Sell Out!

[Manic Webb]

There's one phrase I really don't like to hear when it comes to music. Certain artists are labeled "sell-out" as soon as they do something that no other artist in that genre thought of. And as soon as their career dies, all of the people who called them sell-outs start to do the exact same thing. (hypocrisy, anyone?)

MC Hammer was called a sell-out for doing television commercials. Now every rapper does it.
Santana was called a sell-out for bringing new/recent artists into his "Supernatural" album. Now what's this I hear about Willie Nelson doing a song with a rapper?

Limp Bizkit was called a sell-out group as soon as they took over MTV's TRL.

Nelly furtado said "you liked me til you heard my s**t on the radio."

These are my questions:
Do you believe an artist can sell-out?
If yes, who are some sell-outs you can name?
Why are they sell-outs?

[wrist cutter]

I so agree with you... I'm so tired of hearing that term... just listen to them if you like them... not if you don't agree with their reasons for creating the music.

[Semjaza]

The only time I think sellout is a correct term is in reference to a band that completely changes it's look, lineup or sound, not for innovation, growth or evolution, but simply to sell more records or get popular. I honestly cannot even think of any one band that has done this. So I think it's WAY overused.

Another word I think is used [i]way[/i] too much is poser.

[wrist cutter]

On top of that, you never really know the band's motivation for their change anyway. I could give examples but nobody cares.

[James]

[color=royalblue]I don't care about "selling out" as such. If a band wants to slap their label on a T-shirt and make more cash...good on 'em.

What I don't like is hypocracy. Take Eminem for instance.

Just about all of his video clips and such have knocked people like Britney Spears and various boy-bands as being a commercial tool and nothing more.

And guess what...now Eminem is making a movie! o_O

I don't care for his music regardless, but Eminem's whole "rebel against the mainstream" mentality rubs me up the wrong way...because he himself has demonstrated that he's quite the commercial marketing tool.

So, once again, that on its own doesn't bother me. I don't care if people want to do that. But please...don't claim to be holier-than-thou and fight for something you believe in, when clearly, you're only turning around and doing the very thing you claim to hate.[/color]

[Rancid]

[COLOR=blue]There are a lot of sell-outs I can name, I won't name them all cause I don't have the time, I'm not against the slapping their name on a t-shirt and selling it, I'm against bands that take money and turn their back on the fans they had when they were not-so-well-known just to have more money,cars,bitches, and all those other material possesions.

Bands that change their sound to get more money just make me sick. [/COLOR]

[Guest Matt]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Rancid [/i]
[B][COLOR=blue]There are a lot of sell-outs I can name, I won't name them all cause I don't have the time, I'm not against the slapping their name on a t-shirt and selling it, I'm against bands that take money and turn their back on the fans they had when they were not-so-well-known just to have more money,cars,bitches, and all those other material possesions.

Bands that change their sound to get more money just make me sick. [/COLOR] [/B][/QUOTE]

[color=red][b]Well, people like to make money. Don't tell me that if you were in a popular band, and you know that you could make a ton more money if you just changed how you sounded, that you wouldn't do it. Everyone would do it. Bands are not making music for "the fans", they are doing it for themselves to make money. People label Blink 182 as sell-outs, but I have always liked them. I don't care if they changed how they sound. They have not "turned thier back on their old fans". [/b][/color]

[wrist cutter]

The point with a band is that they should be able to become popular by doing what they do, rather than copy the flavor of the month and reap the benefits that way...

Bands are people too though... they have to pay bills, buy food and clothes, etc. When you have a band, the money you earn is divided by 3/4/5 whatever... and a lot of the money goes to your label and such as well. You have to be a big act in order for you to have any sort of nice car at all, let alone multiple ones.

[Manic Webb]

Look at TLC. They sold over 10,000,000 records with their album "Crazy Sexy Cool" and filed bankrupcy. I believe each member of the group was left with [i]barely[/i] enough money to buy a car for each of them.

By the way, how exactly do you turn your back on your old fans? Do you stop writing them...?

[Rancid]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Endymion [/i]
[B]By the way, how exactly do you turn your back on your old fans? Do you stop writing them...? [/B][/QUOTE]

[COLOR=darkblue]By changing your sound. If you play rock n roll then all of a sudden a huge record deal comes along but you have to change your sound to country. I know I wouldn't listen to you.[/COLOR]

[Manic Webb]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Rancid [/i]
[B][COLOR=darkblue]By changing your sound. If you play rock n roll then all of a sudden a huge record deal comes along but you have to change your sound to country. I know I wouldn't listen to you.[/COLOR] [/B][/QUOTE]

You mean people actually do that? I thought they just did that in the movies and real people had more integrity than that.

Curse my faith in humanity...

[vegeta rocker]

The sad stupid fact is that once something becomes popular it isn't cool anymore. Which is a stupid philosophy what band wants to worry if they should try to reach out to as many music fans as possible. Some people call Korn a sell out personally i dont't see how they could. they suck so bad.

[Kent]

I personally believe phish sold out.

Not for the reasons everyone else gives, but because their whole "scene" went from being about awesome music, to being about the drugs in the parking lot and the fanboys competing over who knew more trivial crap about the band.

As for any other sell outs, I dont really think about it, because I dont have friends. So instead of hear what others think, I just listen to the music myself.

If its good, then I listen. If its bad, then I dont.

Doesnt matter to me, when it came out or what place it is, if any, on the billboards. (although, 98 percent of my music has never seen a billboard. except touch of gray made like number 9 back in 80 something.)

So, yea, the term sell out is weak, its really just a way for people who have attitude to act like they are cool and were/are bigger fans than others.

[Guest Morph]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Endymion [/i]
[B]You mean people actually do that? I thought they just did that in the movies and real people had more integrity than that.

Curse my faith in humanity... [/B][/QUOTE]

[size=1] Yeah, it happens. Here, lets take one band out of many that I know of that are categorized "sell out." [b]Sum 41[/b], plain and simple. They started off great. With their hit single "Fat Lip." Then all hell broke lose and they lost their sound, same with [b]Blink 182.[/b] They were a good band, and then they had like a money deal or something I guess. Well soon after, they lost their touch and many of their fans.

I guess that people care more about money/record deals then the fans. But if you think about it, the fans buy the CDs, they get money, but if they don't they lose money. But sometimes their new music attracts people to it.

But its all on a personal preference, all of my friends that listen to punk think what I said is true...[/size]

[Semjaza]

Sum 41's last album was also totally rushed. In addition to that. sometimes once you are signed, labels muscle you into doing things you don't want to do. It happens, and a lot of smaller bands can't do jack **** about it. It seems as though Sum 41 is trying to get their old sound back, based on the tiny bit of the new album I've heard.

I always thought Blink 182 was rather crappy, so I couldn't care less what they did lol.

And either way. I do not think this is comparable. These bands were both a type of punk at first (or whatever you like to call their genre), and now they are basically just a crappier pop-punk. How does anyone think that's simliar from doing country and switching to straight out rock (which was the suggestion Endymion was speaking about anyway)?

For all we know these bands were just destined to be like this no matter what happens. Bands change, people change... I can't expect bands to do exactly what I want to. As soon as they start doing what the fans want, and not what they want, it's no longer art... It's just pandering.

Total and complete selling out is another story, and I personally do not think either of those bands fit in that category... no matter how much I may be annoyed by their actions.

[Guest Morph]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by vegeta rocker [/i]
[B]The sad stupid fact is that once something becomes popular it isn't cool anymore. Which is a stupid philosophy what band wants to worry if they should try to reach out to as many music fans as possible. Some people call Korn a sell out personally i dont't see how they could. they suck so bad. [/B][/QUOTE]

[size=1] Are you on drugs? o_o;; KoRn is one of the best bands I know there buddy, why would people call them sell outs? I mean, they always had the same sound throughout most of their music. I mean sure, overtime some older songs are better then the newer songs. But what can I say? It happens...

But I do agree that when bands become nothing into a huge band [Example: Sum41] they become sell outs, change their music to the way the producers want. All they care about is the money.[/size]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Semjaza Azazel [/i]
[B]Sum 41's last album was also totally rushed. In addition to that. sometimes once you are signed, labels muscle you into doing things you don't want to do. It happens, and a lot of smaller bands can't do jack **** about it. It seems as though Sum 41 is trying to get their old sound back, based on the tiny bit of the new album I've heard.

I always thought Blink 182 was rather crappy, so I couldn't care less what they did lol.

And either way. I do not think this is comparable. These bands were both a type of punk at first (or whatever you like to call their genre), and now they are basically just a crappier pop-punk. How does anyone think that's simliar from doing country and switching to straight out rock (which was the suggestion Endymion was speaking about anyway)?

For all we know these bands were just destined to be like this no matter what happens. Bands change, people change... I can't expect bands to do exactly what I want to. As soon as they start doing what the fans want, and not what they want, it's no longer art... It's just pandering.

Total and complete selling out is another story, and I personally do not think either of those bands fit in that category... no matter how much I may be annoyed by their actions.[/B][/QUOTE]

[size=1] Well SA, you do have a valid point. They were punk with their first few albums, [Except for Sum41, it was only [b]Fat Lip[/b].] But also, as you said, you can't get a band to please you indirectly or in a crowd. They do want they want to do, although sometimes they may of regret it, but they are happier doing things their way. My friend heard one of Sum41's new songs, he said it was okay and it was worth listening to. I'll be the judge of that when I ask him the name of the song tomorrow.

As for the question of a country band going to rock, I don't think that happens often. Jeeble, country music is totally different then rock. Then they would need like a drummer too. It would be hard to find one, then get used to him, then practice, AND THEN produce a song or albums.

[b][color=red] Post 666!!! Burn me!!! *Disturbed-like grunt*[/b][/color][/size]

[Manic Webb]

I've thought about it, and I've noticed some bands and groups and such that change their sound a little bit from album to album, but how do we always know they did it for money? What if an artist changes their sound just because they want to do something different? (There are some people who call this "growth")

Let's say my dad finally gave me those guitar lessons I asked for a year ago and I become a really good accoustic guitarist. My first album sounds something like The Monkees, but then my second album sounds more like Nelly Furtado (yes, she plays the guitar) because I'm into both types of music. What does that mean to my fans?

I'm not saying all bands do this, I'm just theorising that a few of them might.

[Semjaza]

I've always been annoyed that Madonna changing her sound to fit in to something is called "reinventing" and if anyone else does it, it's just called "selling out." Double standards I guess lol.