The Matrix

[Schrat]

[size=1] Hey guys I found this philosophy about the matrix on another board and i thought I'd share it with you, it makes ALOT of sense, if you put two and two together...

[spoiler]In most simplest terms here, I think I figured out what's going on.

The computer realm of "The Matrix" has been around, since its induction, for X amount of years. There has only been one physical Matrix computer system, like your own computer, but it has had version upgrades in those X amount of years. Right now it's on version 6, because as the Archetech had said, there were 5 previous "The Ones" before Neo. And if Neo had gone through the Source door, then the system would have been upgraded to version 7.

So why the version upgrades? Why would any piece of computer software be upgraded? It's to weed out any bugs and errors and perfect the system. For the same reason why I'm using Mac OS TEN, which has been the tenth upgrade of the Macintosh operating system.

The bugs in the system are the Zionites, the people who rebel the system. And "The One", which in Version 6 of the Matrix is Neo, is the big bug. Once one of these big bugs is discovered, then the machines determine that a major system upgrade is necessary.

But this can only mean that Zion and all of its inhabitants are... still pluged into the Matrix. Simply put, Zion is the Matrix's "Trash Can". All the errors are dumped there and eventually purged. And when they're purged, the system is upgraded in order to take into account for all the flaws in the previous version. Meaning that the ultimate goal of the machines is to create a perfect-for-humans environment where NO HUMAN will ever be able to rebel.

Still on the same page? This means that everyone you've seen in the movie is still in the Matrix. None of them has actually really left the thing. Everyone only THINKS that they've left, but this is because the Matrix has allowed them to think this. Much in the same way Neo at one time lived a life as "Mr. Anderson". This is why Neo was still able to short out the Sentinals; he still has his "The One" powers because he's still in the Matrix.

But because everyone is still in the Matrix, I'm not sure if Keanu Reeves is human or not. Remember in the Archetech scene where all the different Neo's were saying "bull****!" when the Archetech mentioned that there were 5 other "The Ones"? That could just be the Archetech ****ing with Neo (and our) heads, or maybe all 6 "The Ones" were Keanu Reeves. And because it might be all Keanu Reeves, he may be a program. Or maybe more like a document of a program; a manifestation of new knowledge that the machines don't know about humans, and that document is eventually installed into the Source.

Now A=B and B=A. The only way Keanu Reeves is can be program/document (A) is if the Machines haven't totally grasped human thought (b). Which is why all these version upgrades are necessary. But we do know that the machines haven't fully understood human thought (B), even the Archetech said so. This can only mean there is some sort of file inside the Matrix that has recorded new information on humans, which eventually is installed into the Matrix and the system is upgraded. Could Keanu Reeves be that file (A)?

As for Agent Smith, he's not just a bug in the system, but a virus. However Smith is another thing that the machines didn't take into account, or have no protection against (much like how the Melissa virus infected computers). Which is why he's able to replicate himself like he can.

Mind you, each version upgrade happens later and later than the previous one. Apperently it has been 100 years since the previous version upgrade from version 5 to version 6. Version 4 to Version 5 could have been 50 years. V3 to V4 might have been 25 years. And so on. This can only mean that Neo and company are actually in the year... oh... 2499 something, and not 2099 as previous assumed.

Get it? So to sum it up:

* Everyone thinks they've left the Matrix. But in absolute 100% truthful positive reality, they're still hooked up to it. The "real world" is just another fabrication of the machines, and is still very much a part of the Matrix. Which is why Neo was still able to use his powers while "outside" of the Matrix.
* Zion was set up my the Matrix's programers to the Matrix's trash can. Every so often when it gets full, Zion is "emptied".
* The Matrix is currently at Version 6, and if Neo passed through the Source door (which he didn't), it would have emptied the trash and upgraded the Matrix to version 7.
* Before each version upgrade, the Machines gain more understanding about how humans worked. And then a new version of the Matrix is installed to take into account the new knowledge the machines have learned.
* Keanu Reeves may or may not be a program/document created by the Matrix in order to record information on human behavior. So once all that could be learned is learned, the file is installed into the source and the Matrix is upgraded. However since programs can rebel (we know that, it has been said), there's nothing saying that Neo decided to rebel by going into the other door.[/spoiler][/size]

[ThePikasElbow]

I'm not so sure about that. Here's how I perceive it:

[spoiler]Ok, we all know this is the sixth Matrix it seems, since the archetect said that there were five before him, and they all failed. They all chose to start over, and not to save their love. Neo, however, chose to save her, leaving the fate of Zion in the devil's hands it seems. Everyone who was freed in the previous matrices died, and everyone in their pods most likely just got their memories altered, as if nothing happened at all. Therefore, the process starts all over again. There are two theories:

The rebellion is planned out by The Archetect. It is designed to give humans something they hope for, and when they get close to bringing down the Matrix, Zion is destroyed and they start all over again due to the One's decision.

Or...

The rebellion is inevitable. It will happen no matter what, it is fate. Fate that will most likely lead to the downfall of The Matrix. The Archetect then sets up a situtation like the one Neo faced (because he is afraid The Matrix will fall), choose between two sides. But this time, he chose something different. This will then eventually lead to the downfall of the Matrix, and everyone's realization that he is the true one, the one who was destined to save mankind, not the others in the previous forms of the matrix.

I really hope it's not a matrix inside a matrix thing. That would be so cliche and boring. I would rather have the Wachowskis spice it up a bit and not go too far out.[/spoiler]

[Manic Webb]

OY!

I finally saw the movie today. Of course, it took me so long to see it that everybody has pretty much said everything. I liked the movie, the fights did seem to go on a little too long, and I think that most people who say they don't like it really just didn't understand it. I remembered how ungodly complicated the first movie was, and how I had to see it several times to finally understand it.

When I went to see Reloaded, I was ready to have the hell confused out of me! I kept an open mind, and tried to listen to underlying themes. Once two characters got together for a conversation, I knew some theme was going to come up that would repeat itself or allude to something later on in the movie. The key themes for this movie? Choice and control!

I remember 2 conversations especially...
[spoiler]When Neo talked to the chancellor in the engine room of Zion, the Chancellor went on to talk about control; about how man and machine control one another. They need each other, so it's nearly impossible to tell which one has the control.
This came up later on, like when Neo was talking to the Architect.

Another conversation I found interesting was Oracle's talk about programs. She said that some programs refuse to be deleted, and how every sighting of a ghost or angel or vampire or monster was really a program slipping up and trying to stay alive. Low and behold, Smith appears not 5 minutes later! A little later, Persephone introduces to werewolf brothers (one she shoots with a silver bullet).

I was kind of frustrated when a friend of mine called Link the "token black guy." I asked him what movie he was watching, because the Matrix Reloaded [i]I[/i] saw had the characters Morpheus, Niobe, that one commander, and about a hundred thousand dark-skinned ravers in Zion.

Aaliyah (rest her soul) died before filming the movie, which is unfortunate. However, she was only going to play Link's wife (Zee). When she died, her role was hyped up like she was going to be Niobe or something.[/spoiler]

All in all, I liked it. I think I'll watch it again, just so I can catch a lot of stuff that I missed. After reading a lot of your theories, I think watching it again would be good.

[Jesus Chicken]

I thought it was brilliant. I thinks it's just as good as the first movie, and thats one of my favourite movies of all time.

Now, I'll just voice my opinons on a couple of things.
[spoiler]I'm pretty sure the Architect denied that the Oracle was the mother of the Matrix outright. I also believe in Cloricus' theory that Zion is part of the Matrix, and thats why Neo could feel the Squiddies, and thats why he could zap 'em.
In respsonse to people saying they didn't like Neo brining Trinity back to life, it was just him reaching inside her, and pumping her heart, hence the screaming in pain thing, they just used the matrix code as a means to make it less explicit.
The fight scenes, were brilliant. I loved the Neo Vs Agent Smiths, and was suprised at the realism of some of the stuff. Also I was glad they brought weapons into some of the stuff, as it opens up a new way of combat, that the first movie didn't really cover.
Another thing that impressed me about the movie was the fact that because of the AI, the machines, and programs were developing opinions, and deciding for themselves whether they would fight for the humans of the machines. This too, is something that the first movie didn't cover, but sometthing this one did, and it gives greater depth to the world of the matrix.
I was also very suprised that it wasn't all that cartoony graphics, that they show you a few shots of in the preview.
I'm pretty sure Tank is dead, as whatshernamey talks about having lost two brothers to the ship, and they were her brothers, go figure.
The twins are so unbelievably cool, and no other character holds a candle to either of them in my opinion.
I didn't expect as much humour in this movie, but when they started cracking jokes, on a few occasions, it made the movie all the more enjoyable.
The only thing I didn't like was the love stuff, it was much too disconnected, and I could see the point of it, but it could have been done much better.[/spoiler]

See it, and decide for yourself.
9\10

[NorykoAngelcry]

[COLOR=darkred][SIZE=1]There have been a lot of good points, and a bunch of varied opinions tossed out there. Some I agree with, others, I don't. . . let's get to it, shall we?

[spoiler]I agree with JesusChicken about the Oracle not being the 'mother of the Matrix' It really seemed that the Architect scoffed at the idea that she was, well, the mother. . I have a few other reasons why I don't think that she is, but who knows. .

Another comment I want to touch upon would be the Neo/Trinity love scene. Someone mentioned that it seemed like just a 'quickie' I laughed when I read that, but in honesty, that is exactly what it was! Think of it from the view of a soldier (as both Neo and Trinity are). They are constantly out of Zion, the 'safe-haven' to all humans. Z yelled at Link in Zion that their ship stays out longer then almost every other ship. So, thinking of it like that, you have to imagine how hard it would be for Neo and Trinity to have any. . alone time? When constantly on the alert for sentinal attacks, and dodging in and out of the Matrix, freeing who knows how many people from the Matrix - There really wouldn't be too much time for . . quickies ^_^ So when Neo heard that they had 25-30 hours, he said, "Some people go their whole lives with out hearing news that good." So while it may have seemed a bit misplaced in a huge action movie, it does show that they love each other, and any time together is great. . .

What else. . *thinks*. . Ahhh, the Matrix in a Matrix. My brother and I touched upon that, and while it seems very obvious, both of us agree that we would hate that idea. The main reason, is that they only have one movie to put that idea into play. I just see putting that type of story into play would take far too much time then allowed for such a short movie, especially with everything else that they are going to have in it (including the Neo vs. Smith showdown, as well as the defense of Zion, just to name a few). . . [/spoiler]

Overall, the movie really makes you think, and if you don't really pay attention to the key moments, you miss out a lot! I am not saying I am 'right' on anything I am saying here. . . I could be wrong about everything. . but that is just my opinion.

I think after watching it for the fifth time today, I happily give the movie: a 10 out of 10[/SIZE][/COLOR]

[Arkadyz]

[spoiler][size=1][i]Well i would like to go along with the "matrix in a matrix" theory but...If thats so why wouldnt the machines just d/c the humans that are jacked into the "real world" IE zion...Instead of going through all this BS of burrowing into the city and what not. Wouldnt it be more logical to just pull the plug and start over as opposed to exterminating everybody in a fake world that they already control?

Wouldnt make much sense now would it?

Also im not a hundred percent sure whether the architects response of "Please" to neos mentioning the oracle as the mother of the matrix was him denying it was her or him not liking the term "Oracle" applied to her...To a program it should seem a ridicolous name to apply to such an sophisticated program...Ah i dunno but if the oracle isnt the mother that begs the question who the heck is...[/spoiler]

[color=limegreen]Also i found this very enlightning...The entire covnvo between the architect and neo...Its very interesting to be able to read it and not have to follow it on screen :worried:

Well if you got the time id give it a read:[/color]

[spoiler]***********************START***********************************
The Architect -
Hello, Neo.

Neo -
Who are you?

The Architect -
I am the Architect. I created the matrix. I've been waiting for you. You have many questions, and although the process has altered your consciousness, you remain irrevocably human. Ergo, some of my answers you will understand, and some of them you will not. Concordantly, while your first question may be the most pertinent, you may or may not realize it is also irrelevant.

Neo -
Why am I here?

The Architect -
Your life is the sum of a remainder of an unbalanced equation inherent to the programming of the matrix. You are the eventuality of an anomaly, which despite my sincerest efforts I have been unable to eliminate from what is otherwise a harmony of mathematical precision. While it remains a burden to sedulously avoid it, it is not unexpected, and thus not beyond a measure of control. Which has led you, inexorably, here.

Neo -
You haven't answered my question.

The Architect -
Quite right. Interesting. That was quicker than the others.

*The responses of the other Ones appear on the monitors: Others? What others? How many? Answer me!'*

The Architect -
The matrix is older than you know. I prefer counting from the emergence of one integral anomaly to the emergence of the next, in which case this is the sixth version.

*Again, the responses of the other Ones appear on the monitors: Five versions? Three? I've been lied too. This is bull #$@*%.*

Neo -
There are only two possible explanations: either no one told me, or no one knows.

The Architect -
Precisely. As you are undoubtedly gathering, the anomaly's systemic, creating fluctuations in even the most simplistic equations.

*Once again, the responses of the other Ones appear on the monitors: You can't control me! #$@*% you! I'm going to kill you! You can't make me do
anything!*

Neo -
Choice. The problem is choice.

*The scene cuts to Trinity fighting an agent, and then back to the Architects room*

The Architect -
The first matrix I designed was quite naturally perfect, it was a work of art, flawless, sublime. A triumph equaled only by its monumental failure. The inevitability of its doom is as apparent to me now as a consequence of the imperfection inherent in every human being, thus I redesigned it based on your history to more accurately reflect the varying grotesqueries of your nature. However, I was again frustrated by failure. I have since come to understand that the answer eluded me because it required a lesser mind, or perhaps a mind less bound by the parameters of perfection. Thus, the answer was stumbled upon by another, an intuitive program, initially created to investigate certain aspects of the human psyche. If I am the father of the matrix, she would undoubtedly be its mother.

Neo -
The Oracle.

The Architect -
Please. As I was saying, she stumbled upon a solution whereby nearly 99.9% of all test subjects accepted the program, as long as they were given a choice, even if they were only aware of the choice at a near unconscious level. While this answer functioned, it was obviously fundamentally flawed, thus creating the otherwise contradictory systemic anomaly, that if left unchecked might threaten the system itself. Ergo, those that refused the program, while a minority, if unchecked, would constitute an escalating probability of disaster.

Neo -
This is about Zion.

The Architect -
You are here because Zion is about to be destroyed. Its every living inhabitant terminated, its entire existence eradicated.

Neo - Bull #$@*%.

*The responses of the other Ones appear on the monitors: Bull #$@*%!*

The Architect -
Denial is the most predictable of all human responses. But, rest assured, this will be the sixth time we have destroyed it, and we have become exceedingly efficient at it.

*Scene cuts to Trinity fighting an agent, and then back to the Architects room.*

The Architect -
The function of the One is now to return to the source, allowing a temporary dissemination of the code you carry, reinserting the prime program. After which you will be required to select from the matrix 23 individuals, 16 female, 7 male, to rebuild Zion. Failure to comply with this process will result in a cataclysmic system crash killing everyone connected to the matrix, which coupled with the extermination of Zion will ultimately result in the extinction of the entire human race.

Neo -
You won't let it happen, you can't. You need human beings to survive.

The Architect -
There are levels of survival we are prepared to accept. However, the relevant issue is whether or not you are ready to accept the responsibility for the death of every human being in this world.

*The Architect presses a button on a pen that he is holding, and images of people from all over the matrix appear on the monitors*

The Architect -
It is interesting reading your reactions. Your five predecessors were by design based on a similar predication, a contingent affirmation that was meant to create a profound attachment to the rest of your species, facilitating the function of the one. While the others experienced this in a very general way, your experience is far more specific. Vis-a-vis, love.

*Images of Trinity fighting the agent from Neo's dream appear on the monitors*

Neo -
Trinity.

The Architect -
Apropos, she entered the matrix to save your life at the cost of her own.

Neo -
No!

The Architect -
Which brings us at last to the moment of truth, wherein the fundamental flaw is ultimately expressed, and the anomaly revealed as both beginning, and end. There are two doors. The door to your right leads to the source, and the salvation of Zion. The door to the left leads back to the matrix, to her, and to the end of your species. As you adequately put, the problem is choice. But we already know what you're going to do, don't we? Already I can see the chain reaction, the chemical precursors that signal the onset of emotion, designed specifically to overwhelm logic, and reason. An emotion that is already blinding you from the simple, and obvious truth: she is going to die, and there is nothing that you can do to stop it.

*Neo walks to the door on his left*

The Architect -
Humph. Hope, it is the quintessential human delusion, simultaneously the source of your greatest strength, and your greatest weakness.

Neo -
If I were you, I would hope that we don't meet again.

The Architect -
We won't.

*******************END************************************[/spoiler][/size][/i]

[Syk3]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Arkadyz [/i]
[B][spoiler][size=1][i]Well i would like to go along with the "matrix in a matrix" theory but...If thats so why wouldnt the machines just d/c the humans that are jacked into the "real world" IE zion...Instead of going through all this BS of burrowing into the city and what not. Wouldnt it be more logical to just pull the plug and start over as opposed to exterminating everybody in a fake world that they already control?

Wouldnt make much sense now would it?[/spoiler][/size][/i] [/B][/QUOTE]
[spoiler]I'm not sure...they are probably powerful enough to go in through the 'real world' and take down Zion, themselves. After all, they still want to give the people of Zion hope, and they could learn from their attack for future versions. I suspect that they did things different in each version, and believed that this was the best way to take care of them. With each version upgrade, they learn more about human behavior, and their effects reflect this.

It's like asking why the machines don't uplug everyone in the Matrix if it [i]was[/i] the real world. Sure, they won't have to keep their minds in any prison so that the humans won't rebel, but the machines need the humans' energy to survive.[/spoiler]

[Manic Webb]

I don't know...

[spoiler]The Matrix has, thus far, confused everybody in one way or another. It seems [i]way too simple[/i] for there to be a matrix within a matrix or for no one to have ever left the matrix at all. The worst part is that all theories are entirely based on Neo supposedly stopping a small group of sentinels with his thoughts. We're jumping to conclusions WAY too fast.

Remember, Niobe's ship is still in tact. For all we know, Neo probably just [i]thought[/i] he stopped the sentinels, but Niobe really just set off an EMP. Or maybe there was something else in the surrounding area that caused the sentinels to deactivate. Because honestly, it may not have even been Neo that stopped them. Either way, I'm just guessing.

We're taking our theories and almost treating them as fact. And everybody seems to have the same couple of ideas of what's going on. When Revolutions comes out this November, I'm expecting to be totally surprised (and confused). The Wachowski Brothers deserve a little more credit than that. Remember that in this movie, nothing is what meets the eye.[/spoiler]

[Syk3]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Manic [/i]
[B]I don't know...

[spoiler]Remember, Niobe's ship is still in tact. For all we know, Neo probably just [i]thought[/i] he stopped the sentinels, but Niobe really just set off an EMP. Or maybe there was something else in the surrounding area that caused the sentinels to deactivate. Because honestly, it may not have even been Neo that stopped them. Either way, I'm just guessing.[/spoiler] [/B][/QUOTE]
[spoiler]It's an idea, but remember that Neo said that something was different; that he could feel them. Not to mention the fact that he passed out afterwards. Unless he was a special sort of machine program that could go in and out of the Matrix, then a simple EMP blast shouldn't have harmed him. Besides, I'm not sure why you think having a Matrix inside of a Matrix is too simple; that just makes things more complicated and detailed.[/spoiler]

[Sara]

[size=1]I think he meant the matrix itself was too simple...or...uh. *was slightly lost by that phrasing*

[spoiler]I thought perhaps Neo's being able to sense the giant metal jellyfish had to to with his breaking out of the pattern set out for him...or something. After he'd spoken with the Architect and not done what the program expected him too... *loses train of thought* Well, it made sense at the time, anyway...[/spoiler][/size]

[Manic Webb]

[spoiler]I don't mean that having a matrix inside of a matrix is simple. That'd only make things more confusing.

I meant that we all thought of that way too easily. It was too simple to come to that conclusion. Not 5 minutes after I'd seen the movie, I considered the possibility of there being a matrix within a matrix.

Considering how complicated this movie series is, it's too easy to jump to that conclusion.[/spoiler]

[Sara]

[size=1][spoiler]The fact that this entire page is in spoiler mode amuses me.

Sorry, just had to get that out of my system.

Theories and musings, and they really don't need spoilers...But hey! Who am I to break a trend?

I don't like the idea of a matrix within a matrix...I mean, golly--where would it ever stop?

Maybe the whole thing ends with Neo waking up after a really long nightmare.[/spoiler] :p
[/size]

[Arkadyz]

[size=1][color=crimson][i]Lol well I have been using alot of spoiler tagging just cause im not 100% sure whats gonna spoil it for some ppl :bluesweat:

Well im def. expecting a suprise ending to revolutions...Probably gonna be something completely out of left field...That would just be in keeping with the bros. thinking I would imagine :whoops:

I just dont see everyone hugging and cheering after theyve brought down the matrix and freed humanity being the ending to revolutions...Do you? :raspberry: [/i][/color][/size]

[Manic Webb]

*looks up at his previous post*

Heh. Now that you mention it, I guess we have been using spoiler tags a little too much. I didn't reveal a darn thing in that last post of mine. :cross:

[NorykoAngelcry]

[COLOR=darkred][SIZE=1]Spoiler tags are fun (ya. . so I didn't even know how to do it when I first posted in here. . had to edit my own post with it) =P

I suppose the greatest thing about the movie is that it makes everyone think. It shows that they are doing their job right if no one really knows what is going on. It's whole purpose is to make you want to come back for the final movie (ok, that's not really the 'whole' purpose. . ). ^_^

I wanted to talk about a few things that I was thinking about:

[SPOILER]In the resteraunt scene, as Neo, Trinity, and Morpheus enter, a man is escorted away from the table. Now, they took the time to show Neo's face follow the man off, and go back to the man turning to look at the new party entering the room. I am very curious to see if this is someone who will make a more grand entrance in the next movie, or if he was just . . there?

Another thing I noticed was that when Trinity jumped out of the window, chased by the Agent - a couple bullets passed through the Agent. That makes me think why there weren't as many guns being used in this movie. Sure, Neo is The One, so for him, they are pretty useless, and of course the bad guys have a ton of guns, since Humans can still be killed easily. . but Trinity and Morpheus were really only using hand guns. Just something I was wondering about ^_^

I also wanted to end with a little bit of the discussion about the Oracle being the 'mother' of the Matrix. I am slightly beside my self on what I think now. Sitting at work, playing scenes of the movie over and over in my head again (Trust me, that is all I do at work. . well, almost). Anyways ^_^ a few good points I thought about that would swing me in the direction of seeing her as the Matrix's 'mother'

First - Seraph (the Oracle's protector) told Neo that he "protects that which is most precious" That to me thinks he is protecting someone a little more important then a 'fortune teller' =P

Second - The role of a mother is usually to take care of her children right? Well. . I can't think of anyone closer to that then the Oracle, guiding and watching over all the Humans. She set in motion Morpheus' search for the One, Trinity's search for her true love (also, the One), and indirectly helped Neo to realize realize that he was - yup, once again - the One.

Those are some pretty strong points in my opinion, and though I still believe that she isn't going to be the 'mother', I can definitely picture her in that role.

On a sad note, Gloria Foster (the Oracle) passed away a few years ago (2001). I was surprised to read that, but thought, well, they could have just recorded her scenes earlier. . but now, I am curious what amount of time she will be in the final movie, if she even will be. I would hope that they got the scenes with her, instead of getting replaced (though, as it is a computer program, it would be easy enough to say she was just 'updated' or 'upgraded'. . or what not).[/SPOILER]

Oh well. . I will probably end up watching the movie once or twice more this weekend. . I found a few friends who still haven't seen the movie. With me, that just won't do -_- [/SIZE][/COLOR]

[Arkadyz]

[font=times new roman][color=crimson]Yes the oracle will play a important part in revolutions from what ive heard...But she'll be in a "different" form...Thats all anyone is saying so your guess is as good as mine as to what she'll look like.

Yeah and it was really sad that she passed away...She was a damn fine actress... :bawl:[/font][/color]

[Manic Webb]

I know I might be a little slow and probably thousands of people already know, but it just dawned on me minutes ago...

Persephone...

In Greek mythology, Persephone was the wife of Hades. Before she met Hades, she lived above ground and it was Spring time all year long. When she went underground to live with Hades, the world turned cold and the first Winter came. Whenever Persephone goes to her home underground with Hades (for only 4 months a year), it snows and everything turns to winter. That's Greek myth for you.

In The Matrix... [spoiler]Persephone was the name of that one woman from the restaurant (the one who led them to the Keymaker.) When she opened a door and led them to her home, it was snowing outside (remember when Neo went outside and was in the snowy mountains?). Persephone led them into the winter.[/spoiler]

It just hit me and I had to say something.

[Yu Yu Hakusho!]

[color=deeppink][b]
I really liked the movie. The Matrix Reloaded was better than I expected it to be. But the only problem I had was the sex scene. Yeah, we already knew that Neo and Trinity are hot for each other, but they didn't need to show all [i]that[/i] to show how much they like each other. Other than that, the graphics were amazing and I loved it.[/color][/b]

[Pyrophobic]

Good considerations, Manic. I was trying to dissect that choice of scenery when I went to see Reloaded yesterday. I was aware that persephone was the mistress of Hades, but little more. As for my verdict on the film in general:

I'll agree that the start scared me. It seemed strangely weak and the romance scenes, to begin with, were somewhat excessive, although I can understand what the Wachowskis were trying to communicate through the direction of that particular scene. After that, though, I thought it was brilliant. The clever set pieces were continued, the directing was wonderfully perceptive and really captured the atmosphere when it needed to and best of all, the philosophy element prevailed. Probably the one film of late that's kept me mentally stimulated all the way through. The fighting scenes did go on a bit long, but the cringe moments were rather good. I'd certainly see it again, and it's provoked me to re-watch the first installation with its concerns in mind.

[BabyGirl]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Yu Yu Hakusho! [/i]
[B][color=deeppink][b] But the only problem I had was the sex scene. Yeah, we already knew that Neo and Trinity are hot for each other, but they didn't need to show all [i]that[/i] to show how much they like each other.[/color][/b] [/B][/QUOTE]

[color=deeppink][b]*Possible Spoilers[/b]

Am I the only one who really loved the sex scene? ::mummers of "Pervert." are heard:: :p

I seriously thought that that particular scene showed the extent of inner turmoil Neo was going through at the time. He and Trinity hadn't had a chance to have sex for [i]weeks[/i] and yet he still couldn't even enjoy it because of his vision of Trinity's death. [That would suck, wouldn't it?] I think that scene, while maybe not entirely needed, fit really well. I loved loved [i]loved[/i] it, it was probably the one element that prevented me from falling asleep in the theater ^_^;[/color]

[Red]

[color=002E55]Heh, I only saw this a few hours ago, so I'll suppose I'll put my thoughts on it here too.

At first, I thought they had accomplished the feel of desperation among the humans; unlike in the first movie where they seemed like they were fighting an easy war. I suppose it's because Zion was shown in this movie, and everyone was able to see what kind of struggle they were putting up with, and the desperation of people to survive.

The problem I had with Zion, is that it seemed so run-down and terribly dirty in some places, yet perfectly clean and technologically advanced in others. I think they should have kept to one theme or the other, since they seem to conflict far too much in my eyes.

One of the major problems I had with this movie, is there didn't seem to be too much 'flow'. In the first Matrix, the story progressed and expanded steadily with the action. In Reloaded, it seemed to be a bit of action here, a chunk of story there. Like the scene with the architect.. that just came out of nowhere to me, lol.

That's not to say that the action wasn't any good. The fight scenes were [i]incredible[/i], especially showing off the new effect set (I think it's called Virtual Cinematography). That scene with the multiple Agent Smith's was an amazing piece of choreography, something that a lot of movies will now have to live up to.

The graphics work also greatly impressed me, but then again advances are being made so fast in movies nowadays it's kind of expected for a high-budget movie to blow everyones minds.

As people have pointed out though, there seem to be my 'hints' in the story, such as character names and so forth. I think it's a cool idea, but it seems to try and make people think too hard for a movie that doesn't require a lot of thought; except for that darn scene with The Architect. I swear, my brain was just in 'punch, kick, punch, block' mode, when that guy started talking I thought he was talking Latin. O_o;;[/color]

[conpiracymonki]

[b][size=1]
I don't understand some stuff, which might have some obvious answer, so..[color=red]MAY CONTAIN SPOILERS[/color]

-All the images of Neo in the background screens whilst he was talking to the Architect.. are they his predecessors? If they are, how come every 'One' looks the same? If they're not, are they the guessed reaction of Neo or something?
-I didn't understand what Smith said. He was commanded to be erased, but he decided to rebel.. becoming a rogue program. So are the Twins rogue programs? >.>
-How long has this version of Zion been around for? Were the other version of Zion around for the same amount of time? How long has the Matrix been around for?[/b]

I know they never mention how long Zion's been around for, but I do remember them mentioning an estimate of the present year in The Matrix (first one).
Bleh..*wonders why he asked that last question now*[/size]

[Arkadyz]

[font=times new roman][color=crimson]Well ill give you a few answers AJeh...[/color]

[spoiler]-This one is hard...IT really can be either one...No ones really sure whether its previous ones responses or possible answers from neo...I personally would go with the latter.

-Yeah in reloaded we learn theres more then just the agents running around in the matrix...Theres also alot of errant programs running around the matrix that refused to be erased(Like the twins and the 2 guys guarding the key maker) These programs are what form are myths and strange occurances...Ghosts(the Twins)...Werewolves(The 2 guarding the keymaker)...And so forth.

-This is currently the sixth matrix...Each one exists 100 years(As does zion) So the matrix has existed in one form or another for 600+ years.[/spoiler]

[color=crimson]Well I hope that helps ya... :D [/color][/font]

[Pyrophobic]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Red [/i]
[B][color=002E55]I swear, my brain was just in 'punch, kick, punch, block' mode, when that guy started talking I thought he was talking Latin. O_o;;[/color] [/B][/QUOTE]

Technically, he was, in part. He kept using the word "ergo", which means "therefore". For example, Descartes' coinage: "cogito, ergo sum" - "I think, therefore I am". Take it from a Latin student!

[Syk3]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by NorykoAngelcry [/i]
[B][SPOILER]On a sad note, Gloria Foster (the Oracle) passed away a few years ago (2001). I was surprised to read that, but thought, well, they could have just recorded her scenes earlier. . but now, I am curious what amount of time she will be in the final movie, if she even will be. I would hope that they got the scenes with her, instead of getting replaced (though, as it is a computer program, it would be easy enough to say she was just 'updated' or 'upgraded'. . or what not).[/SPOILER][/B][/QUOTE]
[spoiler]Yes, well, I was [i]quite[/i] surprised when she even showed up in the second movie. I thought I heard her voice in the trailer for the third one as well, which totally freaked me out. In the game, however, there is a different actor. She talks to Ghost or Niobe, depending on who you are playing as, and explains that the Marivingian (sp.?), the man with the Twins, gave her a choice, and ended up having her original "shell" destroyed. Aparently, that's why she looks different, but due to her being a program, she could exist in a different body I suppose.[/spoiler]
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by AJeh [/i]
[B][b][size=1]
I don't understand some stuff, which might have some obvious answer, so..[color=red]MAY CONTAIN SPOILERS[/color]

-All the images of Neo in the background screens whilst he was talking to the Architect.. are they his predecessors? If they are, how come every 'One' looks the same? If they're not, are they the guessed reaction of Neo or something?
-I didn't understand what Smith said. He was commanded to be erased, but he decided to rebel.. becoming a rogue program. So are the Twins rogue programs? >.>
-How long has this version of Zion been around for? Were the other version of Zion around for the same amount of time? How long has the Matrix been around for?[/b]

I know they never mention how long Zion's been around for, but I do remember them mentioning an estimate of the present year in The Matrix (first one).
Bleh..*wonders why he asked that last question now*[/size] [/B][/QUOTE]
[spoiler]No, they are not his predecessors. Can you imagine how many previous versions that would be? That's way too many according to the Architect. No, rather, those are the different human behaviors that he recorded during his lifetime, that he picked up and had he walked through the source door, that information of humans would be downloaded into the Matrix allowing the machines to perfect on their design, and the Matrix would go to version 7.

Well, Smith, or should I say Virus Smith, knew what he was supposed to do, but didn't do it. He rebelled the system, showing that programs do think for themselves and are able to do differently. Remember how Neo was fighting those Agents at the beginning, and he said, "Hmm, upgrades." Well, that could have been the system trying to match his skills, or it may have been a better program that would replace Agent Smith, but since he was a virus, they couldn't stop him. The Oracle explains this somewhat.[/spoiler]

It's on version 6 right now. I think other people can answer the other questions.

As you can see, I've been going through everything and know a lot more about the Matrix universe. I saw the movie again, and beat the game on both characters, and now that I'm doing a speech on it for English, I'm bringing all this information together and coming to understand a lot more. I'm hoping to put all of this information in a book that I will write over the summer, lol.

One such conclusion that I came to was about Zion and the Matrix and the sentinals and all that. [spoiler]To put it simply, Zion is...not part of the Matrix, the sentinals are. You see, the sentinals are hooked up to the Matrix as well, and that's how the machines are able to control them; through the same system as they do people. Remember in the first movie how the Agents said that they sent the sentinals? I believe that the Agents do have control over them somewhat, if just a little bit. Since they were part of the Matrix, Neo could feel them, and that's why he was able to stop them. The reason he passed out was because even though he had his powers, The Matrix is known for being able to bend rules and such. This is the real world. He had to pay the concequence.[/spoiler]

I hope I explained that a bit better. Hopefully I can answer others questions as well.