I didn't totally remove it, but I made it more accurate. I think it's important that The Boss' perspective (and MAMA/Viva as whole) was given a voice, false though it may be.[/size]

[QUOTE=DeadSeraphim][COLOR=Indigo][SIZE=1][FONT=Arial][B]Method 1: Be a serious jerk.[/B] This method involves selling your sense of humour, having a one word screenname (names starting with 'R' with some vaguely authoritive conotations are a good bet) and posting in a small font. If you take this route, you're never allowed to join in on any humourous threads and you're gonna have to overreact to trolling in such a severe manner that you end up looking like an arsehole instead of the troll - it's cool though, cause people will expect that from you. You're on a grand crusade against the trolling menace, and if anyone gets caught in the crossfire, they know that this is war, and there will be casualties. RPing at a rate of a million RPs per minute will also help. You will have a great chance at becoming a mod this way. [I]Your mentors[/I]: Sandy, Retribution, Neuvoxraiha.[/FONT][/SIZE][/COLOR][/QUOTE] [size=1]I know you're making a statement, but I can't help laughing at it. I love you too, Dead.[/size]

[size=1][b]@ Sandy:[/b] You need to post a response to Silla's diplomatic envoy before I can post anything else. Thanks.[/size]