Anime Yaoi...Why watch it?

[Radical Edward]

I've seen there are alot of Yoai fans and i had always wonderd..."Why do people watch it?"

I've seen and read yaoi but inever got it...I don't really like the whole malexmale cpoupleing. Also same goes for the girlxgirl thing..forgot what it was called though.

So...I have to ask..Whats so great about Yaoi? and why do you Yaoi fans like it?

P.S. I'm just asking out of curiostiy not out of disrespect.

[Queen Asuka]

[color=hotpink][size=1]We have already had plenty of threads on this topic recently, but since you seem to ask a good question and your posting is nice, I figured I will let you go on ahead.[/color][/size]

[eleanor]

[size=1] Well, for one thing, 99.9% of the yaoi-fanbase are young woman [such as me. XD]. I guess it's just the opposite of men. Most guys like to watch lesbians, so I'm guessing some ladies like watching two men get together.

Perhaps one of the more popular yaoi animes, Gravitation and Yami no Matsuei [if you've heard of them] aren't just blatant fanserice either. Gravitatin is one of my favorite animes, not because of shounen-ai, but because of the comedy, plotline, and music. Yami no Matsuei also has a great plot, beatiful art styles, and some humor. *shrugs* I think those two aniems are very well made, and the only reason they're not wildly popular is because it focuses on gay anime pairings.[/size]

[Doukeshi]

*prays this doesn't get out of hand*

Well, as mal said I guess it's just that most shounen-ai or yaoi programmes seem to be targeted at a primarily female audience. Because of this it is attractive because it shows, usually, a softer more sentimental side to males which women find attractive. That's my opinion.

[Zen]

Well, if women like seeing more sensitive males, why don't they just go for an anime with a STRAIGHT sensitive main character? Like Maison Ikkou. I think its just for the whole, "Guy on guy" thing. Mal might like her Gravitation and what no becuase of the story and everything, but i think most of the fan service is just a bunch of, well, fangirls looking for something to turn em on.

[eleanor]

[size=1] I will tell you right now that, yes, 75% of the yaoi fanbase is looking for straight-up shounen-ai/yaoi fanservice. So is 75% of guys. *shrugs* Is there something wrong with finding something that spikes the interest of some people? It might sound immature, but I believe it's simply a natural thing. NO, yaoi is not some cheap way of getting free hentai and porno, so don't go there.

There are several hard-core yaoi shows I've heard of, but from the reviews I've read all of them also have a plot, and they're not just senseless sex. So, yes, while many yaoi/shounen-ai fans are willing to go for the fanservice, there are also yaoi/shounen-ai fans that are looking for a regular romance.

I read an article about "fanfiction" once; especially yaoi fanfiction. The author interviewed some popular yaoi/shounen-ai authors, and all of them stated that they were outraged when people would make an assumption that their stories are just pure smut, with erotica.

Also, gay guys do [i]not[/i] equal sensitive.[/size]

[Zen]

That is another reason i dislike Yaoi. I understand the whole "what if" concept the authors of yoai fanfics imploy. But hey take it too far to the point were the take a very, very womanizing and straight character such as Vash or Miroku and turn them into the authors own little fantasy. Now, imagine this. A person heres about how Trigun is an awsome anime and they go online to get some info on it. They come across a fanfic that depicts he characters as gay, they would think the whole anime as nothing but gay hentai. I also disliek how they say "it for the sakes of a more sensitive side...." VASH HE STAMPEDE IS SENSITIVE!!! He cried several times over the course of the series while also displaying his love of women. I jsut don;t like it when people take characters that i dearly hold to heart, and turn them into there little fanstasy characters. Make your own characters if your gonna make these things!!!

[Kwai]

And you are, Daigo, assuming that the person who happens to search Trigun on the web would be ignorant enough that they don't know that Fan-fic means "Fan-made Fiction"? I'm not a fan of yaoi, and I'm against it in a way, but I won't go as far as to start criticizing the people who write it or the people who read it. Let them. It's not harming me or you in anyway shape or form. So why get so angry over it? It hurts your personal image of the characters? So wait, does that mean you read them a bit? If so, don't read them. Its that simple. I never read Yaoi, and never plan to, and I think thats the best way to deal with it if you're against it.

[eleanor]

[size=1] I can understand what you're saying, D_B_D, and it's better to just ignore those things.

I'm a fan of fanfiction.net, and I have visited both the Inuyasha, Trigun, .hack//SIGN, and G-Gundam site. Now, if you think about it, all of those animes don't have a single character that is openly gay [i]or[/i] doesn't seem gay. [Maybe Tsukasa is bordering that edge.] Well, from my viewing experiences of the fanfictions under those catagories at ff.net, there's a very, [i]very[/i] slim number of yaoi/shounen-ai fanfictions.

Now, go to the Gundam Wing site, and you'll find oodles of yaoi/shounen-ai fictions. It's pretty self-explanatory.[/size]

[Zen]

Atleast you understand Mal. Oh, and PS- Tsukasa lost his/her memory so he/she doesn't know if she's/he's a girl or not, although he/she thinks she's a girl. So if they used Tsukasa in a fanfic, it could either be shoujo-ai or straight. And i wouldn't care if it were either cuz theres a big possiblity that he/she is gay/leabian/straight/bi.


I never said i was against it. I never said i hated those who read it. I never said i hated those who wrote ORIGINAL ones or ones using real or possible gays as there characters. But you also have to take in that the person reading it, never knowing what Trigun is, would probably know that it is by a fan, but they couldn't know that it is using straight characters. Turning Vash gay is changing a large portion of his personality. So, that person reading it might not know that Vash is really straight.

But again. If they use gay characters or there own original characters, i'm cool, but i just dislike it when people use the characters that are obviously straight and they change the characters personality alot by turning them gay. Ex: Miroku or Vash. But if they use characters like Kurama or characters from Gravitation, i'm cool.

[Kwai]

They are holding the anime characters in their heart in their own dear way just as you hold the same characters in your heart in your own dear way. Why not let them? Because its not real? Does it really matter though? In any event, the anime is being appreciated, and the characters are being taken up by fans who want to make their own story with them. I think the authors will be happy that their characters have reached that status.

[Zen]

But theres also the fact that there taking the characters that they took and put there souls into and the fanfic authors totally change there characters. What if you created a brave, corageuos and herioc character. Make a series, have him save the world, and come out as the ultimate good guy. Then a fanfic author comes along and says that your character was evil all along and he only did it so that he could be trusted then turns on the world and destroys it. Thats pretty much what the fanfictors are doing to the straight characters of anime. Miroku is the straightest character i have seen since Vash.

The writers make him into a very smooth guy who is always lookign to grabsome booty, namelu Sango's, and he is all ways in the look out for a true love in a female companion.

Then a fanfictor comes around and says that he fell in love with InuYasha and they tottally drop the women they have spent there entire lives protecting and deep heartedly loving, in turn for each other. Thats totally BOGUS!!! That just gets me angry. Atleast have some respect of how hard the writers tried to create a loving relatinship between Kagome and InuYasha and Sango and Miroku!

[Kwai]

I get what you're saying. I'm not too fond of that aspect either. But you can't really do much. The Yaoi authors are not going to stop because those fan fics are popular, and I guess its a way of creating their own fantasy world consisting of their favorite characters. But after all, its still a fake. Its not the original anime itself. It may have the same character names and such, but its still an imitation. I don't think its worth it to bother over that.

[Angelus_Necare]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by maladjusted [/i]
[B][size=1] Well, for one thing, 99.9% of the yaoi-fanbase are young woman [such as me. XD]. I guess it's just the opposite of men. Most guys like to watch lesbians, so I'm guessing some ladies like watching two men get together.[/size] [/B][/QUOTE]

Amen to that.

I also like going to FF.net just to read the stories they have at that particular time (kingdom hearts being my favorite :p)

I'm not into it for the sexual part really, I just think they make better love stories than the average male x female love stories.

but that's just me.

and remember.....

It all about love!

[James]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Double_B_Daigo [/i]
[B]I never said i was against it. I never said i hated those who read it. I never said i hated those who wrote ORIGINAL ones or ones using real or possible gays as there characters. But you also have to take in that the person reading it, never knowing what Trigun is, would probably know that it is by a fan, but they couldn't know that it is using straight characters. Turning Vash gay is changing a large portion of his personality. So, that person reading it might not know that Vash is really straight.

[/B][/QUOTE]

[color=#707875]I still personally don't see why it matters.

Firstly, people might take Vash and put him in fan fiction where he's still heterosexual. In that case, they may still change his personality somewhat. Would you be as offended in that case?

Taking Vash and "making him gay" doesn't mean anything. It doesn't mean he's girly, it doesn't mean he isn't a womanizer (or the opposite of that...whatever it's called) and so on. It just means that he's homosexual rather than heterosexual.

The problem is that you're stereotyping homosexuals -- assuming that by making Vash a homosexual, you're fundamentally changing his personality. Not so. Vash's personality might even be identical, but his [i]sexuality[/i] might change.

It's like giving Vash different coloured hair or different clothing. In the grand scheme of things, it's pointless to worry about that difference. The personality of any character doesn't necessarily change whether they're gay or straight.

Moreover, I don't know why anyone would be "against" this type of fan fiction. You may [i]dislike[/i] it, but why be actively against it? Maybe it's because they're taking your precious character and making him gay...which you find offensive, because you find homosexuals offensive in some way. If a fan fiction writer were doing anything else to that character, you would definitely see far less complaints.

And it's that point which aggrivates me. You yourself may not be the extreme example, but some that I've seen are. They use these reasons to cover the fact that, essentially, they don't want their beloved character to be a feminine gay guy. It annoys me because it's basically a nice way of being prejudiced, but also, these people do not [i]own[/i] the character in question. The fan fiction writer owns that character as much or as little as you do.

I mean, really. I wish people would just use basic logic here.

A fan fiction writer has as much right to make a character gay as they do to change his clothes, his hair or any aspect of his personality. If you aren't a fan...here's a hint: [b]don't watch/read it.[/b] That's the best you can do. But why try to justify your opposition in these ways? It seems pointless to me. Either you oppose these animes because they drastically alter the personality of the character (I'm sure some do and I'm sure some don't), or you oppose them simply because they're "degrading" [i]your[/i] character by making him gay. The latter is no excuse at all...nor any justification. The former is far more acceptable and realistic; but in both cases, one always has the option not to watch whatever they dislike.

Still, I can understand why you would ask what the appeal of a particular anime is. That's fine...as long as yaoi fans are not attacked for it or told that they're wrong. I know you're not doing that, but some on here do. And that in itself is wrong.[/color]

[Luminaire]

[color=crimson]I really don't know why I am into shounen-ai. I think it's probably the idea that anyone who watches it has to be a bit open-minded and I like those kinds of people.

When I talk to my mother on the topic she always say: "I didn't think Japan was into homosexuality"; I find it great at the openess and willingness of directors and creators to put it in the shows. I love the manga [i]FAKE[/i] because of the relationship. Since the manga takes place in the US, and most homosexuality is illegal, I think the display of shounen-ai makes a statement.

I have noticed most males have problems with shounen-ai. In my school, the greatest insult you can say to a guy is to say he is homosexual; though, I noticed the word "stupid" has become [spoiler]"gay"[/spoiler] and [spoiler]"f*g"[/spoiler] is a very common word. I think when guys, even though there are male shounen-ai fans, see shounen-ai things, they are kinda insulted. It's a matter of pride. No offense.

I got a question: For people who are against shounen-ai, why do you find it so offensive? Why are you against it?

~Lumi ^_^[/color]

[eleanor]

[size=1][QUOTE][i]Originally posted by James [/i]
[B][color=#707875]

A fan fiction writer has as much right to make a character gay as they do to change his clothes, his hair or any aspect of his personality. If you aren't a fan...here's a hint: [b]don't watch/read it.[/b] That's the best you can do. [/color] [/B]
[/QUOTE]

Unfortunately, that's not what many people really do. I have seen arguments against yaoi/shounen-ai that focus around the point that yaoi fanfictions and websites are wrong and have bad things within them. The question then arouses: Why were you at at website/reading the fanfiction in the first place if you're against it? I've even heard arguments against yaoi that focus around URL links. Yes, links. If you don't like yaoi, and you see a link that says, "GUNDAM WING YAOI!", it's best to actually resists those meddlings hands and NOT click it. People who leave random insults aren't going to change anything, other than have some author's note at the top of the page insulting the flamer back. [Which is turn leaves about 1000 yaoi fans to read about it.]

I cannot specifically explain the appeal of yaoi/shounen-ai other than the fact that some people like it, and that some people enjoy watching romance between two men. It's the same appeal many people can get from heterosexual romances, or shoujo-ai. There's no way people are going to get rid of the shounen-ai/yaoi fanbase by flaming stories and leaving insults at websites. And there's no way people are going to get rid of the anti-yaoi population.

I also believe that all excuses people make that are against yaoi/shounen-ai in anime/manga is always fueled by either homophobia or the background of their morals. Yaoi fans against anti-yaoi fans is like a stupid battle; one battle that will have no winners, either. It's pointless to argue with each other about it.

Lumi: I think homosexuals were discriminated and executed in ancient Japan, and there's no doubt that they're still discriminated against there. This world has gone through thousands of years of heterosexuals, and like any human being, people will shun the different and new things that are introduced sometimes. I believe religion has a lot to do with it. Japan culture is very different from ours, though, so it may vary.[/size]

[Zen]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by James [/i]
[B][color=#707875]I still personally don't see why it matters.

Firstly, people might take Vash and put him in fan fiction where he's still heterosexual. In that case, they may still change his personality somewhat. Would you be as offended in that case?

[/QUOTE]

yes, i would be angry if they changed his personlaity. I never said i was only against the yaoi part, i said i was against them changing the characters personality, and changing there sexual preference is a REALLY BIG part of their personality.

[Luminaire]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by maladjusted [/i]
[B][size=1]

Unfortunately, that's not what many people really do. I have seen arguments against yaoi/shounen-ai that focus around the point that yaoi fanfictions and websites are wrong and have bad things within them. The question then arouses: Why were you at at website/reading the fanfiction in the first place if you're against it? I've even heard arguments against yaoi that focus around URL links. Yes, links. If you don't like yaoi, and you see a link that says, "GUNDAM WING YAOI!", it's best to actually resists those meddlings hands and NOT click it. People who leave random insults aren't going to change anything, other than have some author's note at the top of the page insulting the flamer back. [Which is turn leaves about 1000 yaoi fans to read about it.]
[/size] [/B][/QUOTE]

[color=crimson]Very true. I have done that. I have fun tearing apart every little thing that is said and insulting/disproving what it. I think that people who dislike shounen-ai and click on the links are pretty strange. I mean, it's like stabbing yourself and them accusing someone else. O_o;;;;; Don't like don't click/look/read. There are normally warning for that kind of stuff.

maladjusted has pretty much taken the arguments out of my mouth, but I can still participate if this ends up a debate. ^_^

~Lumi ^_^[/color]

[Zen]

Listen to this Lumin, i go to FF.net looking for a cool Naruto fanfic, seeing if any one tried to make a cool coutinuation of the series. When i go and check, all i see is a Yaoi! yoai! Yaoi! Yaoi! Nothing else, and all concerning Naruto and Sasuke. Its dissapointing to see that all these fanfics are nothing but Yoai and its the best these so called 'fans' could come up with. Instead of coming up with a cool, new, and inthralling story, they throw out a yaoi that changes what the series was about and calling it a coutniuation! Saying that Naruto and Sasuke fell in love with each other? They freakin HATE each other and Naruto is in love with SAKURA! If it were a true FANfic, it would show something that is faithful to the series instead of putting out often times cheap smut. I'm not homophobic, i just wish people would either use gay or there own characters in fan fics instead of changing the series or characters.

[Radical Edward]

I don't know if i've just picked the wrong fanfic's but...when i tried reading Yaoi *to see what the big deal of it was* i found alot of hentai...and this happend everytime i tried a new fanfic, this kinda got me thinking about what was so great about Yaoi and made me think every one that read Yaoi was a complete pervert.
I end up reading about nasty things and then i feel as if i have to go to a confessional or something...

[Luminaire]

[color=crimson]Did you use a search or just the page on FF.net? Try [url]www.mediaminer.org[/url] if you are still having trouble. I understand what you are saying DBD, I can't live without fanfiction, and there are probably continuation fics out there. Just keep trying.

And, Radical Edward, avoid the NC-17 and R if you have to. On [url]www.fanfiction.net[/url] you can select the rating and genre, try that.

Not everything is Yaoi out there, DBD. You could just read one and ignore the relationships, but it's up to you.

~Lumi ^_^[/color]

[MillieFan]

D_B_D, the Trigun section of fanfiction.net has many stories that are NOT yaoi. As a fan and writer of both hetero and shounen ai/yaoi, I know my way around there. If you want to see a good story that [i]isn't[/i] yaoi or shounen ai, and that leaves it at friendship between Vash and Wolfwood, I highly recommend "Last Chance" by Shandrial. Well-written, and a good story all around. Here's a link to it: [url]http://www.fanfiction.net/read.php?storyid=1456832[/url]

If you want to see more VashxMeryl and MillyxWolfwood, check out my Favorite Stories list and Favorite Authors lists. Both have a lot, and I mean a LOT, of such fanfics. [url]http://www.fanfiction.net/profile.php?userid=401972&hal=stories#bot[/url] and [url]http://www.fanfiction.net/profile.php?userid=401972&hal=authors#bot[/url]


Thing is, I'm a fan of hetero on obviously hetero characters and of shounen ai/yaoi on characters that are undefined or gay. i.e. I cannot stand the Vash/Wolf pairing either (although I love Legato/Knives), just the same way I don't like the hetero pairing of HeeroxRelena ~.^ Some pairings are just not meant to be or just don't appeal to everyone.

[Doukeshi]

You know people, there is a difference between Yaoi and Shounen-ai. yaoi does tend to focus on the more physical side of the relationship. DB, it's called FANfiction, if fans want to write cheap smut about the characters they like then they can...unless that fandom happens to be harry potter and then you may find youself on the recieving end of many threatening e-mails by JKR's editor. Anyway, I really can't say much that I haven't said before, however, it is their choice to change characters for their own enjoyment, writing it how they see it or want to see it. It just wouldn't be the same if they used their own characters and many do use normally gay characters.

It's something you're going to have to put up with, so stop being so naive and go find some hetro fics to read, there's plenty out there.

[Zen]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by MillieFan [/i]
[B]


Thing is, I'm a fan of hetero on obviously hetero characters and of shounen ai/yaoi on characters that are undefined or gay. i.e. I cannot stand the Vash/Wolf pairing either (although I love Legato/Knives), just the same way I don't like the hetero pairing of HeeroxRelena ~.^ Some pairings are just not meant to be or just don't appeal to everyone. [/B][/QUOTE]

Exactly MF! Exactly! See, i don't care about the LegatoxKnives pairing because there is absolutely NO proof against it and the characters never show there sexuality, so i don't care! that is th point i have been tryingt o get threw.

Now, Dou03, what i have to say to you is this. When i say FANfic, i mean that if a person is a true fan of a series or character, they wouldn't want to bend them to suit them. Thats what maks characters cool. There are bad and good things about them to everyone, BUT if your true fan, yor work with what you thnk is your characters flaws instead of changing them. Ala, changing there sexuality and there for changing there full personlaity in full. So, if they are true fans, they would make it to were they use the characters as they are instead of changing who they are. That is my opinion.

(PS- before you say somethng like "Oh, i bet if you saw a Tenchi Muyo yuir you'd read it. Probably liked to see Ayake and Ryoko." No this, I wouldn't ever! I'd be jsut as angry and i'd be here saying the same thing that i've always been sayin'. But i would like to see Kyone go for Tenchi. Go Kyone!)