China will be the 3rd (I hope)

[FartMaster745]

[SIZE=1]China will be the third nation to sen da man into space

[URL=http://www.space.com/news/china_pride_991122_wg.html]Click[/URL] here for more.

I'm not sure if this is on the page or not, but the launch is set on Wednesday [b]this[/b] week!

Now this launch will change the world completely. Well what does sending a man into space prove? Russia already won that prize and the US has already claimed first on the Moon. Well it proves a lot. Gaining control of the area around the Earth means controlling area within it. Soon China will be send up more satellites, which means setting up a bigger, better army and weapons. Better more accurate weapons. I'm not saying this launch will be a good or bad thing, but I hope theres a happy ending.

Pretty soon the world will change. China will become a democracy. The people there already proved that they wanted it:
[IMG]http://www.angelfire.com/freak2/fartmaster745/square.jpg[/IMG]

Now don't tell me that setting over 1 billion people free and sending the 3rd man into space won't change the world, our world...

What are your friendly thoughts?

EDIT: I re-read my post. My post seemed like I was against this whole thing and thinking China is evil and trying to control the world. Lol, I'm with China and hope they succeed. [/SIZE]

[James]

[color=#707875]I think it's possible that China will end up being the richest nation in the world, eventually. It has the population and it's moving toward democracy. And, unlike countries of a similar population (ie: India), China is generally far more developed. Lots and lots of new industries are opening up there...the country is becoming a major global force.

So, this is just a further sign of it. These days, putting a man into space isn't as relevant as it once was though, in my opinion. It's when you start putting weaponised-satellites in space that we have cause to worry. lol

In any case, I think it's exciting news. I can't wait to read about what happens and see the pictures. I think that China has a very bright future ahead.[/color]

[Aoshi Shinomori]

That's amazing...the people of China really deserve something after all the years of oppression by the Communist regime...I'm happy knowing that they're heading towards democracy...I'm not so sure about their economy however...but still...the news about them going to outer space isn't bad...let's all hope for the best...

[Break]

[size=1][color=CC0000]How can China change our world just by sending the 3rd guy into space? I will tell you now that it won't change it. Things will still be bad, terrorists will still terrorize each other, prisoners will still be held against their will in foreign countries and governments will continue to try to "spread peace" around the world. All this launch will do is make the world either worse or exactly the same, with the internationalisation of everything becoming ever imminent. But whatever..[/size][/color]

[Drix D'Zanth]

I agree with Break. Personally, I don't care much for China; considering they posess one of the most brutal histories in the entirety of human existence. I think I'll clap my hands once or twice at the fact China finally cought up with Kennedy-administration America... whoo hoo.

James, I'd have to disagree with you on the richest country aspect. I think money is fairly relative, each dollar valued at some certain price. I'm no economics major, but I think the only reason China is really steaming in today's economy is their use of labor, cheap labor. I know they have some fairly exclusive, or monopolized resources in China's vast expanse, but US technology is driving alot of improvement in our marketplace. I mean, look at Japan, it holds ALOT of technology sources by the balls; a fairly resourceless country is one of the major economical powers of the world.

[FartMaster745]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Break [/i]
[B][size=1][color=CC0000]How can China change our world just by sending the 3rd guy into space? I will tell you now that it won't change it. Things will still be bad....[/size][/color] [/B][/QUOTE]

[size=1]I never said that things will get better or become worse from this launch if it succeeds or fails.

hmm...
Well think about it. If they can send a man into space, they can send satellites. If they can send satellite then they can target any target in the world through their own GPS(Global Positioning System). They are mainly doing this to prove that they can do this on their own. This is why they didn't join NASA or any other foreign space program.

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Break [/i]
[B][size=1][color=CC0000]...terrorists will still terrorize each other, prisoners will still be held against their will in foreign countries and governments will continue to try to "spread peace" around the world. All this launch will do is make the world either worse or exactly the same, with the internationalisation of everything becoming ever imminent. But whatever..[/size][/color] [/B][/QUOTE]

Sure there will still be terrorism. Terrorism can't be avoided.

China is a force to be reckoned with if they become anyone's enemy. I believe China will become one of the strongest nation in the world sooner or later. They have the people and the pride to succeed.

Most governments try to keep things in 'order' and attempt to 'spread peace'. Thats their main purpose. Man is born free, but everywhere he is in chains.[/size]

[Break]

[size=1][color=CC0000][QUOTE][i]Originally said by you[/i]
[b]...won't change the world, our world...[/b][/QUOTE]

Well there you did say it.

With your last post, you are condradicting your first post, or just forgetting to mention things in your first..

Again, I just can't see the excitement. Sure, it'll be exciting for every person in China hopefully, if they're not in very decadent families. The only good or convenience that comes out of this is for China and whoever chooses to become it's ally(ies) after this event.

I can see China being either the head of a huge war, or one being attacked by loads of countries in the future. I can imagine that the inevitable will be a war, everything in the world ends in conflict, peace can only be obtained by picking up the broken pieces afterwards. If only they could learn to do it beforehand.... maybe China, in the limelight, will be an adept at peace-talking. Wouldn't that be nice?[/size][/color]

[eleanor]

[size=1] What is this, the Bash-China thread?

If China is launching the third man into space, then good for them. I personally think their first case against sexual harrasment [some lady in the office sued a man for sexually harrassing her and actually won] is more important, but whatever.

The people in China are probably proud of themselves, and they should be. Saying that they have a brutal history is stating the fact that you belive one cannot change one's ways.

And uh, what country [i]doesn't[/i] have terrorism? Oh yeah, Norway. *rolls eyes*

I personally want to learn and understand the Chinese culture adn language, just because of the fact that they could very well become a world power sooner or later. You're not going to ignore them when they become a world power, right? So there's no need to ignore them now, either. Japan isn't going to get any more bigger than what it is now. And if the tectonic plates keep it up, Japan will soon be the country under the ocean. [I wonder where all the anime and video games are going to go...=_=] Technology if the only thing the country really has, and it's practically racing with Korea neck-and-neck over the particular buisness region. There's a good chance they're going to lose, too.[/size]

[Drix D'Zanth]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by maladjusted [/i]
[B][size=1] What is this, the Bash-China thread?

The people in China are probably proud of themselves, and they should be. Saying that they have a brutal history is stating the fact that you belive one cannot change one's ways.
/size] [/B][/QUOTE]

I understand this may seem like a china bashing thread. No.... I don't hate china. Good for them for launching a person into space.

As for their history. I'm just bringing up the facts because when people don't learn from history, it tends to repeat itself. China's brutality has repeated itself over and over again.... I'm not limiting the option that they [I]can[/I] change. I just think it's unlikely.

The U.S. until recently, aruguably, has only gone to war over fairly just causes or the defense of it's people. (I think veitnam was the main exception, and most people would veiw the new war on Iraq as unjust, that's not the discussion though, people.) We strive to better ourselves and prevent perhaps inhumane mistakes of our past.

In china 1 out of every 174 baby girls is killed after being born by it's own family because baby boys not only bring family "honor", but money, and social standing. Having a boy means you can have more than one child, because boys serve in the military.

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by maladjusted [/i]
[B][size=1]
I personally want to learn and understand the Chinese culture adn language, just because of the fact that they could very well become a world power sooner or later. You're not going to ignore them when they become a world power, right? So there's no need to ignore them now, either. Japan isn't going to get any more bigger than what it is now. And if the tectonic plates keep it up, Japan will soon be the country under the ocean. [I wonder where all the anime and video games are going to go...=_=] Technology if the only thing the country really has, and it's practically racing with Korea neck-and-neck over the particular buisness region. There's a good chance they're going to lose, too.[/size] [/B][/QUOTE]

Anime and Videogames will probably go to the largest consumer... the united states. Do I belive anime can be drawn in the United states? Yes. That's a different argument.

As for Japan sinking beneath the plates of our world.... well maybe in a few million years, I'm counting the seconds down as we speak.

China IS a world power... With a purchasing power parity of $5.7 trillion, GDP, and an annual growth of 8%, I doubt it's going anywhere. The only problem is china's invested in mostly raw material or labor processing, wich may someday become obsolete with automation.

I think the fact that China's standing army has a manpower of 10,973,761 people (according to CIA world factbook) and it's nuclear capabilities (thanks mr. Clinton!) make them more frightening to myself than economic growth.

Alas, I stray off topic. I say congratulations to China, perhaps they are changing after all.

[eleanor]

[size=1] In a few million years, I think we'll all be dead or we would have found the technology to support ourselves. Japan would probably be protected by some dome or whatever.

If China is in fact already a world power, then I think it's going to bigger and better places.

[offtopic] Anime can be drawn in the US; I think it can be drawn everywhere. It's the plot and making of the anime that counts. 99% of anime is crap, really.[offtopic][/size]

[Genkai]

China is only "officially" communist. None of the citizens are really all that unhappy, since they're not really bad communism right now. You can easily live off of 400 USD there. Really. I don't think them changing to democracy wil change much there, except maybe the TV,. Which 9/10 times is women dancing and singing about how much they love China, or members of theparty dropping their ballots into a box. for five hours. Of course, if you watch it too long you eventually begin to think that China IS the best nation in the world. Sheesh.

Okay, so maybe it wouldn't change nothig, it would make for better-i-ness.. But mad capitalism isn't all that great for that huge a country like that.. Or something.. All I can say is saying "setting over 1 billion people free" is a ibt stretching it?it's not slavery or anything. Just a lot of poverty.

[Mitch]

[size=1] If I recall, China isn't exactly "communist." They have a lot of captialistic enterprizing going on, with restrictions...but yes, I do recall they definitely aren't a cut and true "communist nation."

I wonder when the US itself will die. Or if it will ever. I mean, it has to end sometime...the Roman Empire fell, the British Empire fell...yeah. It's inevitable, really. Not that I don't love being an American and all, but yeah. It'd be interesting to see that happen.

As for China, I really do think they will become one of the strongest nations ever. They already are becoming one, just look at their population.

Them being the third country to send people into space is somewhat a big deal, although I really don't care [i]too][/i] much. I do care to an extent, though.

I think they will have a hard time with getting democracy running well, though. Just look at Russia.[/size]

[FartMaster745]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Break [/i]
[B][size=1][color=CC0000]

Well there you did say it.

With your last post, you are condradicting your first post, or just forgetting to mention things in your first..[/size][/color] [/B][/QUOTE]

[size=1]"Now [b]don't tell me[/b] that setting over 1 billion people free and sending the 3rd man into space won't change the world, our world..."

I dunno, I think I left something something out. Well I can re-phrase it:

"Setting over 1 billion people free and sending the 3rd man into space will change the world, our world..."

That was what I meant, sorry for any misunderstandings ^_^[/size]

[Drix D'Zanth]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Genkai [/i]
[B]China is only "officially" communist. None of the citizens are really all that unhappy, since they're not really bad communism right now. You can easily live off of 400 USD there. Really. I don't think them changing to democracy wil change much there, except maybe the TV,. Which 9/10 times is women dancing and singing about how much they love China, or members of theparty dropping their ballots into a box. for five hours. Of course, if you watch it too long you eventually begin to think that China IS the best nation in the world. Sheesh.

Okay, so maybe it wouldn't change nothig, it would make for better-i-ness.. But mad capitalism isn't all that great for that huge a country like that.. Or something.. All I can say is saying "setting over 1 billion people free" is a ibt stretching it?it's not slavery or anything. Just a lot of poverty. [/B][/QUOTE]

Capitalism isn't all that great? I don't think people understand the concept of capitalism here, because of China's exploitation of it, they are a leading power.

You see approximately 128,697,547 are beneath poverty level. The GDP per capita is about $4,400 in china. This is on average. There's a 32% unemployment rate in major cities and an even greater rate in rural areas. Much of China lives in poverty. Sure you could live comfortably with 400 USD (actually it's more like 500 USD) , but good luck making that in China....

What's the problem with a communist society? The average citizen can't concievably improve his lifestyle or his family's. Sure, China does take advantage of competative capitalism. However most of the capitalism is provided by foreign business in China. Hell 9.8% of business in china is US, 18.1 percent is Japanese. No, most of chinese business is Communist controlled. Please remember, communism is an ECONOMIC system, not a government. In fact, chinese people have both elected parties, and dictatorships in various epochs... of course China is a "communist state", this means most of the government is part of said economic party, so it's half and half.

How do you know the Chinese are happy? I don't think they really know what life would be like as an American, Brit, or Aussie... it's not like they can really protest without being [b]killed[/b]. Their constitution doesn't allow the right to protest...

As for Russia, well, thank the Clintons. The Clinton administration pulled almost 84% of foreign administration from the Russian economic office, while Russia was in infrastructure reconstruction. Russia's been a democracy for 20 or so years now, we've been one for 200; let's give them some time. Think about it, it takes alot of change in the infastructure to support such a huge economic shift, it's just taking some time. Remember the global crisis of 1998? Yeah, Russia was up **** creek during that time, central Europe's had a nice hand, I wish we hadn't pulled out of Russia so quickly. Now Vladamir doesn't want us back... thanks Bill....

[Baron Samedi]

I think it is wonderful that they are sending men to the moon/outer space. What I don't understand, is why you would want a [i]third[/i] un-allied world power sending satellites into space. With the deadlock between America and Russia, it was OK. If there is a third person, then two could gang up on one.

Forgive me if that assumption is wrong, maybe I have been reading too many Nelson Demille/Tom Clancy. lol. But a third person wouldn't be a good thing.

What is so good about them having war satellites in space? I don't see anything particularly good about that. Why is them having more accurate weapons good? for them, but really, they should be focusing on pushing this democracy through.

My ideas on the three issues here.

Democracy: Great. Good on them.

Man ito space: Oh wow. Something trivial, but it it makes them feel happy...

War satellites: How is this good for us?

I don't think China is evil or anything. It is just that sometimes some countries alliances are shadowed, whether by present motivations or past differences.

Feel free to enlighten me if I am being ignorant

[Guest cloricus]

[color=teal]As an 'expert' on ABC radio the other morning said, "It's a big step from sending a man into space to mining the moon or creating a weapons network in space." What he is basically saying is that you don't just go from firing rockets up with people to being able to fire them down or firing them back from the moon or mars full of dirt, it took America and Russia forty years to get to the point they are at now and China at the moment is treading carefully and taking it nice and slow. So in reality the time it will take them to do anything amazing in space it will have been done by some one else being forty years behind before they even start.

Apart from that I congratulate them on their achievement and hope that their first man in space has a nice trip.

(ABC as in the Australian one.)[/color]

[James]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Drix D'Zanth [/i]
[B]
James, I'd have to disagree with you on the richest country aspect. I think money is fairly relative, each dollar valued at some certain price. I'm no economics major, but I think the only reason China is really steaming in today's economy is their use of labor, cheap labor. I know they have some fairly exclusive, or monopolized resources in China's vast expanse, but US technology is driving alot of improvement in our marketplace. I mean, look at Japan, it holds ALOT of technology sources by the balls; a fairly resourceless country is one of the major economical powers of the world. [/B][/QUOTE]

[color=#707875]I'm not talking about dollar value at all. I'm talking about physically how much money the country turns over. China is currently the world's fastest growing economy (and it will be for some years). It also has the world's largest population and is undergoing major market liberalisation and structural reforms.

Your second point about Japan is one reason why China has so much potential. China is determined to grow and moreover, it has the resources to do so. In addition, China is now a member of the WTO -- the result being that the country's markets are being forced into greater global competitiveness.

So, I can only say that maybe my view is different because I live in this region in the world and perhaps I have a little more understanding of China. I can see how, from the outside or a casual view, it can be seen as some Communist state which is stuck in a cold-war-esque position.

But really, that's not the reality of today. Yes, China is still a communist nation. But it won't be like that forever. China is frequently undergoing major economical and political reforms. Already, leaders are elected on a Provincial and citywide level. Democracy is absolutely in China's future, and most people in this region of the world have no doubt about that.

I've also heard many economists predict that, if China continues on its path to reform, it [i]will[/i] be one of the world's richest nations within a fairly short period (perhaps ten years). I don't see any reason why China wouldn't be the world's richest/most economically powerful nation in 50 years time. All the ingredients are there -- increasing freedom, market liberalisation, massive technolgical development, political reform, business law reform, world's best practice pursuit, etc etc. The list goes on.

In terms of this space launch...it doesn't really achieve much for China in a physical way. It's more a symbolic thing. China believes that by launching a man into space, this will symbolize its growth and emergence as a major world power. Moreover, there is [i]some[/i] practical benefit to this -- it's expected that China's technology companies will receive greater international exposure and so on.

In any case, I am well aware of China's turbulent history. And I'm accutely aware of China's position in the world today, given that I live in this region of the world. But by the same token, I do not embrace or accept traditional stereotypes of China. I know enough about trade with China and modern Chinese development to be aware that many of the traditional stereotypes no longer exist.[/color]