Caucasian Club

[The Original]

[URL=http://www.bayarea.com/mld/mercurynews/news/6811806.htm]http://www.bayarea.com/mld/mercurynews/news/6811806.htm[/URL]

As many of you have probably heard, a girl in Oakley, Calif., is trying to create a caucasian club. This has, of course, been greeted with some racist arguments. Some say there should be a club, and others (mostly non-white), say it's a rascist club. Both bring up some valid arguments. My take on the situation is a little mixed.

Pro-Club : Lisa McClelland, the creator of the club, says she wants to make the club to embrace European-American heritage. I, for one, am happy to hear this, because I have always been interested in my European ancestry. She also brings up the question of why there can't be a Caucasian club when there are African-American and Hispanic-American clubs.

Anti-Club : She claims that the club will be open to all races; doesn't that defeat the purpose of having a Caucasian club? Yes, it may seem racist, but at [u]my[/u] school, Whites are not allowed into the Black clubs, nor are Hispanics (I can't really speak for other schools). If she admits any race, I think she would be creating the club simply to be a flag-waver.

I would like to hear anyone's opinions on this issue, good or bad. However, let me make this clear : this is [u][b]not[/u][/b] a racism thread. If the thread goes off-topic into a flame-fight over racism, I will gladly allow the Mods to close it (Heh, like they need my permission). Please bear that in mind.

[Dagger]

At my school, anyone is allowed into any club. However, you don't find many black people in the Latin American Club, Hispanic people in the Asian Student Association, or Caucasians in the Black Student Union. So I don't think that open membership necessarily defeats the purpose of having an ethnic club.

I don't really see any problem with her creating a Caucasian club, but the idea of Caucasian-only membership makes me a little uncomfortable.

~Dagger~

[Baron Samedi]

Eh. I think it is absolutely fine. They had a point that Caucasians are not a minority, but that doesn't mean that they don't need a club to research their backgrounds in. And if it is open to all, then what is the problem? They should say that African-American clubs are racist, because it excludes Caucasians. But nobody does. yet when Someone starts a Caucasian club, it is overwhelmingly racist, for what reason?

I get sick of the double standards that our world has. It is absolutely stupid. For Australia, they are always focusing on 'Aboriginal Health'. Why dont they just focus on Health? Having different standards makes the racial rift wider, not smaller. It is stupid. Some Aboriginals choose to live out in the middle of nowhere. Not our problem. If a bunch if white pople did that, everyone would say they were crazy, and give them nothing. But because nobody wants to be accused of being racist, so they don't say that. All this stuff about Aboriginals not getting a fair deal..... if they get an education, and look presentable etc. then I believe they have as much of a chance in life as anyone. If a white man didn't even try to get a job, try to be presentable etc, and complained, he would be a fool, a doll bludger. Those double standards infuriate me. I have nothing against aboriginals, it.... I don't know.

Eh. Sorry about all that. I just get majorly pissed at double standards, and that has always been a bad subject for me. The first paragraph states what I mean anyway. But how can this avoid completely racism? That is the background to this whole dilemma, is it not?

*****EDIT*****

Dagger, did you even read the news article? It isn't a caucasian only group. Read the news article beofre making claims. Please.

****EDIT*****

[Dagger]

[QUOTE][B]*****EDIT*****

Dagger, did you even read the news article? It isn't a caucasian only group. Read the news article beofre making claims. Please.

****EDIT***** [/B][/QUOTE]

I did read the article. What I meant to say was that [b]IF[/b] she had wanted it to be a Caucasian-only group, I would have serious doubts about supporting that. But since she said the membership would be open, I don't really see any problems with it.

Sorry if my post was unclear.

~Dagger~

[BabyGirl]

[color=deeppink]I don't see what the big freaking deal is. It has obviously been made clear that the club will not be exclusively open to Caucasians, but that anyone is welcome to join. People should let things go and, like Baron said, stop supporting double standards. That issue drives me crazy :drunk:

I doubt too many people were opposed to the creation of Freedom High School's African American and Latino clubs, so why are they making this such an issue? It's simply reverse racism, saying that there can't be a creation of a club that [i]welcomes evreyone[/i], yet is centered around European ancestory. There are a lot of countries that fall under such a category.

Ah well, I could very easily be missing out on some facts because it initially caught me as 'ridiculous'. Feel free to correct me if any on my points are way off.[/color]

[Guest cloricus]

We don't have clubs, any one is welcome anywhere and there is no distinction between anyone. (Except hicks.) I don't see why you need clubs like this in the first place.

[Ares]

Well, I think that it is kind of racist. But in my school we allow anyone in clubs pretty much. I think it's not that bad though what she's doing. who really cares?

[Drix D'Zanth]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by cloricus [/i]
[B]We don't have clubs, any one is welcome anywhere and there is no distinction between anyone. (Except hicks.) I don't see why you need clubs like this in the first place. [/B][/QUOTE]

....Cloricus..*sighs* Why don't you think people need clubs? Do you know what clubs are for? Not to encourage being welcome or unwelcome to all social groups; but to allow a venue for people to enjoy something they have in common. Clubs allow people fairly easy acess to find friends, or peers that share the same interests instead of the man-hunt guess and check method to which we find ourselves in common with our friends (I know it took me a while knowing my friend before I found out he liked anime too). There's nothing wrong with clubs.

As for the Caucasian club... well, I don't see how people can call it racist when there's a black union and latinos unicos in the same building. I don't have a problem with that. There's no offense towards african/latin/asian heritage, just a celebration of european heritage.

[Semjaza]

Everything is considered racist lately. If you're a different skin color than I am, I can't dislike you simply because you're a total dickhead. It's obviously because of your race or heritage. Give me a break.

There are more caucasian people I can't stand than any other race lol (and being in Chicago, I meet all sorts of people on a regular basis).

I don't see the problem. I find that when something like this is brought up, the main argument against it is that whites already have their own clubs. Apparently that somehow consists of whatever clubs/organizations/whatevers that have a majority of white members.

I've seen this applied to many things, honestly. It may have been an issue in past decades, but it seems almost like an archaic way of thinking at this point. Most of the time it seems to just be a point for various groups to harp on to suit their agendas. I don't see how either side of it is truly more "fair" than the other, based on all that.

[James]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Baron Samedi [/i]
[B]

I get sick of the double standards that our world has. It is absolutely stupid. For Australia, they are always focusing on 'Aboriginal Health'. Why dont they just focus on Health? Having different standards makes the racial rift wider, not smaller. It is stupid. Some Aboriginals choose to live out in the middle of nowhere. Not our problem. If a bunch if white pople did that, everyone would say they were crazy, and give them nothing. But because nobody wants to be accused of being racist, so they don't say that. All this stuff about Aboriginals not getting a fair deal..... if they get an education, and look presentable etc. then I believe they have as much of a chance in life as anyone. If a white man didn't even try to get a job, try to be presentable etc, and complained, he would be a fool, a doll bludger. Those double standards infuriate me. I have nothing against aboriginals, it.... I don't know. [/B][/QUOTE]

[color=#707875]Baron...this is an extremely ignorant comment. As an Australian, I'm very disappointed in it.

The [i]reason[/i] that we talk about "Aborignial Health" is because Aboriginal people tend to have unique health concerns. The problems that Aboriginals face today are largely the direct result of western colonization. In other words, European settlers totally and utterly destroyed the lives of the Aboriginal people, en masse, so it's our responsibility to fix that issue.

When you say that as long as they look presentable and so on...that just strikes me as being ridiculously ignorant. You're sounding like the men who supported taking Aborignial children from their traditional homes and giving them an "education" on western living.

It's not a case of saying "Oh well, they chose to live out in the desert, so who cares?" Aboriginal people are a displaced people -- they are in limbo. They're not quite "city-dwellers" like you or I, but they are also not completely "traditional" in terms of their Aboriginal lifestyle, as a direct result of European interference.

How you can use blanket statements like that is totally beyond me. That kind of ignorance is why many Aborigines are still living in terrible conditions -- and why the Government throws money at the problem but ultimately fails to provide real solutions.

I'm sorry, Baron...but what you said there was completely wrong. I had to correct you.

As far as this club issue goes...I think it's good that this girl would allow anyone into the club. Who is to say that people of other backgrounds aren't going to be interested in European heritage? In the same way, a caucasian person might be interested in East Asian or African heritage. I mean, you know...why tell people they can't join your club due to their race? Clubs who exclude people of a different race have little justification for that, in my view. Surely you enter the club based not on your actual race, but on your interest in the issues that the club deals with.[/color]

[craig8429]

Personally my opinon is, we deserve a club. everyone else has one. African american's are using the excuse racist because, thats all they can use.

Plus what harm can a club do anyways? it's not the kkk.

I mean people white people are blamed so much if we do anything wrong we are labeled racist. sometimes I question if people even realize the meaning of racist.

[Justin]

This reaction is to be expected, honestly. I sincerely hope that girl didn't think she couldtry something like this and escape it.

However, that does not make it right. If you want to talk unity, we're not going to have it by slicing people up into different catagories like this, at all.

The fact is, even though it may be being set up for the study of heritage, it isn't like it will actually revolve around that. Considering many(not all, mind you) after school clubs rarely accomplish more than jut being a hang out for people to gossip and talk.

In my opinion, there should be more specific, alternative history classes.(actually, I'd support more specific alternative version of all core classes) That way, people can study more or less what they want to know about.

-Justin

[Transtic Nerve]

Look, if you can have African American and Hispanic American slubs, you can have a Caucasion-American club, anyone who doesn't see the equality is a complete idiot. Just because black and hispanics aren't the majority doesn't give them the right to wine like little babies over this. Get over it.

I wouldn't be against a "straight club" if someone made it, as long as it doesn't put down gay people, and this caucasion club isn't putting down any people. Of course, hell if anyone could see that the club is about learning... lol no one does that in school.

[Kent]

Im with tn on this one.

Its just a constitutional issue and if anyone can start a black, hispanic, native american or asian american club, then whites also MUST be allowed to do the same.

This is not a nation where we can have some constitutional rights permitted and not allow others.

Its an all or non package and just like everything else in the world, you get some bad with the good.

btw, props to tn for keeping on the side of fair in this.

( I should also mention that I do not at all support this club and infact think its a shame. But I still believe it must be allowed.)

[Guest Fly-T]

People are starting to take certain race, nationality ethnic things a little bit too far....a couple of days ago at my school this club tried to ban Lord of the Rings because it didn't have black people in the book or w/e.....

I don't really see nothing wrong....this caucasian club is just another one of those things....it's probably more head-turning than the african-american clubs and such because people have became adapted and used to hearing about those kinds of clubs....its kinda like going into mcdonalds and now all of a sudden they start serving burger king meat and fries.....

[Genkai]

I just don't understand..what would you do? I 've been to Black Clubs and Asian Clubs with friends and we just hang out... o_0 It's not a big deal, clubs based on race is normally an excuse to hang out afterschool or something. At lest, in my experience it is.

[amibasuki]

[FONT=arial]I don't see how a Caucasian club is rascist as long as anybody who wants to join is allowed to. it's basically the same thing as an African-American or Hispanic-American club, just with a different heritage. what's the big deal about having it? is it the name or something? would the club be more acceptable if it was called the European-American club?[/FONT]

[Artemis]

I noticed that people keep calling Caucasians a majority race. For several years at the grade school I went to, I was a minority in my class. We only had scholarships (to our local parochial high school) for Hispanics. I was just as poor (if not more so) as the Hispanics and I wasn't allowed any scholarship. I have to say, the double standard really bugs me. If someone wants to have a club and they're not going to exclude anyone, let them have it!!

[G.D. Ryoko]

I don`t see anything wrong with startinag an all caucasian club that is open to all races. It sounds really silly that people are saying it`s wrong, if the club is open to all races. The only problem I have with the idea is that it`s a club and I find clubs boring.(except yugioh clubs)