Magdalena's wrongful ban.

[I, Colossus]

[color=#006699]This may be against the rules, I honestly don't know. I can't remember reading anything about it, so I'm going out on a limb here.

I think Magdalena was wrongfully banned. Syk3 usually makes wise decisions in his modding, but I think he may have gotten a little defensive with this involving Mei and whatnot. Magdalena was harsh when speaking of the banner, but she apologized and was forgiven.

I know that wasn't why she was banned, she was banned because of [URL=http://www.otakuforums.com/index.php?act=ST&f=8&t=32433&st=0]this.[/URL] Syk3 says she was banned because she told people on another forum to come and flame us. As you can see, it was their own conscious desicion to come here and say the things they did (and I belive it was just one person). And before anyone says "Well if she hates it, it shouldn't matter" I think I should point out everyone thinks/says they hate something important to them in the heat of the moment. Anyway, I ask she be un-banned, for I see nothing wrong with her actions. She was seeking refuge in another forum, that is all.

[b]Edit:[/b] Wrongful ban is a bit much, I [i]could[/i] be missing some of the story.

[/color]

[Dagger]

From what I can tell, it doesn't seem as though she was inviting them to come cause trouble at OB.

Magdalena was always a little harsh in her critiques. I'm sure she didn't mean to be unkind or impolite, but one generally ought to be a bit more careful with one's words, particularly since it's much easier to take offense over the Internet than in person.

I don't think I know enough about this situation to cast judgment upon any of the parties involved. Although you may have brought up a valid point, I'd prefer to simply trust Syk3's decision and leave it at that.

Besides, one of Magdalena's comments ("So you strive to do worse?") was definitely out of line. No matter how she meant that, it struck me as being unhelpful, antagonizing, and basically rude.

~Dagger~

[I, Colossus]

[color=#006699]Good point, but look at from her stand point. You went a bit overboard on critiquing a banner. the creator of the banner understands what you mean, but comes back with another arguement (not arguement I can't think of the word at this moment). So you get frustrated, make some hasty comments, and after being told it was wrong apologize. But the moderator continues to tell you, why you were wrong.

So you vent on another forum. One person takes it upon him/herself to cause trouble here. And then YOU get banned.

Doesn't seem fair to me, unless I'm missing something here.
[/color]

[Kyo no Ryu]

Think of it this way. She feels bad so she tries to find agreers to make her feel better then BOOM banned.

[Charles]

Let me try to deal with this.

At first, I was a bit taken back that Magdalena was banned for her actions on another board. But, before I could take issue with this I took a step back and looked at the situation for what it is: nasty and mean spirited.

If this individual wants to rant about her disapproval with OtakuBoards on another forum then so be it. Having said that, however, I hardly think it was fair to try to publicly humiliate one of our members by putting them on display and saying "This banner sucks doesn't it" and then proceeding to call it "****." Where's the class in that? It's not very nice at all. If you don't see anything wrong with that, I'm sorry.

Wouldn't it have been just as easy for Magdalena to private message James, myself, or even Syk3 about the situation if she thought it was unfair? It sure would have been the respectful and mature thing to do. Perhaps I would have been able to see things from her point of view. Maybe she could have convinced me that she wasn't trying to be malicious and that Syk3 was overreacting a bit. But, that thread she made immediately disproves that theory and reveals what her intentions really were.

Everyone should remember that we don't ask for a lot in the art forum. Just that people critique maturely and do their best to offer pointers so that they can help along others. If you're not providing insight or anything of value--then you shouldn't be posting at all. Magdalena might have a chip on her shoulders when it comes to her artistic ability but her people skills leave much to be desired. And a true artist can communicate their message with the intention of helping others rather than degrading them.

And most importantly, people should try to remember that the art forum is a recreational board. Not everyone is going to post masterpieces. So it's hardly fair to come down on them just because you don't appreciate what they put up in comparison to your own work.

I might or might not have the final word on this but as far as I'm concerned I don't want someone like that participating on these forums. So, you can bet your bottom dollar that I won't be the one to reverse the ban.

[I, Colossus]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Charles [/i]
[B]Let me try to deal with this.

At first, I was a bit taken back that Magdalena was banned for her actions on another board. But, before I could take issue with this I took a step back and looked at the situation for what it is: nasty and mean spirited.

If this individual wants to rant about her disapproval with OtakuBoards on another forum then so be it. Having said that, however, I hardly think it was fair to try to publicly humiliate one of our members by putting them on display and saying "This banner sucks doesn't it" and then proceeding to call it "****." Where's the class in that? It's not very nice at all. If you don't see anything wrong with that, I'm sorry.[/B][/QUOTE]

[color=#006699]Who cares if it's mean spirited. It didn't happen here, OB's rules don't apply to the rest of the internet. The point of that link was to show you she didn't lead them here to flame us. That's like banning me, for saying "I don't like Charles, he sucks" to a friend of mine. =p[/color]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Charles [/i]
[B]Wouldn't it have been just as easy for Magdalena to private message James, myself, or even Syk3 about the situation if she thought it was unfair? It sure would have been the respectful and mature thing to do. Perhaps I would have been able to see things from her point of view. Maybe she could have convinced me that she wasn't trying to be malicious and that Syk3 was overreacting a bit. But, that thread she made immediately disproves that theory. [/B][/QUOTE]

[color=#006699]Yes, it would have been easier for her to PM one of you. But one has trouble PMing someone when they are unable to see the board...because they're banned. :p Also she told me she had a chat with Syk3 recently, as did I. But sometimes you need second opinions.
[/color]
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Charles [/i]
[B]Everyone should remember that we don't ask for a lot in the art forum. Just that people critique others maturely and do their best to offer pointers so that they can help along others. If you're not providing insight or anything of value--then you shouldn't be posting at all. Magdalena might have a chip on her shoulders when it comes to her artistic ability but her people skills leave much to be desired. And a true artist can communicate their message with the intention of helping others rather than degrading them.
[/B][/QUOTE]

[color=#006699]Once again, she apologized.[/color]

[Charles]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Shroom [/i]
[B][color=#006699]Who cares if it's mean spirited. It didn't happen here, OB's rules don't apply to the rest of the internet. The point of that link was to show you she didn't lead them here to flame us. That's like banning me, for saying "I don't like Charles, he sucks" to a friend of mine. =p[/color][/b][/quote]

I wouldn't care so much about that and it's not my point at all. Here's where my problem lies. Someone's work was paraded around and degraded. I accept the fact that we don't police the Internet. And I generally do not endorse a ban because of someone's actions on another forum. You, yourself, can go and create a million "OtakuBoards sucks" threads across the Internet if you wish and I won't care.

But, when you provide a link to someone's banner and claim it sucks so that others can point and laugh, I take exception. I don't think Mei deserved that kind of treatment at all.

It's like when we had the imposter attacks here at OtakuBoards. They didn't directly take place on the forum. But, the actions could have potentially hurt the feelings of others and that in and of itself is directly related to the site.

[quote][b][color=#006699]Yes, it would have been easier for her to PM one of you. But one has trouble PMing someone when they are unable to see the board...because they're banned. :p Also she told me she had a chat with Syk3 recently, as did I. But sometimes you need second opinions.[/b]
[/color][/quote]

Wait a second. Wasn't she banned [i]during[/i] this problem? My point is that she could have used the private messaging system prior to creating the thread. And even if she just [i]had[/i] to create the thread, it could have been formatted in a different manner. She could have said "Oh, look how unfair they are; I'm critiquing this person and immediately they accuse me of personal attacks."

I wouldn't have minded. As I said, there's a good chance I would have taken her side on this situation to an extent. But, to take the route she did and single out someone's work in such a venemous way--that just doesn't fly with me.

[quote][b][color=#006699]Once again, she apologized.[/color] [/B][/QUOTE]

Yes, that's fine. But, I didn't mind what she posted within Mei's thread. That wasn't much of an attack as far as I'm concerned. But, then go on and see the second side of this apology. How sincere is it, really? She apologizes here--but go there and it's an entirely different story.

And I'd like to illustrate this further.

[quote][b]But the second time, I did nothing. I was a little harsh, that's all. I'm sure you got over it.

I tend to be a lil brutal in my critiquing, but it gives people a wake up call, that maybe the 8.5/10's others give may not be as deserving as there is always room for improvement. [/b][/quote]

How is that an earnest apology? "I'm sure you got over it."

There's no accepting blame here. It's very passive.

Furthermore, she shouldn't be making excuses for posting something completely negative just because people are posting too positively in general.

Magdalena has discussed this situation at length with me on AIM and expressed her desire to improve and she's made clear her regret about making harmful comments. Yet, it's difficult for me to go back on this. I'm tired of sitting down with members who act inappropriately and are readily sorry when the consequences roll around.

This is a very controversial situation. I'll admit that. And I'll also be sure to think it over at length. She recognizes that she made a mistake and I recognize there was overreating with how the staff handled the situation on a certain level.

As I said though, that's no excuse for lashing out at someone who didn't even deserve it.

I'd personally like to hear what James thinks about the situation. Remember, he can override any decisions I make on cases like this. Considering this isn't such a clear-cut situation we'll just see what happens.

[James]

[color=#707875]Well, the fact is...the discussion at OtakuForums would not even be allowed to float over here. Do you really think I would allow someone to make a thread based on attacking someone's art?

I'm not saying that this has anything to do with another board, because it doesn't. This is only a question of Magdalena's actions.

My only input into this discussion is that Magdalena has been banned on a previous occasion by me, for being rude to members. I spoke to her over AIM, she apologized and I allowed her to return -- on the condition that she demonstrate courtesy to our membership. In this case, she hasn't done so. She's also single-handedly said that every one of our members creates horrible artwork, which I know is certainly not the case.

So, I don't really have very much sympathy for Magdalena in this situation. She was given a chance by me and she didn't meet her own agreement with me. She had her chance and that's that.

I cannot speak for other boards or web forums, but I can only say that we [i]don't[/i] allow blatant rudeness at OtakuBoards. We expect members to treat other members with respect and dignity -- in the case of art, we want people to display [i]constructive criticism[/i] and not pointless, mean-spirited comments. Not only does this actually provide for better discussion, but it doesn't discourage people from posting their artwork.

Magdalena's intentions may not have been malicious, but she is old enough to understand that being rude isn't going to help her at all. It's up to her to take responsibility for her comments. As I said, Magdalena has had her chance. [/color]

[wrist cutter]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by James [/i]
[B]I cannot speak for other boards or web forums, but I can only say that we [i]don't[/i] allow blatant rudeness at OtakuBoards.[/B][/QUOTE]

I'm still here, aren't I?

[Harry]

She's always bitching about OB, it's time to let her go.

[Brasil]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by wrist cutter [/i]
[B]I'm still here, aren't I? [/B][/QUOTE]

Indeed you are, but you display an intelligence in your sarcasm, unlike Magdalena, who is just a stupid ***** trying to sound sarcastically intelligent.

Magdalena, as James and Charles have so eloquently pointed out, has been warned in the past, and has been banned before for her negativity.

Like Dayday, she has no regard for OB members, saying directly negative things just for the sake of saying them.

One thing strikes me as odd, however; Magdalena [i]tries[/i] to sound harsh to OBers that who do not demonstrate strong will. But, when one such as myself (a very strong-willed person and one that will rip another apart) posts some artwork, Magdalena doesn't crit with the negativity of other artwork. Sounds funny, I think.

Magdalena is nothing more than a PoisonTongue Poseur, a wannabe. She doesn't know the first thing about crit, nor ripping. She [i]tries[/i] and fails miserably.

Shroom, don't argue for her; don't defend her; she is an idiot. Defending her makes you look like an idiot. Don't be an idiot.

[Harry]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by PoisonTongue [/i]
[B]
One thing strikes me as odd, however; Magdalena [i]tries[/i] to sound harsh to OBers that who do not demonstrate strong will. But, when one such as myself (a very strong-willed person and one that will rip another apart) posts some artwork, Magdalena doesn't crit with the negativity of other artwork. Sounds funny, I think.[/B][/QUOTE]
Maybe she likes your work.

[Fyxe]

[SIZE=1][COLOR=darkblue]I totally agree that she needed to be banned. What she said wasn't acceptible. And they have no right to talk about us like that on other forums. We have some very good artists here and they work hard to make they're work great. I appreciate everyone's work here, because it's that they tried that counts. Plus Mei said that wasn't her best work. But these people shouldn't be saying such negative things toward us. We keep the people that follow the rules and keep most of the negative comments to themselves. That what makes the OB so great. So they can say what they say, but she deserved to be banned... there's my opinion.[/COLOR][/SIZE]

[Brasil]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Harry [/i]
[B]Maybe she likes your work. [/B][/QUOTE]

Could be,

[url]http://www.otakuboards.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=501688#post501688[/url]

But I'd say she just didn't know what to say, because she knew I could rip her a new one should she start flinging ****. :D

Her PoisonTongue Poseur nature shone through.

She was rightfully banned, indeed.

[Shinmaru]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by James [/i]
[B][color=#707875]I cannot speak for other boards or web forums, but I can only say that we [i]don't[/i] allow blatant rudeness at OtakuBoards. We expect members to treat other members with respect and dignity -- in the case of art, we want people to display [i]constructive criticism[/i] and not pointless, mean-spirited comments. Not only does this actually provide for better discussion, but it doesn't discourage people from posting their artwork. [/color] [/B][/QUOTE]

I think that's the biggest issue with all of this: the criticism that actually takes place in the Art & Design forum.

Really, a lot of it just isn't up to par. It's either one of the extremes most of the time; someone says that a person's work sucks or they kiss the person's *** and say their work is the greatest thing in the world. There are disturbingly few people who actually try to be objective and give good criticism. That is, they point out both the flaws and the good points about the work and provide an intelligent opinion.

I know for a fact that Syk3 has been trying to correct this for ages - trust me, more often than not you'll see him asking people to be more constructive with their criticism than just posting "Your banner sucks!" or "OMG! Your banner rules!" I venture into the Art & Design forum quite a bit...I'd like to think I know what I'm talking about even though I'm not much of an art aficianado.

I completely support the ban and not just because of what Magdalena was doing on OF. I'd like to think that this might just send a message to people who provide sub-par critique when they speak about a particular persons work.

[Epsilon]

I support her banning ,actually. Shroom, most points of view are obviously up for banning her. Are they not? Shouldn't that mean something? Going back and looking at [U]most[/U] she had ever made in the art and design forum, they've been very negative/curtly towards most members. That and pointing to the fact that most of her post through out he board has been ill mannered, unacceptable, and negative. The way she had apologized, actually, had still been ill mannered. Giving out links to other boards, saying to come here and flame a memeber is unacceptable. The way she had gone about her crits was also unacceptable.

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by PoisonTongue [/i]
[B]
One thing strikes me as odd, however; Magdalena [i]tries[/i] to sound harsh to OBers that who do not demonstrate strong will. But, when one such as myself (a very strong-willed person and one that will rip another apart) posts some artwork, Magdalena doesn't crit with the negativity of other artwork. Sounds funny, I think.
Magdalena is nothing more than a PoisonTongue Poseur, a wannabe. She doesn't know the first thing about crit, nor ripping. She [i]tries[/i] and fails miserably.
[/B][/QUOTE]

Either she admires you, or she can't match your crits. Adding to what was said before about her attitude and her rudeness. Magdalena tended to pick on certain members.

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Eternal Otaku [/i]
[B]Think of it this way. She feels bad so she tries to find agreers to make her feel better then BOOM banned. [/B][/QUOTE]

Eternal Otaku, very nicely put. The fact that she didn't have a very open mind, and chose to seek their help in degrading others. Some of Magdalena's post would probably fall in under the breaking of this rule, mostly the underlined part.

Rules On Verbal post:

[B]·Verbal Abuse:[/B] Verbal abuse includes swearing and/or any inappropriate language directed toward either a member or a staff member. [U]Any form of threat, insult or inappropriate behavior towards a member or staff member is viewed very seriously by OtakuBoards.com.[/U]

What she had done, probably fallows the insulting many memebers. Although the art and design forum would like better pointers and comments then. "OMG! That banner sucks" or "That's a great banner!" I for one felt that she over stepped it commenting when she had insulted so much, and rarely even said anything that helped at all. (Besides the comments to help put down OBer's down and insult them.) Most of her comments could have been at least been said more polite then the way she had said them.

[Semjaza]

A few things here. I like Magdalena. I've talked to her several times on AIM and I've found her to be a really nice person. She just seems to like to be somewhat aggressive on message boards concerning things she personally finds "stupid". This is why she seems to go after certain members more than others. I and many other members here do the same, honestly.

Now personally, I do agree that Syk3 got rather defensive over something that really wasn't a huge deal. I've seen other people say similiar things concerning this before, so I didn't see what was so terrible. Any problem was made even worse due to the senseless bickering.

The whole OtakuForums thing was rather lame, but that's another place. We're not responsible for it and whatever they do, they do. She started the thread, but it didn't seem like she was egging them on anymore after that... the subsequent posts were all other people coming up with their own complaints. Still, I do feel the thread itself was rather lame, but what more is there to say about it?

People also seem to forget that Magdelena had another account here for that. A lot of people thought she was problematic then, but she was never banned. She came back under another name. Most in charge of this place knows this too, I don't know about most other members here (I'd assume not considering comments in the picture threads, although I know Harry knows).

As such you have to take both into mind when making these decisions. While I personally liked her, as I said before, if Charles or James feels someone should go... that's just how it is. They apparently felt that she was having a negative impact on the boards, and that alone is enough reason for them to remove her. This isn't a democracy (I learned this at GAF -- now that was a [i]wrongful[/i] ban).

[Mei]

[color=green]I'm just going to let you all know that Magdalena and I have worked this out, at least most of it, and hopefully this little argument will end soon. The main thing I wanted her to understand was my point of view, and I understand hers. We've done so, and all is well between us.

Now, I'm going to post a conversation between us over AIM, just to show that she isn't near as "bad" as made out to be, and that, if you get to know her, she can be very considerate.

Ox Magdalena xO: Mei, I just wanted to apologize for what I said.... I feel really bad
SSWolfGirl4: Oh, it's fine, really.
SSWolfGirl4: I'm not that concerned about it, I was just a bit hurt about the actions you took.
Ox Magdalena xO: I just never realized that I was as harsh as I was
SSWolfGirl4: The fact is though, I'm happy you apologized, and I myself am sorry for the trouble I caused you.
Ox Magdalena xO: I looked over my thread I made at OF... I feel bad.... I was just aggravated, and I was stupid enough to say things I don't mean
Ox Magdalena xO: You caused me no trouble, actually
SSWolfGirl4: We often say things just out of anger or other emotions driven behind us.
Ox Magdalena xO: haha, sadly people take mine a little too seriously
SSWolfGirl4: It's just something we learn to control over time, and it's hard to deal with, but I understand your position, really.
Ox Magdalena xO: I just want you to know I didn't mean to hurt you
SSWolfGirl4: I know you didn't, and I'm glad.^^
Ox Magdalena xO: :)
Ox Magdalena xO: I just remember appreciating someone being brutal with my stuff, it drove me to improve... i kinda forgot that people are different in that respect
SSWolfGirl4: I understand that, I guess I'm just new to this type of stuff, and Syke knew that very well.
SSWolfGirl4: Though his decision may have been a bit hastey in it all.
Ox Magdalena xO: Well he obviously cares about you
SSWolfGirl4: Yes, and I'm glad for that.^^
Ox Magdalena xO: I've probably said worse to others, and he did nothing. He just proves that he really really cares about you :)


This has brought some calm over me, and I'm happy we were able to have this talk. I just wanted to let you all know, that though her behavior on OB may have been a bit out of line, you do not need to judge her character on it.[/color]

[Dan Rugh]

[quote][b]Verbal Abuse:[/b] Verbal abuse includes swearing and/or any inappropriate language directed toward either a member or a staff member. Any form of threat, insult or inappropriate behavior towards a member or staff member is viewed very seriously by OtakuBoards.com.[/quote]

Why isn't this being taken into consideration with other members such as PoisonTongue? I was reading the thread titled "Are Humans Monsters" and some of the things he said to Deathbug are a perfect example of verbal abuse, not to mention all the swearing.

[b]Examples:[/b]
"you are the definition of naive"
"You are an idiot. No offence, of course, but you are an idiot."
"Braindead. We should send you to the Australian outback"
"Now I know you're an idiot. No doubt about it."
"I am going to say again; you are an idiot with absolutely horrid interpretive skills. You would have to be the dumbest waste of space to use that analogy."
"You idiot. Do you have any comprehension in that skull? Do you have any brain matter in that skull?"

Why is this going unnoticed?

*waits for verbal attack from you know who*

[color=red]EDIT: I personally could care less that she was banned, I just think that the verbal abuse rule should be consistent with all members.[/color]

[Semjaza]

As I've said before, none of you are taking into consideration her other screen name whatsoever. I had so many people complain about her to me alone, upon which I usually told them to relax and not take things so personally... but whatever. I'm sure those aren't her only posts taken into consideration and it's not simply because of "verbal abuse".

I've never had a problem with her. She's always been genuinely nice to me and I enjoy talking to her when she's around.

In any case, I'm getting the picture that some of you care more about her ban than she even does.

[Harry]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by PoisonTongue [/i]
[B]Could be,

[url]http://www.otakuboards.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=501688#post501688[/url]

But I'd say she just didn't know what to say, because she knew I could rip her a new one should she start flinging ****. :D

Her PoisonTongue Poseur nature shone through.

She was rightfully banned, indeed. [/B][/QUOTE]
You're giving yourself too much credit there man.

[Charles]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Semjaza Azazel [/i]
[B]In any case, I'm getting the picture that some of you care more about her ban than she even does. [/B][/QUOTE]

That's a good point, actually.

When I spoke with her she readily admitted that she made a mistake and therefore willingly accepted the consequence. At no point did she make a plea to have her account restored. Instead, she seemed more concerned with describing the situation from her point of view.

I think that some people are just interested in gaining their own personal victory here.

Now, to generally address this situation--this isn't about her character as a person. So, I don't see why anyone is blatantly calling her names. I'm confident that I can safely say that most everyone who gets banned from a message board isn't an inherently [i]bad[/i] person. Furthermore, we don't ban for personal reasons. People are analyzing the ordeal a bit too deeply. :rolleyes:

What we have here is someone who acted inappropriately in an already exaggerated situation. As I've stated in this thread and directly to her, I can sympathize with her to a great extent because the situation was blown out of proportion by our staff. I didn't approve of the way it was handled to begin with. And I know James feels the same way. To be sure, either of us would have [i]supported[/i] her with the problem should she have handeled it properly. I think I've said this already. Judging from her past experience with the site, I think she should have known better.

Unfortunately she didn't. Instead she opted to act recklessly and she created a thread attacking someone's art. That's where my problem lies. My decision was never based on her "rallying" people to come here from another forum and flame OtakuBoards; I think I've made that very clear. It's obvious that wasn't her intention.

In the end this isn't a matter of liking someone or not liking them. This is about running things objectively. I'm glad that Magdalena had enough integrity to recognize her harsh behavior and mend fences by apologizing to Mei. I think that's the most important thing here.

Other than that we're just running an online message board forum and handling things how they need to be handled.

As for the PoisonTongue trouble--I've noticed that his posts in that thread have not gone unwarned. I'm glad for that. It is true that Deathbug provoked him, but I think PT's retaliation was too much. I certainly don't want to see that sort of behavior again. I know he's intelligent enough to conduct a discussion without verbally abusing others. So, that's what I want to see from now on.

It's not as if requesting our members act respectufully towards one another is a bold new innovation.

[Transtic Nerve]

She doesn't like the boards apparently... consider being banned a favor. I mean if I don't like the food at a restaurant I go to, I'm not stupid enough to continue going there... thats just plain idiocy. Thats like saying "Hey you shot me with your gun and it hurts and I'm bleeding... do it again"...

I personally think this is all a bunch of BS. All of you maniacs need to get a life. Message Boards are supposed to be fun, recreational activities while you're on the internet, not life consuming acts that require you to give up your personal time to b*tch about. Please, spare me your troubles. When you get into the real world, give me a call.

[Heaven's Cloud]

[color=indigo]Okay, I don't really know the situation other than what I read in this post, but I have been around here for awhile and I have seen threads like this come and go with nearly every banning. It is hard to get banned from the Otakuboards, actually it is impossible as long as you show some basic manners and a little bit of common curtisy. James and Charles tend to be the ultimate distributers of second chances. Magdelena already had one and blew it, end of story, case closed. There are a billion and one other message boards out there for her to post on and make people angry.[/color]

[Meteora]

[color=666666][size=1][i]Ok of what I have heard and things I support the decision. 1 Mainly because if a mod decides to ban someone he did it for a good reason. I dont think a Mod would ban someone just for the heck of it. 2 It seems like she caused trouble or just was palin out rude. 3 James said that he gave her a chance, so all that is left is why wasnt this closed yet?[/color][/size][/i]