Police Raid for Drugs at a High School

[Brasil]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by vegeta rocker [/i]
[B]I fail to see how middle america can bicker over civil rights and emotional scarring when kids are getting high in a haven like school.

How can parents be expected to feel their children are safe?
Yeah the raid was a bit extreme, but so is selling drugs in school.
We are just so used to it that we don't see the magnitude of the situation.

To us its everyday news. Oh another kid got busted....no big deal.
we never stop and think what is happening to us. [/B][/QUOTE]

Are you...I really can't tell, forgive me...are you...disagreeing with the idea that that level of violent action in a high school is uncalled for? That shoving a gun in a kid's face simply because a classmate happens to get high every night...is acceptable?

I agree that drugs suck. I agree they're destroying our society as we know it. But nowhere did I seriously insinuate that nothing be done. The comments I made were in jest...sarcastic...humorous, if you will.

Believe me, I do not condone drug use in high schools or lower. I figure, college students, you're adults. Do whatever you want as long as you don't puke on me.

HC even does not condone drug use, regardless of how many times he got high in high school (no offence, HC).

[quote][i]Originally posted by Heaven'sCloud[/i]
[b]is though I don?t condone drug use, especially at school (how stupid can ya get?), I think that waving a loaded gun at a scared, frightened, impressionable teenager is infinitely more stupid and dangerous.[/b][/quote]

See?

Just one thing more that interests me here.

[quote][i]Originally posted by vegeta[/i]
[b]How can parents be expected to feel their children are safe?
Yeah the raid was a bit extreme, but so is selling drugs in school.
We are just so used to it that we don't see the magnitude of the situation.[/b][/quote]

What would make you feel safer?

1) Having armed SWAT teams barreling through your high school, locking everything down, aiming a Glock right at your forehead?

or

2) A student populace getting drunk and/or high?

I would think more would choose the former, but that's just me.

[vegeta rocker]

I posted earlier that i did not agree with the excessive force used by the authorities in the raid. They did not need to use that particular kind of force.

I however disagree with all the crap about emotional scarring. Maybe that is what they needed. Yeah, im no saint. I've gotten messed up before. But i never let it drift over in high school.

Im one of the people that think marijuana should be legalized, but that's a whole other debate. What I'm getting at is that
the accusation of emotional scarring comes up every time a kid is either questioned or punished.

Yeah so let me repeat myself, they used excessive force in this instance that was totally uncalled for.

I disagree however with the severity of the raid being the first thing parents think of, rather then just what their kids are doing.

[Brasil]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by vegeta rocker [/i]
[B]I posted earlier that i did not agree with the excessive force used by the authorities in the raid. They did not need to use that particular kind of force.

I however disagree with all the crap about emotional scarring. Maybe that is what they needed. Yeah, im no saint. I've gotten messed up before. But i never let it drift over in high school.

Im one of the people that think marijuana should be legalized, but that's a whole other debate. What I'm getting at is that
the accusation of emotional scarring comes up every time a kid is either questioned or punished.

Yeah so let me repeat myself, they used excessive force in this instance that was totally uncalled for.

I disagree however with the severity of the raid being the first thing parents think of, rather then just what their kids are doing. [/B][/QUOTE]

Thanks for clearing that up.

My follow-up question would be...

If you're the parent of a "druggie" high school student, but don't know for certain that your child is into drugs...and hear that this kind of raid happened at your child's school, you would be more concerned with the drug use than your child in the sights of a gun?

And my second follow-up question would be...

"I however disagree with all the crap about emotional scarring. Maybe that is what they needed."

Many here know that I hold very harsh views on capital punishment and punishment in general. If given the option, I would choose a very suitable sentence for a convicted cop killer. I realize that druggie high schoolers are far from cop killers, but [i]nobody[/i] needs a raid like that in any school. No high schooler deserves that, no matter how many lines of coke they're doing, no matter how many joints they've sucked cold, no matter how much of their parents' liquor cabinets is replaced with water.

I certainly think it's foolhardy to just write off the notion of emotional trauma here, simply because it may be overused elsewhere in this country.

This is a case of the end not justifying the means.

One last question.

On 9/11, when you first saw those planes collide into the WTC, did you think of the [i]reasons[/i] why that happened? Were you thinking of a terrorist organization plotting and executing that raid and mused over what their ideologies were?

Or were you thinking what the rest of America was thinking in the first news of it: "Oh my God...the horror! That's so terrible. Oh my God...oh my God...oh Jesus! Those buildings...those people...oh my God..."

?

[vegeta rocker]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by PoisonTongue [/i]
[B]
If you're the parent of a "druggie" high school student, but don't know for certain that your child is into drugs...and hear that this kind of raid happened at your child's school, you would be more concerned with the drug use than your child in the sights of a gun?? [/B][/QUOTE]

I would find out exactly what happened and i would be angry that something like this happened. But THEN i would find out what events put this into play. I would be angry at the fact it happened but i would wonder what kids could be doing to grab this kind of attention. I would be concerned that my kid had a gun at him/her.

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by PoisonTongue [/i]
[B]
"I however disagree with all the crap about emotional scarring. Maybe that is what they needed."

Many here know that I hold very harsh views on capital punishment and punishment in general. If given the option, I would choose a very suitable sentence for a convicted cop killer. I realize that druggie high schoolers are far from cop killers, but [i]nobody[/i] needs a raid like that in any school. No high schooler deserves that, no matter how many lines of coke they're doing, no matter how many joints they've sucked cold, no matter how much of their parents' liquor cabinets is replaced with water.

I certainly think it's foolhardy to just write off the notion of emotional trauma here, simply because it may be overused elsewhere in this country.
? [/B][/QUOTE]

Where is the question?


[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by PoisonTongue [/i]
[B]
This is a case of the end not justifying the means.

One last question.

On 9/11, when you first saw those planes collide into the WTC, did you think of the [i]reasons[/i] why that happened? Were you thinking of a terrorist organization plotting and executing that raid and mused over what their ideologies were?

Or were you thinking what the rest of America was thinking in the first news of it: "Oh my God...the horror! That's so terrible. Oh my God...oh my God...oh Jesus! Those buildings...those people...oh my God..."
? [/B][/QUOTE]

Though i don't see how it relates to the current topic, i was in shock. But thats a stretch comparison and you know it.

[Brasil]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by vegeta rocker [/i]
[B]I would find out exactly what happened and i would be angry that something like this happened. But THEN i would find out what events put this into play. I would be angry at the fact it happened but i would wonder what kids could be doing to grab this kind of attention. I would be concerned that my kid had a gun at him/her.

Where is the question?

Though i don't see how it relates to the current topic, i was in shock. But thats a stretch comparison and you know it. [/B][/QUOTE]

"I would find out exactly what happened and i would be angry that something like this happened. But THEN i would find out what events put this into play. I would be angry at the fact it happened but i would wonder what kids could be doing to grab this kind of attention. I would be concerned that my kid had a gun at him/her."

Comparing that to:

"I disagree however with the severity of the raid being the first thing parents think of, rather then just what their kids are doing."

There are definite conflicting ideas here.

You previously said that you disagree that parents' initial focus be on severity of the raid, and you implied that parents should ask why it happened first.

However, now you seem to be changing your mind and admitting that you would be in shock first (thus having a reaction to in the initial experience), THEN you would seek out why it happened.

Which is it? Do you disagree that parents' first concern should be the situation and then why the situation happened? Or are you agreeing that being worried about the situation comes first?

---

"Where is the question?" You misquoted, and chopped out an entire few paragraphs. You omitted the question.

---

"Though i don't see how it relates to the current topic, i was in shock. But thats a stretch comparison and you know it."

Stretch? Nah. 9/11 was trauma. This was trauma. The definition is the same no matter what the circumstance.

And if you think about it, it relates very well. I asked you what your reaction was on 9/11, a very traumatic day. You replied with shock. Shock. You didn't mention anything about asking why it happened. You were concerned with the moment, with the initial experience, which is precisely what we're talking about: initial reaction to initial stimulus versus the inquisitive reaction to initial stimulus.

Based on your own admittance, you reacted to stimulus before thinking about the stimulus.

[Doukeshi]

Heh, that would never happen at my school. Of course police don't really have guns where I live so it would be pretty rare for armed police to come bursting into the corridors. Anyway, it would make school a little bit more interesting heh. It is a bit strong just for a bit of grass though I mean seriously, if you wanted weed you could go out and get no problem without even being near school. Hell I know loads of people who could get it for me if I wanted it.

[Heaven's Cloud]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by vegeta rocker [/i]
[B]I disagree however with the severity of the raid being the first thing parents think of, rather then just what their kids are doing. [/B][/QUOTE]

[color=indigo]I?d have to disagree with that comment. If I was a parent and I found out that a raid like that occurred, I would initially be very concerned about my son or daughter having a firearm waved in their face why they are forced to lay down in a degrading manner and searched like accused criminals.

Less than one percent of the student body was found to have anything even remotely related to drugs on their person or within their property (lockers, automobiles), yet the administration of the High School compared the drug use on school property to a form of cancer. Obviously the vast majority of the students that attend said high school were guilty of nothing more than being young. It is odd how society so quickly condemns and labels the youth. If one cop was to shoot a kid in error, I doubt that schools would suggest that the role of police officers in schools should be reevaluated. However, if a young person was to shoot a police officer at a school I guarantee that there would be a nationwide outcry for an increased police presence within schools.
[/color]

[vegeta rocker]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by PoisonTongue [/i]
[B]"I would find out exactly what happened and i would be angry that something like this happened. But THEN i would find out what events put this into play. I would be angry at the fact it happened but i would wonder what kids could be doing to grab this kind of attention. I would be concerned that my kid had a gun at him/her."

Comparing that to:

"I disagree however with the severity of the raid being the first thing parents think of, rather then just what their kids are doing."

There are definite conflicting ideas here.[/B][/QUOTE]

I don't see the conflicting ideas. I said before my first thought would be how stupid this raid was. It was too severe. I said that i would think about the drug situation after being pissed at the raid.



[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by PoisonTongue [/i]

You previously said that you disagree that parents' initial focus be on severity of the raid, and you implied that parents should ask why it happened first.

However, now you seem to be changing your mind and admitting that you would be in shock first (thus having a reaction to in the initial experience), THEN you would seek out why it happened.

Which is it? Do you disagree that parents' first concern should be the situation and then why the situation happened? Or are you agreeing that being worried about the situation comes first? [/B][/QUOTE]


I'm saying that I would be pissed but then find out the reason it happened.
What I am saying parents will do is they will get pissed off just like i did. BUT they won't move on to wondering to what the drug situation is.



[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by PoisonTongue [/i]

"Where is the question?" You misquoted, and chopped out an entire few paragraphs. You omitted the question. [/B][/QUOTE]


Well apparantly i was in a hurry, but if the question is, if i would be more worried about my kids being into drugs or having a gun pointed at them.

I would be worried about the gun obviously. Since i have never agreed with this raid.

---
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by PoisonTongue [/i]
"Though i don't see how it relates to the current topic, i was in shock. But thats a stretch comparison and you know it."

Stretch? Nah. 9/11 was trauma. This was trauma. The definition is the same no matter what the circumstance.

And if you think about it, it relates very well. I asked you what your reaction was on 9/11, a very traumatic day. You replied with shock. Shock. You didn't mention anything about asking why it happened. You were concerned with the moment, with the initial experience, which is precisely what we're talking about: initial reaction to initial stimulus versus the inquisitive reaction to initial stimulus.

Based on your own admittance, you reacted to stimulus before thinking about the stimulus. [/B][/QUOTE]

I agreed that i would be pissed about the raid a number of times. I just added that i would move on to other reactions and emotions. Something I'm sure the parents will not do.

And I still don't agree with the whole trauma thing. I don't believe trauma is trauma no matter what the circumctances. A terrorist attack with people jumping out of buildings and planes crashing doesn't remind me much of a raid.

And just so I'm clear, I will say it again.

The raid was stupid,sure it will make some people think about what is going on in their school, but it was stupid. I would rather it never have happened.

[Deedlit]

[color=009966]That is just too extreme.

I don't believe that police can just point guns at students heads, and by just looking at the picture, it looks like they're pointing the guns at students who [i]are[/i] doing what they were told. I can [i]almost[/i] understand if it was a student who wasn't being agreeable, but it's not like they could do anything against the police and a squad of dogs anyway.[/color]

[Queen Asuka]

[color=hotpink][size=1]At my high school I think they did a pretty good job of doing the drug checks. Now, we must all remember, Jones County is the pot capital of Georgia (it HAS to be. It's actually hard to find people who haven't smoked).

This is how they did it: Every so often, very randomly, while we were all away in class, the cops would take the drug dogs around the parking lot. If they barked at your car, you were called out of class, your car was checked and your belongings were checked. If you were caught, you were sent to alternative school. If you were innocent, you were sent, startled, back to class.

I think it's much more humane than the cops running in and putting guns to students' heads. That is extreme. I think it's just a bunch of cops who don't see any action trying to make up for it.[/color][/size]

[Tix]

Woah! That look freaking scary, I would pee in my pants. And on the picture it looks harsh, don't know why. All they do at our school about drugs is prevention and the teachers and staff members know that there's many drug dealers but they just kicked out of the school 2. No raid or else 1/4 of the school will be kicked out...