The Matrix

[Flash]

Wow.

Just. Wow.

Reloaded left my mouth watering and wanting more. I can't wait for Revolutions November release.

It was... So amazingly confusing (even for me ;)). Certain parts of it [spoiler](Such as Neo's conversation with 'The Architect')[/spoiler] made MGS2 look like a picture book. I wonder how many 'average movie-goers' understood it... :P

[eleanor]

::reads Final Flash's post and sprays soda everywhere::
Woah, you really liked it, eh? I personally thought it was a HUGE dissapointment. Yeah, it was a good movie compared to the other new releases, but compared to the first one....erg.

First. Maybe I have no idea of how hard it is to make CG scenes like ones in the Matrix Reloaded, but I HATE the CG. I don't know if they were using the finest technology or what, but it wasn't good. Neo's trenchcoat looked like bended iron.
Second. I thought the lovey-dovey scenes were bad, and [spoiler] after Neo and Trinity had sex, that scene was corny. [/spoiler] I think the scene that I hated most was when [spoiler] Neo reached into Trinity and magically brought her back to life. He reminded me of Jesus.[/spoiler]

I didn't think it was too confusing, but I had to really pay attention to the part [spoiler]Neo and the architect were talking.
[/spoiler] One part I enjoyed was the part when [spoiler] Trinity rode the motorcylce on the freeway[/spoiler].

I think the part of when [spoiler] Neo fighted the multiple Agent Smiths was complete crap. Neo was like God or something. He beat them up like they were clay figures. Not too mention that they did looks like Clay figures whenver Neo grabbed one and threw him into the crowd. [/spoiler]

I also didn't like the fact that the Control room of Zion was incredibly WHITE. It practically killed my eyes since were sitting in the second row because my friend forgot her friggin' glasses.

EDIT: Too many slow-mos. I'd like to take back the thing I said about how crappy the graphics were. I guess they were okay.

[SSJ Gotenks ok]

I watched reloaded yesterday and i got to say damn tha was a good movie!It was way better than the first one i personally think.I enjoyed the fights and storyline even if i got lost a few times.And the sfx were just awsome!And i was so stuck on the movie that when the end came up and said to be concluded i was extremely mad!!:mad: I guess i'll have to wait :( so the next one comes out. In november right?

[Arkadyz]

[size=1][i][color=limegreen]Yeah i could def. see quite a few of the audience didnt really understand alot of the movie(Mostly the ones that went only expecting a "kick-***' action movie :rolleyes: )

I liked the control room for zion personally(you all do know that that was in the matrix right? and not in the "real" zion?)[/color]

[spoiler]Im not sure why people have a problem with neo bringing trinity back to life..It was to demonstrate he has a great deal of control over the matrix...He simply reached in and restart her heart reviving her "digital" self...[/spoiler]

[color=limegreen]Well anywayz i look forward to when i can buy them all on dvd together...And i really gotta get the animatrix DVDs :D [/i][/size][/color]

[Sara]

[size=1]I really liked it, heh.

I still stand by my original claim that the entire movie is an excuse for some royally messed up fight scenes....

But, yeah. Wow. It was a really, really [i]good[/i] excuse for some royally messed up fight scenes. ^_^[/size]

[TheShinje]

[size=1][color=darkblue] This movie is going to take me forvever to decipher the philosophical meanings of The Matrix, I read Cloricus' spoiler tag, and I think it sums up pretty well what happens with Neo and the Sentinels.

[spoiler] Poor Morpheus, finding out that Zion is only another "hope giving" matrix, I'm sure Neo will crush it in Revolutions. Or it could end like the Novel 1984, where Big Brother wins! what a shock that would be, Neo loses! I think that would be a huge twist [/spoiler] [/size][/color]

[BabyGirl]

[color=deeppink]I really, really liked The Matrix Reloaded. Much more than the first one, at least. I guess what attracted me to it the most was the [spoiler]underlying love story between Neo and Trinity. Call me a sucker for romance stories, but I thought that it was sorely needed in this movie to appease a larger female audience. Not saying that that was their reason, of course, but I think that the love theme will inevitably attract a larger female audience.[/spoiler]

Isn't it a pain in the *** reading tagged spoilers?

[spoiler]I also loved the tribal dance/rave scene that had cutaways to Neo and Trinity's sexual adventure. You almost have to feel bad for Neo in that situation, poor guy can't keep 'it' going due to haunting nightmare-like visions. Poor Trinity, too ::cough:: :whoops:

Ah, but another great thing was that I saw this movie with my boyfriend and the love scene lead to an amazing time after the movie. It really brought out some sappy tenderness in the both of us:blush:

One last thing, someone may have already brought this up but has anyone noticed the Wachowski brothers' thing with the number 101? Neo's apartment was 101, the floor they went to meet the Meravingian [or however it's spelled] was 101, and they were on freeway 101 during that car chase scene. Bianary code? Significance to the start of something? It's an interesting thing to think about.[/spoiler][/color]

[BlueGender]

[size=1][color=blue]According to Entertainment tonight the movie raked in 45.5 Million Wednesday night and on Thurday. It is pretty much assured now that it will beat Hannibal for the highest grossing R rated movie of all time.

I myself liked the movie alot but I didn't think it was better then the firt one. [spoiler]It started of kind of slow and I felt they spent way to much time in zion.[/spoiler] The action sequences in the movie wer great especially the car chase scene I think it set a new barrior for car chases in the future. I think they are setting up for a huge suprise ending in the third movie I feel like they are giving clues to the fact that here is something bigger but I guess i'll have to wait to find out.[/size][/color]

[James]

[color=#808080] Arkadyz is basically right with most of his reasoning about the movie.

Interestingly, I think that Reloaded makes the series more complex than it was in the first movie. Rather than being a tacked-on sequel, Reloaded significantly expands the entire storyline and provides some major twists.

The conversation with [spoiler]The Architect[/spoiler] was [i]most[/i] interesting. It was my favourite part of the movie, in terms of what it revealed about The Matrix.

Generally, this movie was much more accomplished than the first. Yes, the first third of the movie was kinda slow - it took a while to really get into the meat of the story. But having said that, this movie is worth more than the sum of its parts. I read some reviews and after seeing it myself, I feel that some reviewers underrated it because they didn't understand it - yes, it [i]is[/i] complex if you don't have a good grasp of english and the ability to concentrate on the dialogue.

The girl next to me in the cinema was a classic example of this...she wouldn't shut up and half the time she was like "Oh! I don't get it!"

She didn't get it largely because she wouldn't stop talking. lol

But yeah, very good movie. I'm still impressed by the fact that they are using Sydney without showing anything that is truly recognizable as Sydney (except for the road signs and a few other things). It's clever - and it's somewhat surreal. I'm also impressed by the production levels...I think like the first movie, Reloaded will really help to expand the movie industry down here. Good stuff.

Right now I think this movie deserves 9/10. That'd probably go down half a point with time...but I'm very impressed by the fact that Reloaded isn't a tacked-on sequel. It truly pushes the story into new areas and it doesn't create any erroneous links and such. Very good. ^_^[/color]

[TheDarkOtaku]

I just got back from seeing Reloaded, and I really don't want to get bashed and flamed so I won't say much except it was *cough* pitiful *cough*.

[Omar Harris]

[spoiler]I know I wasn't the only one who noticed this: Zion must have one really big affirmative action policy. lol. Almost every other character you see is either African American or just dark/tan skinned. It's pretty cool but kinda wierd at the same time. lol. j/k

I wonder if the Wachowskis are gonna finish up the Morpheus/Locke/ Niobe triangle. Probably will, and if they do I hope it is at least somewhat interesting.[/spoiler]

[TheShinje]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by TheDarkOtaku [/i]
[B]I just got back from seeing Reloaded, and I really don't want to get bashed and flamed so I won't say much except it was *cough* pitiful *cough*. [/B][/QUOTE]

[size=1][color=darkblue] People won't flame yo if you don't like the movie lol, but like me, they probably want a detailed explanation. Exactly what didn't you like about it? Was there stuff you did like. I like to discuss the Matrix reloaded with people who don't like it as much as I did, it makes for interesting conversationd :D

*this post is in no way represented by the Coalition of Zion, the Nebuchandezzar, or Thomas "The One" Anderson. Such views given in this thread are soely the opinion of one Shinji Ikari, nothing more. [/size][/color]

[ThePikasElbow]

I'm just going to do the whole movie in spoiler tags so I don't have to switch off periodically.

[spoiler]I loved the film. A great set up for Revolutions, which was pretty much the reason this film was made. There were quite a few flaws with it, which I will address now.

First off, the pacing. The first hour or so of it is just political jargon and showing Zion. It reminds me of the Jedi Council debates which flood the new Star Wars movies. I'm all for them showing Zion's political side, but they spent way too much time on it. Also, Neo's character seemed to devolve. At the end of the first movie, he was confident that he was the One, and he was ready to end the Matrix. Now, he is still afraid and doubting, like he was in the first one. Also, I didn't really feel love between Trinity and Neo. I can't remember an action movie that firmly handled the love aspect perfectly, it's just something that plagues many films.

Also, the rave sequence. At first, I thought it was pretty cool since it showed Zion's culture and it obviously showed the Wachowski's fascination with African culture. But after the first few minutes, it just seemed unnecessary. They dragged out the scene way too long. If it was less than two minutes long, it would've had the same impact. Also, the counselor guy talking to Neo about machines didn't contribute anything. He didn't even have a point at all, just an old person rambling.

The pacing was just off during the first half, and there are several scenes throughout that served no purpose and should've been cut out. Also, the fight scenes didn't seem to serve a purpose like they did in the first one.

Now for the good so you all don't think I'm a crazy matrix hater. The action scenes were incredible. Long, complex, and tons of fun. The 100 agents fight was just insane and was one of the coolest fights in any action film ever. There were times when the CGI was really messed up and you could easily tell they were not real. The highway battle was mindblowing and was surely a feat to watch. The chateau fight was also a great surprise, as I didn't expect them to handle sword fighting so well. The fight with Neo vs. Seraph was short, but it was a great fight since they seemed to be nearly even.

The story was also good, but not as quite as complete as the first one. I enjoyed that people didn't agree with Morpheus and Neo being the one. It did a great job paralleling people's thoughts about religion. I loved Agent Smith too. In the first movie, he was just a very badass program with some hints of human characteristics, but now he is a free spirit, seemingly just working for himself. He is just purely driven by emotions, becoming the one thing he truely hates, a human. The cliffhanger at the end was also great and unexpected. There were quite a few story plots that were not explained, like much of what The Architect said, how Neo stopped the machines, and who the mother of the matrix is (although I have a pretty good idea).

So anyways, it was a great movie. It's not one of the greatest movies ever made like The Matrix was however. I expect Revolutions to blow this movie out of the water in terms of story. I don't think it can top the action in Reloaded though, since it seemed to just be fillers.

Oh, and did anyone catch the werewolves, vampires, and ghosts? I thought it was a fun subtlety.[/spoiler]

[Guest Imsirion]

I dislike The Matrix and The Matrix: Reloaded (which I just got back from seeing). I think its hyped up WAY to much. I understand the plot and all while knowing its complex but thats what it felt to me. Boring, complex/understandable,boring mish mash that made me yawn and wish many times it would get over. Everything was drawn out and not that intresting to me. Its hard to explain and i know I must not make much sense, but I dont know how to word it. Oh well. I didn't like the action much either. I know they can do impossible things since their in the "illusion world" and they can manipulate how they do things and whatnot/whatever but it still seemed over-the-top and kinda lame. I wonder if Keanu Reeves knew what what going on since he looked confused the whole time (because it wasn't exactly Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure). I dont know if I'll see Revoultion, maybe, but I wont think about it. Over all,it was boring, unintresting, and dull to me and the best part about the both of them was, um, Hugo Weaving. ;)

[TheDarkOtaku]

All right I'm sorry for not explaining everything before everyone, I was in a lazy mood. :D So, here is my opinion:

*POSSIBLE SPOILERS*


When the movie started, and the action began right from the start, I immediately thought, "Whoah, this is awesome!". Then when it shifted to Zion, I felt let down. The rave scene was almost completely unnecessary except for the fact that I guess the production crew thought it gave depth to the society. I don't think so. I felt it was an excuse to put something suggestive into the film. Then the other scene that made it trashy in a way, was the "cake" incident (you know what I'm saying those who have seen the film.) However, I thought the action scenes were trully mindblowing, even though a bit stretched out. Also the stroy plot, especially at the end, made me start to say this was a great sequel. Of course, it still wasn't worthy enough to be part of the Matrix trilogy in many ways. To finally clear things up, what I meant by pitiful, is that a great sci-fi film such as the first should not have been followed up by this. Hopefully, and probably, Revolutions will be better and improved. So to sum it up, 3/4 stars. :)

[James]

Hm, ThePikasElbow:

[spoiler]I really liked the scene where Neo spoke to the counsellor. I felt that it was quite a telling moment. In a sense, the counsellor [i]was[/i] rambling. But really, he was bringing about some very interesting questions on the symbiosis of man and machine. I actually found that to be quite an interesting sequence - the discussion of the odd relationship between the two.

Also, I feel that The Arhictect revealed a lot of things about the plot. It seems as though maybe you didn't understand what he was saying, which seems to be a common problem among viewers (and partly why people seem to be disliking the movie a little bit). For instance, The Architect made it quite obvious who the mother of The Matrix is - Neo even [i]said[/i] who it is out aloud.[/spoiler][color=#808080]

Imsirion seems to bring up a similar complaint in that sense, as her description of the movie is kinda overly simplistic and I think it's obvious that she doesn't really grasp much of the story at all.

I'm not saying that to be mean/negative or anything - it's just an observation. I've noticed that a LOT of people have misunderstood major aspects of the movie and I think it's hurt their enjoyment of it. The story for this movie is one of the best I've ever encountered and, while Reloaded [i]did[/i] have some useless scenes in the beginning, the story ultimately unfolded in a powerful and seamless way.

I actually found the action to be far less interesting than the story - and I tend to pick up on poor scripts very easily as something I dislike about a movie. So, by the end, I was actually quite surprised at how well they'd pulled off such a complex situation (with so many things to explain).

The ending was interesting, in the sense that it will bring about a very frantic beginning to Revolutions. It really makes me wonder who will win; man or machine. Right now, Neo and his comrades seem to have everything weighing against them.

[spoiler]One thing I really loved was the idea of hope - and how hope was what kept them going. Yet, even the hope was false; it was part of the machines' control. When you lose hope, what happens to you? Do you need hope to survive? What happens when you are slapped in the face by the cold harsh realities of the world you live in? I think there are some [i]huge[/i] parallels with established religion there. And I think that, rather than handling them in a clumsy and obvious fashion, the film makers really handled it in quite a subtle and easy to understand way. [/spoiler]

Anyway, I'm rambling here...but I really encourage everyone who didn't like the movie as much to see it again and perhaps to read some of the summaries about it. I really feel that this movie deserves to be investigated further, because it's [i]not[/i] just a lame excuse for cool effects. I feel that this movie could be masterful without any action at all, which speaks volumes about its weaving storyline.[/color]

[Schrat]

[size=1]Alright guys, I just saw Reloaded for the second time and alot more thins made sense, but a few things are still blurry...

1.[spoiler]At the end, one of the captains was discussing the fall of Zion, did everyoen in Zion die, or was he talking about a ship?
[/spoiler]

2.[spoiler]Neo did'nt set off that EMP did he? I thought it was that agent that went into the real world, whats going on there?[/spoiler]

3.[spoiler] What was the architect talking about when he was saying that Neo had 5 predessesors and all of them had failed because they chose to save Zion, how would they fail then?[/spoiler][/size]

[Arkadyz]

[size=1][color=limegreen][i]Schrat you should go back and read my previous post for the answers to all of those Questions...Im too lazy to quote myself ATM... :p

And james your not rambling i understand what you where saying :cool: [/color]

[spoiler] Yeah the question is what would humanity do if we had no hope...No hope whatsoever...The architect has us believe that we simply refuse to keep living if we dont have hope...Im not sure if thats true or not...Guess will find out in revolutions :therock: [/spoiler]

[color=limegreen]Yeah i think alot of the critics sour reviews comes from the fact that they dont get it either...So they get annoyed at there own lack of perceptiveness and give it a bad review.

Well i loved the film for its philosphy...The same way i loved Evangelion. I like things that screw with my mind and take me a good while before i can begin to understand them (ofcourse im still abit far away from completely understanding eva :demon: )

Well my only hope is that more ppl will understand reloaded after they see revolutions...Heres to hope :toothy:[/i][/color][/size]

[James]

[color=#808080]Yes, I think that the comparison to Evangelion is a very good one.

A [i]lot[/i] of people get turned off by EVA because they don't really understand it - and maybe they don't want to sit down and really think about it on a broader level. I think that Reloaded is very similar in that sense. Maybe people were expecting a simple sequel to The Matrix; I don't know. But clearly, this isn't just a sequel...it's a complete expansion of the story. It's almost as though The Matrix was just a short introduction to the main story (which isn't a negative reflection on The Matrix, but a positive reflection on Reloaded).

Either way, I'm greatly looking forward to Revolutions. ^_^[/color]

[Schrat]

Arkadyz your post helped out alot thanks. Has anyone gotten the Enter the mAtrix game for the console, I got it today and the game is amazing, it truley explains alot more, for instince, where Niobe and Ghost were before they met Morpheus to discuss the Oracle...

[Boba Fett]

[COLOR=green]I have a trivia question about the new movie... lets see who can answer it.

[SPOILER]What is the name of the hovercraft that picks up Neo and the others at the end of the movie?[/SPOILER]

Alright, it's lame, but I have a bet with someone about this...

[/COLOR]

[NorykoAngelcry]

[SIZE=1][COLOR=darkred]Boba Fett: The Hammer if I remember correctly. .

[EDIT] -- Ok, I just read the thread that told how to do the spoiler code, so I edited the thread to reflect it. .

I just got back from watching the movie for the 4th time (Yes, I know I am wierd ^_^), and have been talking about it with my brother for quite some time. I have to say that I was blown away by this movie. Yes, parts were drawn out, and by the third time watching it, I was using the 'rave scene' to get more coke and go to the restroom, but still, I have gotten a lot better understanding about what is going on.

An important bit of information that I wish I would have known about when I first watched it was that it wasn't really a sequel by it's own. My brother made a good point in saying that they should have let people know in the trailers that it was more like the first part of a sequel. Matrix would be movie 1, Matrix: Reloaded would be movie 2-A, and Matrix: Revolutions would of course be movie 2-B. That would have kept me from being a little let down at the end, but nothing I can really do about that besides wait till November =P

[SPOILER]The fight scenes were really great, and though most people probably felt a bit annoyed at the amount of them, I supposethe only problem I had was the Neo vs. the bodyguards fight. It just seemed to go on a bit longer then really necessary. I really did enjoy the fights with Morpheus and Trinity vs. the Agents (yes, both were seperate fights from each other). They really showed that Neo is still the only one that can take them.[/SPOILER]

I will post more about my impressions and thoughts later. [/COLOR][/SIZE]

[Mitch]

[color=gray]I saw it twice this weekend.

[spoiler]This movie was [i]amazing[/i]. It was eloquent, beautiful, powerful, lovely, bitter, sour. It was everything I thought it was going to be, everything I wanted and more; yet, at the same time, it wasn't.

I think the reason why many?like my dad?didn't like this movie as much as the first was simply because of how deep some of things were. How hard they were to figure out.

But that's storytelling, writing, producing, and everything else at its best. To just tell the story, keep rolling, whether you fully tell the reader/ listener what it means. That I love about this movie. How things are so allegorical, yet, at the same time, by just looking at it on the outside and not scratching the movie's surface at all, you can still love it and still know that yeah, there's something great behind this. That yeah, you need to figure out what it is.

Even I don't completely understand some things, and, accordingly, I've assumed some things. But I think I understood it very well. This movie was a great ride. It was bumpy in some parts, though.

Especially the whole scene where Morpheus, like some religious fanatic leader, addressed Zion.

Their reaction was pretty lame. Celebration over their impending doom? It just didn't fit.

Especially the semi-sex scene with Neo and Trinity. That didn't work at all. That's not what love's all about. It's part of what love is?but that's more lust than love. Perhaps that is a part of love, but, to me, it just didn't fit.

That part felt like some corny porno scene from a different movie. The music was like a porno. The celebrating Zionians were like some big, lustful orgy.

Didn't fit at all. I think the scene itself was just too long. I think if it wouldn't have been so overdone then I would've liked that part better.

That's perhaps the only scene that I couldn't stand in this movie. It just didn't fit at all. Didn't make any sense, had nothing, not a damned reason to warrant it.

Otherwise, I thought everything else was extremely well done. Especially the fight scenes. The one where Neo was against all of the Smiths was probably especially my favorite. It was done so well. And the freeway scene as well.

Some of you've said that they overdid the fighting scenes. I don't think they did at all.

It's like a video game? Well, of course. The Matrix isn't real. Neo and the Smiths can defy its rules, go against it. It's supposed to be like that.

Okay. I think I'm going to set some things straight.

Firstly, you'll remember Agent Smith infecting, I think, two people near the beginning. They were carrying a package?from the oracle telling Neo to meet her. It was that chip that Neo was handed. One of the men left the Matrix, and the other stayed. Smith then appeared, and approached the remaining person He copied that one into himself. The newly copied Smith then picked up the ringing phone. Then the Smith entered out of the Matrix.

That was who that one guy that was really cold was. The one that was slitting his hand as Neo was leaving to go in his ship. That was also the survivor they'd found from the destroyed ship that was destroyed by the sentinels. Right at the end, remember? He was lying right next to the passed out Neo.

Another thing. How can Smith copy himself? Well, you'll remember, in the first Matrix, that Neo jumped into Smith, and blew him up. Somehow he survived this, just didn't want to be gone. Didn't want to be deleted. So he came back with a piece of Neo's powers or something. He isn't an agent for the Matrix anymore, and he can clone himself. That's how that part works. That's why there's all those Smiths that fight Neo in the fighting scene I mentioned.

Those two ghost-like brothers that could turn clear and go through things, those were old programs of the Matrix. Just like the key maker, the oracle, and all those people. They're old programs that the Matrix didn't need to have around anymore?that did more bad than good. So many of them were deleted, but some went into hiding. Like the frenchman that liked to swear, and everyone else I just mentioned. That's where they came from.

That makes this movie even more amazing. You don't know who to trust. The oracle's just a program. The key maker's just a program. The architect's just a program perhaps.

You don't know who to trust in this movie. You don't know if what Neo's doing is right?following the orders of The Oracle. You just don't know.

Another thing that was amazing. The whole realization that everything that happens is meant to happen. There's no mistakes. No crashes. No nothing. It's all meant to happen.

Morpheus points this out. So does the frenchman, with his cause and effect thing. And mainly, so does the oracle. And you don't know if you should believe this.

And the architect. Wow. He was especially hard to follow in this movie. He talked like some prudent Einstein or something lol.

Mainly what I got from him was that Neo's not the only "one" there's ever been. He said there've been five or so before Neo.

He also said that each of these one's had to choose two things. Had to make choices. Then when The Matrix was destroyed, these ones would choose new people to settle Zion, and continue everything over again.

He also said that this was the fifth or so time that Zion itself was being destroyed. He also pointed out that there've been many many versions of the Matrix. The first, he said, being perfect.

But humans aren't perfect he also pointed out. So perfection never happened. So these other older versions of The Matrix were destroyed.

The architect then presented Neo with two doors?choices. He told Neo the door to one side was directly to Zion, where Neo could try and stop the machines. He said that if Neo didn't choose this door, then when Zion would fall, then every human also hooked up to The Matrix would be instantly killed. I think that's what he said, not exactly certain, but it was close to that.

The other, of course, led to Trinity.

Now, going along with the entire meaning of this movie. The movie's meaning said that everything had and has a purpose. From the frenchman to the oracle to the architect to Smith. All of these things had meaning, purpose. That's why they're there where they are when they were. It was all predetermined, according to this movie.

So Neo had, subconsciously albeit, chosen that door to Trinity all the way along. He hadn't chose it though, really. The choice was predetermined, it was already picked. As the architect said, choice is only an illusion.

The architect also mentioned that he could feel Neo's response. That he could feel his emotions blocking the logical response, which was to go to the door to Zion, and save the human race. Love was blocking the logical choice. That, he said, is what makes humans so weak.

And as Neo walked over to the door, you'll remember him saying that she's going to die anyways. And that hope is what makes humans so strong yet so weak. And then everything went on from there.

Possibly the most confusing part of this movie was at the end, when they exited the ship as it was destroyed. Neo used his powers outside of The Matrix. The only thing I can assume is there's multiple levels to The Matrix. Either that, or somehow else Neo's able to use his powers outside of The Matrix.

I believe that it having multiple layers is probably the best assumption. Seeing as how the architect said that Zion had been destroyed over and over again, systematically. That tells me that this assumption's a possibility. Considering that the machines could've easily destroyed Zion when they wanted to and that it's happened so many times before. It tells me that that perhaps itself is an illusion to some other layer of the matrix or something. That's only an assumption, though. And as James mentioned, the mother of The Matrix was pointed out to be The Oracle. But I'm not exactly certain if that's true. The architect denied it, James. I'm pretty sure it's true though.

Near the end I do have to admit that that's when the best parts of this movie happened. Especially how unanswered so many things were. From Neo's use of his powers outside of The Matrix, to the downfall of Morpheus's prophecy, to Neo lying right beside the Smith that'd possessed that one person. It leaves a lot of how's and what's going to happen.

I believe that the next movie's going to be even better, with lots of very surprising realizations about the matrix's history and other such things.

All I can say is this movie completely blew me away with all of its deepness. Gets me thinking about things myself, how things are in my life.

From how emotions are what seem to give us purpose and are what rule our lives. To that everything that happens is meant to happen as destiny. How that everything is so human, even the machines. Even Neo. How the machines are what give life and at the same time take it away, just like humans. There's just so many messages from this movie that get me thinking and wondering. And that's what I like from a movie. I like it to convey and weigh in on me for a long time after I've watched it.

At the end of this movie, I don't know who to trust anymore. That itself is amazing. Because usually there's a character you wholly side with. Perhaps that is Neo in this case, but it's hard to say. Neo's still so human. You know that from the beginning all the way to the end. And your mind screams that you should be on Neo's side. But at the same time, you can't believe that things've gone where they have at the end. How Neo seemed so blind by his emotions and by the power and control of the characters he'd met throughout the story. But that in itself, that thought in itself is contradicting the entire meaning of this movie. Well, the one meaning that's mostly put out. That everything has a purpose and a destiny and that everything's already set out to be what it's to be.

Thinking that it's wrong the way things've gone fro Neo, how he took and did everything that he was told leaves a bitter taste in my mouth. But at the same time you know that it was all meant to be. Or so Morpheus said. And the frenchman said. And the oracle said.

You don't know who to trust. You don't know if it's true that everything is destined. I personally don't really believe that, but this point of destiny was so beaten in this movie that you kind of end up having to believe it to understand and give some reason to why things are like they are at the end of the movie.

The characters are so mysterious and uncertain as well as imperfect. It really makes them seem like real characters. Perhaps that's why it's so hard to trust them, because they're all just so human. There's not one that really stands out over the other in the respect of believing them. Other than Neo, of course. He's been the hero-like character from the beginning of the first movie. But there's just no one you know for certain to trust.

It's that feeling of uncertainty, of unknowing where things are going to go that make this movie so great and that makes waiting for the next movie even that much more harder. [/spoiler]

I cannot wait for November to roll around and Revolutions to come out.[/color]

[James]

[color=#808080]I basically agree with everything you said, Mitch.

Although, [i]nobody[/i] seems to understand what the rave scene was about. I heard a guy on Fox News can the entire movie because of that one scene.

[spoiler]The rave scene was not about celebrating impending doom - nothing of the sort. The rave scene was a kind of metaphor. In this case, mankind fears the machines that are burrowing down toward Zion. But, as Morpheus pointed out, fear is the only thing holding the human race back from achieving its ultimate victory against the machines.

And so, you'll remember that Morpheus spoke about "letting them hear us". That's what the rave was - it was symbolic of the idea that Zion can shake its fear and can send a clear message to the machines; you won't destroy us and you won't ruin our way of life.

As far as the Neo/Trinity love scene...some of the responses to that are so ridiculously prudish. lol

It was [i]hardly[/i] explicit. I mean, god...it showed Neo's butt. It didn't even show Trinity's breasts. I wish people would get over themselves. lol The scene wasn't particularly wonderful, because I don't think it expressed much about the characters' love...it could have been done in a more beautiful way. Instead, it came off as being "just a quickie". lol So I think that hurt it.

And, in regard to the mother of The Matrix. I believe that when Neo guessed who the mother was, The Architect made some comment which was kind of like saying "I knew you were smart enough to figure it out" or something. He even had that nasty little grin, as though he was deriving pleasure from seeing Neo work things out for himself.[/spoiler]

Generally, I think that the reaction to Reloaded is a LOT like the reaction to A.I. A lot of people canned it because it was too deep. It requires audience participation in a sense - it requires you to think and analyze for yourself. Yes, some things are blatantly blurted out for you. But a lot of things are done in a subtle way - which is probably better than EVERYTHING being done in an overly obvious sense.

With A.I., people who canned it could never seem to see the beauty laying underneath - the subtle artistry that held everything together. While Reloaded is probably more complex than A.I. in some ways, I think the comparison holds true in this area.

I'm really glad to see your post Mitch - to see that you can connect with what was laying underneath. I'm not saying that people can't dislike the movie, but often, people seem to be disliking it for overly trivial reasons. If you can appreciate its depth, you're more likely to enjoy it.[/color]

[Mitch]

[size=1][font=rockwell][color=gray] I kind of figured that out the second time I watched it. About that rave scene and all. All I can say is it could've been done [i]a lot[/i] better. Especially Trinity and Neo's scene.

It just didn't fit with everything else in the movie. And celebrating over impending doom just doesn't exactly seem logical in [i]my mind[/i]. I would be in a panic if I knew I was going to die lol. I certainly wouldn't be celebrating.

But yeah, the metaphor is quite pronounced now that I think about it. But I still don't think it should've been [i]celebration[/i]. It should've shown anger and hate and [i]emotion[/i]. That, to me, would make it make even more sense in my mind. Because emotions are what controls us as humans so much, and so on. Beh.

Thanks for clearing that up more in my mind, Jeh. I'm glad you're glad that I posted. This stuff I eat up, though. Allegory is wonderful.[/size][/font][/color]