Gaming Shin Megami Tensei: Nocturne

[Semjaza]

Atlus had finally announced that they are brining SMT3 to the States this past April. About freaking time. People were concerned it wouldn't be localized, but it turns out that Atlus waited to translate the Japanese "Director's Cut" of the game which features enhancements and the inclusion of Capcom's Dante from Devil May Cry as one of the demons.

What is this game? Well, it's the third main game in a very popular RPG series in Japan. None of the previous SMT games have made it to the US, although you can get fan translations online.

However, I'm sure some people here are familiar with the Persona series on the original Playstation. Persona is a SMT spin-off. The original Persona is hit or miss, but Persona 2 is quite possibly my favorite Playstation game. So I'm really looking forward to this one.

SMT is interesting in a few ways... The first being that the game has very religion heavy subject matter. It deals with Heaven and Hell straight out. In one of the previous titles, the boss of the game was actually God himself. Obviously it's kind of in a league of its own in this sense heh.

The game is also known for allowing you to take different paths depending on your alignment -- good and evil, basically. It greatly affects the storyline and isn't just a gimmick like KotOR is, by comparison.

Anyway, here's some little facts about the game from Atlus:

- Yesterday's foe is today's ally! Persuade over 100 different demons to join your party. Some demons may evolve into new forms on their own or fuse them to form even more powerful demons.

- Customize your character with Magatama, living parasites that grant the host demonic powers!

- Depending on the choices you make, you�ll follow one of several ideologies which will ultimately determine the fate of the entire world!

- Special guest appearance by Dante, from Capcom's Devil May Cry series. Will he become your most feared enemy or your greatest ally?

- Over 50 hours of gameplay!

The game is set to come out in Fall of 2004 and will be shown at E3. Japanese impressions of the games release months back were incredibly positive and I only expect good things. Watch this game if you're interested in a really good and deep RPG.

As you can see from the shots, the game goes for a somewhat cel-shading reminiscent style. It looks great in motion in particular.

[IMG]http://ps2media.ign.com/ps2/image/shinmegamitensei3_tgs_092803_01.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://ps2media.ign.com/ps2/image/shinmegamitensei3_tgs_092803_02.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://ps2media.ign.com/ps2/image/shinmegamitensei3_tgs_092803_05.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2004/screen0/582958_20040402_screen017.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2004/screen0/582958_20040402_screen018.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2004/screen0/582958_20040402_screen038.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2004/screen0/582958_20040402_screen040.jpg[/IMG]

[Shinmaru]

The only other time I've heard anything about this series is when I read random reviews of Persona and Persona 2, heh. Nice to get a bit of background information on it, without having to search it out for myself lol.

The premise of the game sounds really interesting to me, especially when coupled with the changes to the storyline that come with your particular alignment. I've seen other games try something similar (most notably Fable, which is NEVER coming out lol), though I can't really think of one that's tried to do it to the degree of this game off the top of my head.

The screens look extremely impressive, too, especially that shot of Death saddled up on the horse...god, that looks so cool lol. Everything there just screams "badass".

I thought it was funny that you left in all the exclamation points and stuff in Atlus' descriptions of the game.

[BlueYoshi]

*Nods*

The first in the series to be released outside of Japan, making its way on the PS2 around spring time over there, not too sure about the US though.

The game looks great particularly with the new cel shaded graphics, a strange but interesting approach for a RPG. The religion factor makes a worthy plot too, as it tells about 'visions' linking to the end of the world in which you, as the player, determine its destiny by making choices that intertwine with each other.

Atlus is still unsure of how the intervention between the two worlds will work however, but the battle system used will be somewhat similar to that of its predecessors on the Playstaion, moving away from the turn-base combat system.

Apparently, as Semjaza already acclaimed, the follown-up of SMT3, or more of a director's cut, called SMT3: Nocturne Maniacs, will include new enemies, areas, and items. Although it's a Japan-only release, all of the new additions to it will be installed to the US release, so yes, we will be seeing Dante after all. :D

[Semjaza]

Okay, this game is coming at the end of this month for the US. I already have it pre-ordered, along with the guide. Anyone that pre-orders gets a Limited Edition version with a 30 track in-game soundtrack packed in.

Atlus has finally updated their SMT site with new information: [url]http://www.atlus.com/smt/[/url]

Here you can find more information on the series, information on the game and characters, English screens, wallpapers, MP3 downloads, a PDF preview of the 400 page strategy guide, etc.

Definitely worth checking out. If people trust my opinion on RPGs whatsoever, they definitely should check this out. For me, it's likely to be the game of the year on all platforms.

[quote] During the infancy of the new millenium, the apocalypse known as the Conception decimates and conquers the world. Patches of the modern civilization begin to emerge from the chaos and attempt to find a way in surviving the aftermath.

Enter Tokyo, Japan, where a high school student goes to a hospital in Shinjuku with his classmates to visit his teacher. All of a sudden, the earth shakes and bright light engulfs everything. As the boy wakes up, he finds himself surrounded by strange creatures ? demons ? and realizes that he himself has turned into one.

With a newfound identity, the boy sets forth on a journey where he must battle against demonic forces for the purpose of bringing order to the chaos. Now, the world awaits on this boy knowing that its fate rests entirely on his shoulders... [/quote]


[IMG]http://www.atlus.com/smt/screenshots/nocturne_04.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://www.atlus.com/smt/screenshots/nocturne_02.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://www.atlus.com/smt/screenshots/nocturne_05.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://www.atlus.com/smt/screenshots/nocturne_07.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://www.atlus.com/smt/screenshots/nocturne_09.jpg[/IMG]

[quote] Fresh from the Press:

*
"...its combination of diverging storylines, deep battle system, and gorgeous cel-shaded graphics, it's an excellent game with the potential to be appreciated by anyone."
- 1up.com

*
"If it's an involved storyline you desire, and you happen to have an affinity for myth and the occult, Shin Megami Tensei: Nocturne may just be the radical RPG for you." 5/5
- Animerica

*
"...an amazing RPG, and an experience that shouldn't be missed by any fan of the genre."
- CosmosGaming.com

*
"We hope that enough RPG players muster up the courage to try it: they won't be sorry."
- EGM

*
"Shin Megami Tensei: Nocturne is not your typical Japanese RPG -- you won't find any bubbly-cute teenagers saving the world from Armageddon here -- but what you'll find is dark and full of rich story content."
- G4TechTV.com

*
"Call it the RPG for the GTA generation. No console RPG to date offers this many choices, this much customization, or so much dark and gritty style. And if anyone pays attention to its content, it might create a little controversy, as well. Previous games in the series have been deemed inappropriate for the US because of some of their religious references. While we've yet to see the translation, all in all Shin Megami Tensei: Nocturne is shaping up to be an extremely solid product and should appeal to any RPG player that gives it a chance."
- G4TechTV.com
*
"The time for Shin Megami Tensei is now, and Nocturne stands as one of the most fascinatingly diverse RPGs to yet make the journey West. "
- GameSpy

*
"A deep and twisted post-apocalyptic RPG with stunning visuals and a mature story -- something quite unlike what we've seen before."
- GameSpy

*
"...one of the more surprising overall games of 2004."
- IGN

*
"Shin Megami Tensei has a long history of controversy, but it seems like the Western market is finally ready."
- RPGFan.com[/quote]

[BlueYoshi]

Ah, somebody's been doing their homework lol.

I've put SMT3 off my agenda for some reason as of late. I don't know why, but it's something that's happening often with me these days. Never the less, I'm glad you made the effort to distribute this stuff, and that shot of the battle screen is well worthy. Looks very similar to FFX, actually. Thanks.

[Semjaza]

The battle system is actually deeper in many senses from what I've read. Plus, from what I've seen, it's much faster paced. Certainly moreso than I expected.

Something interesting that I noticed in the shots I posted was that [spoiler]the female characters in the first two shots is actually the same person. I hadn't paid much attention to the names for some reason.[/spoiler]

My guide is supposed to be shipped on the 14th; two weeks before the game itself. I won't be here when the game is delivered anyway (going to Florida), but I'll make sure to keep updating this with anything worth talking about. I'm sure the guide will have some great information to pass along in here.

I hope some people here actually give this game a chance.

[satan665]

It looks and sounds good, but you never really know until the game comes out and people start playing it. You and PSM will be my Guinea pigs Semjaza.

[Semjaza]

[url]http://www.quartertothree.com/inhouse/columns/77/[/url]

This is a rather long article about the new SMT game and the rest of the series. It's quite interesting if anyone would be willing to take the time to read it.

There's also links to more articles and reviews at [url]http://smt.5u.com[/url]

The Gamespy ones are probably the ones worth reading the most. IGN and Gamespot's information on these games is very limited and mostly regurgitated from elsewhere. IGN's piss-poor coverage of the game at E3 and in general has me somewhat annoyed.

Like I mentioned before, there are MP3s on the main site... but here are some streaming songs from the game thanks to 1Up:

[url]mms://zdmedia.wmod.llnwd.net/a111/o1/Shin_Megami_Tensei_Nocturne/TokyoConception.mp3[/url]

[url]mms://zdmedia.wmod.llnwd.net/a111/o1/Shin_Megami_Tensei_Nocturne/MainTheme.mp3[/url]

[url]mms://zdmedia.wmod.llnwd.net/a111/o1/Shin_Megami_Tensei_Nocturne/ThemeoftheLeadersofReason.mp3[/url]

Like other music in the series, it's quite contemporary and is rather different from most game music I'm used to hearing.

[url]http://files.worthplaying.com/files/modules.php?name=Downloads&d_op=viewdownload&cid=993[/url]

The above link goes to a page that has downloads for a ZIP file containing 13 videos of the game.

[satan665]

The Acne-clad guy at the videogame store said that this game was coming out tomorrow (10/12/04), so i thought I'd pop in this post so It'd spring back off page 3.

I think semjaza has managed to cover all information about the game itself in previous posts,and it does sound like a lot of fun. When someone has actually played it or seen a good review, I encourage you to post about it.

[James]

[color=#707875]I read a review at Gamespy yesterday (I think it was Gamespy anyway lol), which was worth reading.

Basically they seemed to have mixed feelings on the game. The gist seemed to be that the overall theme was pretty cool, but that the story was very light, with more weighting placed on battles. For the most part they were pretty pleased with the battles, but they did mention that the process of collecting demons can become very hit-or-miss.

From my point of view, the sheer theme and visual style seem like a great reason to check the title out. The battle system definitely seems to be very unconventional, with good and bad results. I should check the local release date for this game.

[b]Edit: [/b][url="http://ps2.gamespy.com/playstation-2/shin-megami-tensei-iii-nocturne/552976p1.html"]Here's the review.[/url]

I'm looking forward to seeing what you guys think once you play it. [/color]

[S9per]

I think throwing in Dante is a cheap move.
They're just cheapining the character. Throwing Dante in everywhere. Dante in this and Dante in that.
It's sad when one's guest star library is the same size as his main star game library.
Even sadder when only one of those titles is any good.

Yes, Dante is cool, but stop throwing him in every single game that comes out.
I think I would've wanted the game despite the random cameo/easter egg of Dante being in there.
It makes the game seem more gimicky and only takes away from the main storyline of the game, making it start to seem like it's all about Dante.

I would've been happy if it was just some other cool demon character instead of Dante.

The game does look really cool, and looks like a lot of fun though.

[Guest ScirosDarkblade]

Well, if you ask me, and I know you won't, I want Link in the game. If they put in Link, I'll consider getting it for PS3 later on. No Link, no purchase.

Link hasn't been cheapened enough yet. SC2 was only the beginning. I want him as an unlockable character in Halo 2, DOAU, KOTOR II, and Kingdom Hearts II. Also FF XII. That would be hilarious.

[Semjaza]

I can only think of two games. Viewtiful Joe as a small cameo on PS2 and a bigger role in SMT:N... that's it. Also keep in mind that the same guy is behind VJ and DMC, so I don't see a problem there.

It really doesn't hurt a thing in this game, nor does it poorly affect the character. He was added by Atlus themselves and they asked Capcom after the fact if it'd be okay. It wasn't an attempt by Capcom to cash in on a character with a game they're completely unaffiliated with otherwise. It kind of just worked out and was done in Japan before VJ was even announced for PS2. It was his first, and at the time only, cameo that I am aware of.

In addition to this, Dante plays more of a role in the game than simply being "one more demon". I think his inclusion was well utilized, although I wouldn't care if he wasn't in the game at all. I'm certainly not buying it for him... but perhaps it would help further purchases in this country by people who are more easily swayed by such things. There's quite a few of those types around, as I'm sure we all know lol

So in this case, I think it was a nice move. He has less purpose in VJ than in this game, really... which I think is somewhat ironic.

----------------------------------------------

As for the review, it works and doesn't. I read several praising the storyline in this game, then Gamespy says little about it (going as far as making it seem unimportant is very strange). They also gave it the lowest overall score I've seen thus far (it'd round up to a 7 out of 10), mostly complaining about its difficulty it seemed from what I remember reading. Doesn't bother me, as I think RPGs are too easy lately.

What it does lack, however, is main character development. There are lots of interesting characters in the game, but they are NPCs. Most of your party is simply just recruited for the hell of it. The main character is supposed to be an extention of you, which basically removes any direct actions from him in the game itself. It doesn't have him interacting in massive cutscenes, as he's kind of just a "host" so to speak. Think of Ryu in the Breath of Fire games for an example.

So for people who tie together character with story, I suppose it could be a problem. It's not what this game is going for, and I've known it ahead of time, so it's not a concern or fault in my eyes. I can see why it'd turn off others, but I'd not use it as a complaint personally.

True, the game has a heavy focus on battles. Not only for leveling up your main character, but for leveling the almost limitless amounts of demons you can recruit. Not to mention conversing with them to get them in your party to begin with. In this respect, I suppose an apt comparison would be Pokemon. None of the monsters have any real development, yet you still care about them and want to make them stronger. Same deal.

It's very old-school in that sense. There are many battles and they are difficult. They're peppered throughout very long dungeon segments, which have been mostly abandoned since FF7 took stranglehold of the genre in the late 90s. This game isn't for everyone, especially the way RPGs have changed in the last few years. As such, I can understand why it would appeal to some more than others... but in my case, this is the type of game I want. Perhaps I'm a small minority now lol.

IGNPS2 gave it a 8.6; Gamespot gave it a 8.5; EGM gave it 8, 8.5 and 9, which is a Silver award; OPM gave it a 4.5/5; PSE2 gave it 98%; Xplay gave it 5/5; Animerica gave it 5/5... The game is certainly getting decent enough reviews, and little of Gamespy's issues seem to be mirrored by them, strangely.

----------------

In any case, SMT:N is meant to appeal more to longtime fans of the series (whether or not people realize it, the series has been around in some form since the NES days) and older RPG players. It was a return to the series after ten years, and I think, because of that, it kind of forces them to instill a certain amount of nostalgic elements. Making it super flashy and ignoring its roots wouldn't make sense, especially with all the spin-offs, such as the one I will mention in the next paragraph...

For those who are interested in this style and theme, yet aren't into that sort of "hardcore" thing, there's another game coming here: Shin Megami Tensei: Digital Devil Saga. In Japan, it's simply a spin-off. The title doesn't contain SMT at all. It was added here by Atlus in the US, I assume to form some sort of franchise awareness.

That game actually has complete character development (recruiting is ditched for a system where the characters themselves can turn into demons), more cinematic cutscenes, better graphics in a similiar style, voice overs and so forth. It has the sort of flash that SMT:N lacks in some ways and I think it'll likely appeal to a broader range of people because of it. It was set for Novemeber in the US, but I doubt it'll even make it out this year.

A trailer for that game is here: [url]http://www.atlus.com/dds/movies/dds_trailer1.mpg[/url]

I honestly expect it to get better reviews because of those additions.

---------------------------

Anyway, for those that actually do want this game, it's slipped to shipping on the 14th.

[James]

[QUOTE=Semjaza Azazel]
In any case, SMT:N is meant to appeal more to longtime fans of the series (whether or not people realize it, the series has been around in some form since the NES days) and older RPG players. It was a return to the series after ten years, and I think, because of that, it kind of forces them to instill a certain amount of nostalgic elements. Making it super flashy and ignoring its roots wouldn't make sense, especially with all the spin-offs, such as the one I will mention in the next paragraph...

[/QUOTE]
[color=#707875]Oh yeah, I'm not suggesting that they should make it "super flashy" (though I'm not entirely sure what you mean by that -- FMV, or what?). The game certainly looks flashy enough to me.

From what I remember, the review's main complaint with the battle system was that the player doesn't really know what demons will be necessary in the future. I remember the reviewer saying that it was simple dumb luck that he picked up the right demon at the start, which it turns out he needed later on.

So, I'm not concerned about difficulty as such; only artificial difficulty (ie: difficulty that comes from simply not knowing what you're supposed to be doing). I still have to check out most of the other reviews, as I'm hoping that this particular complaint can somehow be explained by someone else, I mean, I'm hoping that it's something that won't be a problem for everybody.

As it stands, SMT:N is a game that I've been somewhat interested in since I first read about it a while ago (I also saw a short video on X-Play, funnily enough). But, I'm definitely not a longstanding fan of the series, as in, I've never played one of the other games in this particular franchise.

As someone who has been playing games (including RPGs) for a long time (well before Final Fantasy VII came along, lol), I'm definitely not concerned about the more "old school" elements. In fact, if anything, that's something which will only add to the game's appeal for me. But I'm hoping that the game doesn't expect me to stumble upon the right demons at the right time, rather than having some indication of what specific demons might be useful later on. I'm not really sure how one would determine that, but I guess I'll find out.

It reminds me of something with Star Ocean 3 actually. As you probably know, in SO3, you are generally given very little indication of what you must do next (outside of battle). The only solution is to talk to [i]every single person [/i]you can find, in the hope that you'll push things along. It's not quite the same, but that's sort of what I'm getting at (that is, I'm hoping that there's some reasoning behind it, rather than it simply being a clumsy omission).[/color]

[satan665]

Really I'm just sooooo tired of saving the world with a group of mostly happy go lucky adventurers that I want to try it. I'm getting burned out on sequels too (GTA) and since I haven't played any games from this series then its new to me.

Reviews are really helpful, but if you think about it they have to focus on negative things. They'd lose credibility if they failed to mention any downsides. Every game has them and usually they just amount to being a minor nuisance rather than some fundamental flaw. This game seems to be heavy on atmosphere and gameplay, which are a fine combo. As long as its not too scary, which it doesn't look like it will be. ( I still haven't finished Fatal Frame 2, too damn scary).

[James]

[QUOTE=satan665]
Reviews are really helpful, but if you think about it they have to focus on negative things. They'd lose credibility if they failed to mention any downsides. Every game has them and usually they just amount to being a minor nuisance rather than some fundamental flaw. This game seems to be heavy on atmosphere and gameplay, which are a fine combo. As long as its not too scary, which it doesn't look like it will be. ( I still haven't finished Fatal Frame 2, too damn scary).[/QUOTE]
[color=#707875]Of course. I've written reviews in the past (which is my least favourite thing to write), and obviously you have to be as balanced as you can (ie: mention both the positive and negative things).

Basically, I haven't played the game yet. I don't think anyone here has. So, at least initially, I am very interested in reading what the reviews say.

I'm reasonably interested in this title, but I did want to bring up that one point, because it was something that I personally view as being important in an RPG (important for me anyway). So I'm interested to know what others have said about that one particular element, and whether or not it presents a significant issue.

It's a bit like the complaints about camera with Super Mario Sunshine. Most reviews complained about it, but I actually [i]enjoyed [/i]the fact that the camera was almost completely manual. So I don't mean to suggest that I'm suddenly going to hate this game because someone said something negative about it. lol[/color]

[satan665]

[QUOTE=James][color=#707875]

It's a bit like the complaints about camera with Super Mario Sunshine. Most reviews complained about it, but I actually [i]enjoyed [/i]the fact that the camera was almost completely manual. So I don't mean to suggest that I'm suddenly going to hate this game because someone said something negative about it. lol[/color][/QUOTE]


Yeah I didn't think that from your post (You have to defend your posts a lot I bet), I was just thinking that when I read reviews the negatives stick in your mind more, whether they should or not. Unless its a Nintendo Power review, they are uber-biased and sugarcoat everything.

[Semjaza]

I wasn't implying anything towards you James, just what it seems reviewers in general expect from RPGs as of late. I don't think a lot of reviews have taken into account those sorts of things. A lot of the reviews read as if they were judging the game based on what they want and not what it was attempting to do...

As for the demon thing, I suppose if you play the game in a quick, haphazard way, you'd have those problems. There's never a demon in the game that is absolutely [i]required[/i] for anything. Some may be stronger than others, but in the process you're given the ability to see their status as well as what they use to attack your party prior to becoming an ally... I just find the Gamespy complaints to be somewhat unfounded.

At the same time, a lot of time in the game is spent doing exactly what that reviewer seemed to dislike. You're going to be fighting a lot... not only to level up, but to converse and recruit. Most of the time, your attempts to ally with these demons will fail. It must be repeated in an entirely new battle, that's just how the series is lol.

You also have the issue of enemies being extremely resistant to most attacks other than their one weakness... and at first, finding these weaknesses can be a pain. It's a lot of trial and error (although ice creatures get hurt by fire, etc). Now, obviously, most RPGs work like this, but SMT in general is a lot more demanding with it. Don't ask me why.

So I guess that aspect just depends on how you try and play it heh.

Anyway, my copy shipped yesterday. I paid for one day shipping, so I assume it'll be at my house sometime today. I'll leave impressions for everyone, as I figure if the game is disappointing, I'll be the most negative about it lol.

[satan665]

Its supposed to show up at EB games today, and I think that they're the only store carrying it out of the 8 or so game stores. Its really frustrating that way, I had the same problem with Gradius V. I'd think about preordering games but I'm just not that sure that its a good idea before I've heard much about them. Oh, well game stores are getting stupid lately and just load up on copies of Madden and GTA games, you'd think they'd try to get at least one copy in the store of some of the more obscure games. Next thng you know they will start charging more for rare games right off the bat.

[Semjaza]

Atlus games can be kind of problematic. I usually don't see them everywhere, but I always do stumble upon them at Toys R Us. Strangely, even Disgaea was at Target. I didn't expect that.

Atlus apparently is sending out very few copies of this game outside of pre-orders. They did the same with Disgaea, but it sold out completely (apparently to their surprise) and they did another final shipment. Two shipments total and that was it.

I notice most Atlus games kind of sell their shipment over a few months at retail, then excess copies can sometimes be found a bit cheaper... then they disappear and reappear on places like eBay for more money than they retailed for. It's a pain.

Anyway, I got mine in today. I'm going to play it over the weekend and post here with impressions.

Thought #1: The back of the box has the awesome artwork that should have been the cover, in my opinion. Oh well.

Thought #2: The instructions are black and white.................... That's not fun.

Thought #3: Originally scheduled for November, Digital Devil Saga is now scheduled for Spring 2005. Didn't see that coming :rolleyes: . Japan is already getting its sequel very soon.

[OtakuSennen]

[color=navy]I picked up my copy of the game today, and I must say I am incredibly pleased. I have had high expectations for it, but I never thought that the game would be [i]this [/i]cool.

Even before the menu video was finished I was amazed. IGN's little gameplay videos don't do the game justice. The cel-shading is well-implimented, and works well with the eerily lifeless (in a good way) character designs.

I had heard that the battle system wasn't really that amazing, which had me a little worried. It's true that the fighting itself isn't groundbreaking, but enemy interaction makes up for it. Even after three hours of playing I've had numerous conversations, and all of them were cool in their own way. My favorite, so far, is when [spoiler]a Shikigami approached me and said, "The weak do not prey upon the strong. Snakes do not devour dragons. Does this mean that the weak are unnecessary?" I said that they were needed because the strong aren't considered superior without anybody below them, but he disagreed.[/spoiler] Highly entertaining.

People tend to complain about the game's difficulty, but I haven't seen anything that unfair yet. I'm only at [spoiler]the part where you're going through the Amala Network to get to Ginza,[/spoiler] so I'm not really basing that off of much.

The music is impressive, too. It enhances the already vibrant atmosphere.[/color]

[satan665]

Yeah, I would give it high marks so far as well. I'm a little bit farther than you as per your last post, main character at L13. Trying to get the demons on your side during battles is a lot of fun, even though it can be kinda tricky. There are a lot of random encounters in the game, but I actually still like the ramdom encounter system, and am ok with RPG's using it. Its a little more controlled in SMT, cause you know when the encounter is coming most of the time anyhow.

The story is pretty interesting, not scary but a bit ominous. The very beginning was a little creepy but not too much. Having few NPC's is a little weird, but I think it works well in the atmosphere of the game.

Demon fusion really adds to the game, and makes it easier to get higher level demons. You can't fuse to make demons with a level higher than your own though, so you still have to do a lot of fighting to level. Good stuff all around. I have a whole squad of scantily clad lady demons myself and it makes a fun lineup.

Overall 9/10 rating by me so far.

[Semjaza]

I'm very happy to read the posts by you two. I'm not alone in getting this, so hopefully this thread will be interesting heh.

I wrote up some really long impressions/information back at my house (I have no internet right now). I wanted to post it Friday, but they only have Word at my school... I use Open Office and didn't save as a .DOC file...

Anyway, here they are for those interested:

[quote]I've played a few hours of the game thus far and I must say, it has totally lived up to my expectations. Whether or not my expectations are the same as other peoples' here, I don't know. Again, I must say, I doubt everyone will love this game, but in my opinion, it offers everything I enjoy in RPGs.

In terms of presentation, I'm impressed overall. Reviews such as IGN made it seem as if the menus were dull. While there is nothing insane going on, they're quite styled. The menu on the title screen is actually very interesting to look at, I think.

The game also opens up with a montage video of random coinsurances in the game that I think was very well done. The music went with it wonderfully and I think it'll do a good job of getting anyone interested in this game. Great pace, lots of action, etc.

The way it ends is very interesting for me, because it's extremely similiar to the box art for the original Shin Megami Tensei on the Super Famicom. It ends with your character standing in the center, with dark forms of demons and their glowing eyes all around him. This then turns into the title screen.

I'm going to try and get a screen shot of that and illustrate it into a wallpaper. I love it heh.


[u][b]The Beginning[/u][/b]

When you begin a new game (only takes 171KB, surprisingly, to save - insane when I deleted a 300KB+ save for some random action game), you are allowed to choose between "Normal" and "Hard". I stuck with "Normal" for now. "Hard" raises the difficulty in battles substantially, as well as making things more expensive and adjusting other status issues. The game refers to it as a mode for "People who like the thrill of death".


The game starts like the previous two Shin Megami Tensei titles in many ways. You're stuck in an uncontrollable cut scene of sorts where you name your character.

You put in their first and last name, both of which are used often since the game takes place in Japan. Your character is Japanese, so I guess Japanese names make the most sense, but I don't know the Japanese equivalent of "Tony", so I just put in Tony lol. You're also allowed a nickname. This one is rather important because it's what you're referred to in battle, menus and by certain characters. You'll see it more often than whatever you enter for your real name, so make sure you don't regret it. Nicknaming your character "Assbite" might not be the best idea.

At this point, you're given the ability to wander around. I won't get into any more specific details, but now I'll just stick with generic things that I'm not sure people are aware of unless they've been keeping up with this game.

[u][b]The Dungeons[/u][/b]

Every inside area in this game is portrayed as what would be referred to by most people as a "dungeon". This doesn't necessarily mean it's maze-like, as this method is also used inside your High School as well as a local hospital. You basically run around in third person, trying to find points of interest, items, fighting battles and so forth.

Luckily, the game does its best to make this easy. Pressing Triangle brings up a map that shows exactly where you have been before. It is marked with icons showing areas such as healing rooms, shops, stairs and so forth. The map also marks important story areas with a "!", which makes them easy to find if you need to. It also shows you which way your camera (in purple) is facing, as well as a green arrow representing your character's direction.

The main screen also has a compass showing which direction you're traveling in. Inside of it is a flashing light that changes from green to orange to red. This indicates how soon you can expect a new random battle encounter. Sometimes this takes over a minute to fill, sometimes only a few seconds. It just depends on how lucky you are heh.

In addition to this is a little moon cycle icon on the top left. It is referred to as Katsaguchi (I believe that's the spelling). It's the silver moon that resides in the center of the new Tokyo. It has sixteen cycles, going through light and dark. I'll get into what these affect later.


[u][b]World Map[/u][/b]

The world map is unconventional compared to many other RPGs, but typical of MegaTen related games. Basically, you see the area in its entirety (sometimes) laid out before you. You are represented by a small blue triangular icon, which you move around the map to points of interest, somewhat like a board game. Characters to speak to are represented by similar green triangular icons (and later blue, glowing spheres). Important buildings you can enter flash red. In some situations, you can be attacked on the world map, so be aware.

I like this system because it reminds me of tactical RPG games in some ways. Plus, it's nice to not have to run around a massive world map in addition to all those dungeons. The world in these games is so large that creating the entire thing in 3D would be almost unreasonable... likely akin to something like GTA. I don't see why they should bother heh.


[u][b]Battling[/u][/b]

You'll come across demons in both of those areas. They serve as both enemies and allies in this game. First I'm just going to talk about the battle system, as you'll spend most of your time beating the hell out of these guys.

Most encounters in this game are completely random (although you can foresee them as I explained earlier). There are several that occur that are completely unavoidable, such as the obvious boss battles and story-based fights.

On the battle screen are several important areas. Again, on the top left is the Katsaguchi indicator that I'll get into later. The top right indicates whether or not you're into auto mode. It also shows the number of attacks you have per turn, indention's by curled dragon designs.

The bottom of the screen shows your current party's HP and MP, and the right shows the current characters battle options. Pretty standard in that case.

Battles in this game are turn based, although it uses a modified system that isn't directly comparable to any other RPG I know of. It rewards you for finding enemy weaknesses and making critical hits, while also punishing you for missing or making bad moves.

In each battle, you're given as many turns per phase as you have characters present. So if you have four characters in this battle, there will be four curled dragons on the top right, meaning four turns per player phase. After your phase is the enemy phase, on and on... although this can be reversed if an enemy gets the jump on you.

A basic attack, spell or move will cost you one of these turns/dragons. A miss or void will cost you two of these turns/dragons. An attack that is critical or takes advantage of a weakness (and you'll know because the screen will clearly say it) will cause one turn/dragon icon to flicker. In this case, you could potentially link up several spells and attacks an enemy is weak against and beat the crap out of it rather quickly. Icons that are flickering can only be used again once, no matter how many weakness based attacks you make.

For example, let's say you're battling a fire based creature. If you attack it with an ice spell, the little "weakness" icon will appear at the top of the screen. In addition to hitting it for major damage, one of the dragon icons at the top will flash, meaning it wasn't fully used. The game will then go on to your next character, who will now use this flickering dragon/turn instead of a normal one. The battle will continue to cycle through your characters until your turns are used up, at which point it will go to the enemy phase. They are given the same opportunity you are.

So how do you know what an enemy's weakness is? Well, sometimes it's obvious, as in the ice and fire example above. Sometimes it just isn't and will require trial and error. You can also use "Analyze" or a similar command that will show you the enemy's status, strengths and weaknesses. The first time you encounter such a creature, these things will be blank even if you use "Analyze". It takes some time, and possibly notes heh.

The battles are very fast paced. This coupled with the strategy involved makes them enjoyable, I think. If you go into Auto Mode (which can just be attacks or certain moves repeated), it goes even faster. This makes battles with weaker demons less of a chore.

If this doesn't make sense, just ask me questions. It's hard to explain without showing lol.


[u][b]Leveling Up[/u][/b]

At the end of each battle, you're given Macca (money) and experience points depending on what demons you managed to kill. After a certain point, your character will gain a level.

You are given one stat point when you raise a level. This can be applied to any of the stats your character has such as strength, intelligence, agility, magic, etc. It basically allows you to create a different character based on your own desires.

Your character will also learn new magic and skills as he levels up, but these are based on what Magatama he has ingested. I'll get into that next.


[u][b]Magatama[/u][/b]

Magatama, in simple terms, just affects your characters abilities and status. Magatama are what make demons demons, and your use of them makes you a half demon, half human. You'll find these around in the game, some may be free, some may cost quite a bit of money. Each Magatama has a certain importance to it.

Let's say you find an Ice Magatama. It sits in your inventory until you ingest it. Ingesting it makes your character strong against ice, weak against fire and imparts ice magic to him. So when he gains a level, he may learn some sort if ice-based attack.

Properly utilizing Magatama is insanely important to your battles. Do not overlook it, which is somewhat easy to do.

When you level up, there is also a chance that your ingested Magatama will start acting up. You can let it continue to do this, or you can make it stop. If you let it continue, it can do various things. Sometimes it will recover you fully, some poison you (easily cured via items) and some may even curse you. In this case, you need to find a "Lady of the Fount", who can remove curses.

In your menu, there is a separate Magatama section. This will display all the Magatama you have collected thus far. In this menu, you can see the current status of each Magatama. By selecting it, you can see its effects on your status and what skill it will give off next (any skills beyond this are marked as a "?"). In the menu, heavily shaking Magatama will give you a skill if you level up with them once. Lightly shaking Magatama may require two or three levels up. Still Magatama will require around five levels.

This is the limitation of the Magatama system. You can only ingest (aka equip) one at a time. Meaning, you can only learn a max of one skill per level (or even less, if the Magatama requires it). Your character maxes out at Level 99 (although HP and MP will continue to increase as he gains experience), at which point no more skills can be learned. So basically, it's completely impossible to even learn every skill in the game in one play.

In addition to this, your character can only have eight skills at a time. If you have eight and you learn a new one from a Magatama, you can either skip that new skill or use it to replace one of your old ones. Once you replace or skip a skill, it's gone. It's impossible to get again, so you have to choose wisely. It can be a hard decision, but obviously there are stronger versions of spells to replace similar, weaker ones and so forth.

When you learn all the skills a Magatama possesses, it tells you that it is "mastered". You can learn nothing more from this Magatama, so there is little reason to equip it unless you need the status change for a battle or something. Mastered Magatama affect what race your character is considered, as well as his alignment. This is extremely important to other demons when you converse with them.


[u][b]Demons - Conversing[/u][/b]

A bit later into the game (not far in, just not right away), you are given the opportunity to "Talk" to demons. Through this, you can speak to demons. Depending on how it goes, they will may ignore you, attack you, run away, give you items or money and so on.

This is where the Katasguchi icon comes into play. When the moon is at its brightest, most demons are extremely irritable and will have little to no interest in helping you in any way. It's best to try and speak with demons when the moon is dark. This works out well because it allows you to more easily divide between speaking and just plain killing enemies.

Katasguchi affects a LOT of things. From fusions, to luck, to the attitude of demons and so forth. Pay attention to its cycle.

If you manage to interest a demon, they may join your group if you so desire (they don't go into your main party, but into your stock, which is of limited size at the start). Many of them will require some sort of collateral... it may be money (referred to as Macca in this game) or items. If you don't have these items, you basically run the risk of offending them or pissing them off in some way. It's not good as it generally forfeits your phase entirely and lets them attack you.

Demons have up to four requesting cycles. Some will use all four, some may use none or another number in between. At this point, you either comply with their request or make them upset, forfeiting your turn. They generally ask for items that are easy to find, but it doesn't mean you have that item in your possession. If you don't, that will upset them as well. Stronger demons ask for more money or better items.

When you have demons in your party, they also have various talk functions. Fairy type demons usually have "Seduce", annoying demons have "Pester" and so forth. Some of these work better than others in certain situations. Some are used for recruiting, some for just trying to get items or Macca. Choosing any of these costs you a turn/dragon if it gets you nowhere. You can keep trying if you think it'll have an effect, but most of the time the game will tell you if the demon is just not interested ("Not interested in you", "Can't understand you", etc).

These are used in certain ways. If your female demon has "Seduce", it will have no affect on other female demons. However, it will have good effect on male demons.

Sometimes when you attempt to talk to an enemy demon, another enemy demon will interfere. They usually tell you to not bother their friend or something to that effect. In this case, you can either talk to the more aggressive demon or just right out kill one of them (thereby getting rid of the obstacle lol). This seems entirely random, although weaker enemies do not stick up for stronger ones, only the other way around.

Some demons cannot be talked to at all. In this case, there are a few alternatives. Some can be bought at the Jewelry Shop, some can be one over with other abilities (such as Jive Talk), some will approach you randomly, etc. Some will never speak to you and can only be acquired through fusion at the Cathedral of Shadows.

Demons also care about the race and alignment of the being speaking to them. Angelic demons will not join your party if your main character has a dark alignment, and vice versa. Keep this in mind because you can try to recruit such a demon and they'll go along with you, taking your items and Macca... but at the last minute, they'll just run off. Rather annoying.



[u][b]Demons - Party Leveling and Fusing[/u][/b]

Once you recruit a demon, it goes into your stock. At the start of the game, your stock only maxes out at ten. From what I understand, you can raise this as the game goes on. Your actual party (that is, demons used in battle) maxes out at four. In your status menu, you're allowed to sort out who you want in your party or stock at will. You're also given the option to summon stocked demons in battle if you so desire, but they can only replace demons that have gone back in the stock (demons can also leave a battle when you so desire).

As you battle with demons in your party, they level up just as you do. In the case of the main character, at each new level, you're given one point to distribute amongst his stats as I said before. For demons, this is automatic and you have no control over it. Demons also learn new skills as they level up. Some older skills can also transform into newer, more powerful skills (but you can deny them this, if you desire).

As demons level up, some will also show "signs of change". This is basically an evolution. If you raise them a few more levels at this point, they will begin to manifest into a whole new demon. You can deny this if you so desire. For example, a Pixie can transform into a High Pixie fairly early on.

When a demon levels up, there's a good chance that a gift event will occur. When this happens, the demon will try to talk to you. You can ignore him, but there is no reason to as you only get useful items through this (some pretty rare) and risk offending the demon.

Later in the game, you'll come across a place known as "The Cathedral of Shadows". This place allows you to fuse demons, taking two and forming them into one new, more powerful ally.

When you choose to fuse two demons, the chart in the Cathedral will show you the results before hand. There are various icons which tell you whether or not the fusion is even possible.

In some cases the fusion will result in a demon so powerful that your character can not control it (this is based simply on your level compared to the demon's level). You cannot summon these demons until you meet the requirements. It seems as though you have to be within five levels or less of the demon you wish to summon (if you're higher than the demon, that's even better lol).

Fusions allow you to get demons that you might not find at that point of the game in a dungeon or on the map. They also allow you to acquire demons that simply are completely against being recruited in battle.

At times, a fusion may fail, resulting in a weak one. This is the risk you must take, so it's advisable to save before fusing two of your best demons.

A bit later in the game, you are given new fusion options, such as the Sacrificial Fusion. This requires three demons. Two fused together, and one sacrificed, making the result stronger. This requires a Full Katasguchi though, which means it can only be done at certain times. It's also supposedly more risky according the man who runs the Cathedral.

There is also a Jewelry Shop in certain areas of the game. Here you can trade gems and jewels you've collected for types of demons that are nearly impossible (or completely impossible) to get on the field. Many of these demons are elemental types (and another type I forget), which affect fusions in a different way than normal demons.

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Now that that's out of the way, I'm going to talk more about more aesthetic things.

[u][b]Graphics[/u][/b]

Graphically, I'm rather impressed by this game. It's going for the minimal in many cases, but seems to be doing so purposely. The game just absolutely oozes style, more obvious in person than in movies and shots I've seen. It uses some sort of cel-shading, but it appears differently than in many other games I've seen it used in. It's comparable to the style that was later used in The Wind Waker, only with realistic settings and characters. The character designs really stand out in this game, I think.

Characters and enemies are excellently modeled and detailed. Despite there being no voices, characters still do move their lips when you speak to them. IGN complained that most of the animation was not very good, but to be honest, I've seen no problems outside of the sometimes stiff walking animations of the main character (which only seems to happen when you chain together walking and running). In battle, I've not noticed anything that I found strange.

The game also seems to employ some sort of blur filter. It's very light and subdued, but I do notice it. This doesn't mean things in the distance blur, but that lights and such when you run around have a slight trail to them (nothing as major as in GTA, just very small). It's most obvious when you look around with the right stick or turn the camera.

You move the camera with L and R. The right stick is not used for this because it is used to let your character look around. At times this is useful, but most of the time its just a novelty. I like using it because there is often more modeled in an area than you can actually access (like looking out a window for a better view).

As for the bad stuff... I notice a slight bit of slowdown in very, very few areas when a door is opening. I assume because the game is loading up whatever is next and the graphics aren't a priority. This is just nitpicky and hardly a problem... especially when the loading in this game is among the best I've come across in a 3D PS2 game. It's up there with Nintendo's GameCube titles' loading speeds.

There is also a slight bit of shimmering when the camera takes certain diagonal angles. Nothing horrible and completely normal for a good portion of PS2 games as it is. I'm sure most people are used to it by now. It doesn't approach the annoyances of the shimmering in, let's say, Wild Arms 3.

[u][b]Sound[/u][/b]

The sound is great. I really love the music, personally. If you've played Persona 2, it's somewhat similar to that, but with far less J-Pop. The game makes a great mix of synth and crunchy guitars, resulting in a sound that is completely different from other RPGs out there right now. I really enjoy it.

The sound effects are strong and work well. Most demons make some sort of sound, but your character is silent. No one in this game speaks out loud. If this is a breaking point for you, wait for Digital Devil Saga which is fully voiced lol.

If you pre-ordered or get a very early copy, you'll get a free soundtrack. It's 33 tracks, but doesn't cover the entire game. I've listened to it as I type this and have yet to find it annoying.


[u][b]Translation[/u][/b]

The translation is good. Atlus, in the past, could be faulted for their somewhat odd translations even as late as Persona 2. While none of these translations were anywhere near problematic or crippling, they still had strange points to them. SMT:N doesn't suffer from this, much like Disgaea. Atlus seems to be pushing forward in this area, which is wonderful.

Nothing is confusing, characters are portrayed well and their dialog is fitting (Chiaki, for example, is somewhat cold and puts responsibility on others while still trying to seem important, which fits her character's description very well). Some have different accents and ways of speaking, which helps set them apart.

As in any RPG, some characters never have anything useful to say. Some are just annoying, some are useful, etc.

The game stays true to its Japanese roots. Most games take an English version of names when translated, even Persona did this. SMT, however, makes constant references to taking place in Tokyo, so everything reflects that. It can make some names hard to remember, for me anyway, but it's better than having Susan Johnson and Billy Smith running through some sort of demonic Japan.


[u][b]Story[/u][/b]

I find the story thus far to be very interesting. It's very occult and religion centered, just like the past Shin Megami Tensei games. Unlike Xenogears, for example, this game is referenced and what it uses is properly utilized. The game has a bibliography of somewhere in the neighborhood of 400 books, so it doesn't take its subject matter lightly.

I don't want to give too much away, but basically in the starting moments, the world is destroyed and born anew. This is referred to as "The Conception". References to other important things are made at this point, including an almost Christ-like figure known as "The Maiden", but I'll not get farther into it.

The world is turned inside out, a silver moon appears in the center of it and all humans outside of the central area (in this case, a hospital) are killed. You are turned into a demon with Magatama by a suspicious child accompanied by an old woman. They are actually central characters to the story-line... and although who they were was spoiled for me by the Atlus site (which has since been altered to say "boy and woman" or something), they're still quite interesting in many ways as you really do not know their level of involvement or purpose yet.

Your purpose, at the start of the game, is fueled mainly by the desire to know what is going on. An old man and a young woman push you forward, as does Hikari, the aforementioned occult journalist, who feels that a man named Hikawa (he's introduced earlier) is tied to all of this. Plus you want to find your friends that were with you in the hospital at the time of The Conception and the teacher you were planning on visiting at the hospital back when all was normal in the world.

Your character himself does not speak and I think this will turn off a lot of people. When other characters speak to you, they talk as though you are talking back to them, but none of your actual words are shown on screen. It's like Breath of Fire, Dragon Quest/Warrior or Zelda in this sense... more like Zelda since DQ and BoF don't even give your character an unknown voice lol.

From time to time, you are given choices on what to do or say and these actually affect the outcome of the game... as do several other things. The game relies a lot on your ideology and actions to determine your path and the ending (there are alternates). How interesting your character is really just depends on how you read between the lines and how good your imagination is. I personally like this.

However, the other characters you converse with are quite interesting. Your high school friends, your teacher, the occult magazine journalist who looks a lot like Johnny Depp, etc.

When approaching this game, it's important to know its roots. Obviously it deals with religion, as all SMT games do in some way. It deals with the Judeo-Christian God, who is generally portrayed in these titles as ruthless and unforgiving. Lucifer is portrayed not as Satan (which is a whole other character), but as a freedom fighter of sorts. I find this an interesting twist on the stories about him, that while not perhaps "true", certainly feels plausible.

To give you an idea of how far this game tries to go, in the last title, the final boss would be God himself based on your decisions. While this is obviously negative for religious people, the game is surprisingly respectful with a lot of these elements and doesn't toss them around like, again, Xenogears, without properly utilizing them.

This game also has parts featuring intense violence and blood. Like everything else in this game, I'd refer to it as "tasteful", in the sense that it's not overused or comical. The same can be said of many of the sexual references in this game, as well as the appearance of many demons you'll come across. (A devil early on actually wears some sort of contraption that covers his massive penis that's even longer than he is tall, understandably he mostly talks about how hot the Lady of the Fount is... lol.)

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Here's some other stuff I wanted to mention:

[u][b]DDS[/u][/b]

The main menu also has an "Extra" entry. Selecting this plays a surprisingly long video of Shin Megami Tensei: Digital Devil Saga. I had not seen a lot of what was shown in this video yet and was pretty impressed.

DDS, as I've said before, is far more character-centric. It also is fully voiced and more cinematic. It's been made to appeal more to the modern RPG gamer, basically, and not the gamer who has been waiting ten years for a new entry in the main Shin Megami Tensei line.

Your characters are demons themselves and apparently can transform back and forth at will. This may sound like Persona in some ways, but your characters in Persona never actually turn into demons, they simply reflect parts of the characters' personality. Another face, as the title suggests.

It looks even better than SMT graphically and very interesting, particularly the design of the characters as demons. Looking forward to it. Comes Spring 2005 now.


[u][b]The Manual[/u][/b]

The manual is not sufficient (and it's black and white... blah). They took the minimal route for a reason, I think... if you attempt to be detailed, you're going to wind up with a 200 page book that won't even fit in the case.

It's enough to explain the basics and get you started. That's about it. More is explained in the game itself. If you want more detailed information, you might as well pick up the 400 page Double Jump guide for $20. It has maps and a beastiary... but the first 70 or so pages really just explain the game's set-up and how it works. Worth looking at. Plus it comes with a neat poster (beautiful painting that I think should have been the box art lol) and two paper bookmarks.

The guide is not like something you'd find on GameFAQs, however. It doesn't tell you every last thing to do and look at. It gives maps of each area, along with information on important things in the area, but it doesn't hold you completely by the hand. It still leaves a lot of things up to you, which I personally like.

--------------------------------------------------------------

Anyway, I hope this is sufficient in getting people to understand the basics of how this game is played and whether or not they'd actually be into it. It's not for everyone, but I love it thus far.

This game has my highest recommendation. Just based on what I've played, it's my favorite RPG on the PS2 hands down. It's a lot of fun. I enjoy the characters, I love the references in the game (many of which one may not get if they're not familiar with the particular mythology or religion it refers to, but it's there), I LOVE the dungeon segments, I really like playing around with demon fusions (this is much like DemiKids on the GBA, if anyone knows that... I love the fusion system in that too heh).

The game has a lot of replay value as well. Obviously, in the sense that you'll never get every last demon in one play through, nor will you get every last skill. There's hidden areas, cutscenes, demons and dungeons to be found. You can also change the stats of your character, making how you play different the next time.

There's also the fact that you can try to get different alignments, which affect certain outcomes. There's multiple endings. You can try playing on "Hard" the next time through... Plus, the game features a New Game + mode, which affects more things the second time around. Demon fusing restrictions are removed (you can have a level 50 demon even if you're only level 5, for example) and other such things are added or adjusted.

So yeah, I think it rocks and it has filled my expectations. If it didn't, I'd be in here bitching pretty loudly lol.

However, this doesn't mean it will be your favorite. Keep in mind, my other favorite RPGs on PS2 are Breath of Fire: Dragon Quarter and Disgaea. I haven't really loved a FF since IV (and VI, although far less) and I can't stand the PS2 incarnations thus far (although I expect FFXII to be amazing thanks to who is involved). I mention this since that's obviously the most popular RPG here... My RPG tastes do not mesh with a majority of the people here, so keep that in mind when reading this. I was just hoping that a more thorough explanation on how it works might get a few people more interested, yet at the same time keeping people from buying the type of game they might dislike.[/quote]

Might not be super interesting to those with the game, but I think it might help for those on the fence still. I am actually working on a MegaTen fansite, which will include this game as well as the others in the series... It's in my sig. The design is complete, I just need to build it.

[satan665]

Wooo, I can't believe I read that whole thing, I should win some sort of prize.

I'm excited about playing the game a second time with the fusion restrictions off. I can fuse to make a really cool looking L20 demon if my character were strong enough, but I'm not quite there yet.

One thing thats really fun for me is remembering the time I actually spent in Tokyo. The Subway in the beginning was very true to life, and its cool to wander through the different parts of the city (ruined or not) and remember what they were like. Too bad there aren't Harajuku-girl demons.

Where I'm at now:

[Spoiler]I've made it to Ikebukuro at Level 21 so far, the underground tunnel to get there levels you up really fast, and I went a really long way without being able to heal. I fought Matador, who wanted my candlebraum(sp) as if it were some test of strength. He whipped me pretty good at first, but I fused and got some new demons around L18-19 and used a lot of support skills. He really killes you with his evasion, so using a skill that boosts accuracy and attack wiped him out pretty good. I was hitting for 100+ damage and finally took him down.[/Spoiler]

[Semjaza]

[quote name='satan665][Spoiler']I've made it to Ikebukuro at Level 21 so far, the underground tunnel to get there levels you up really fast, and I went a really long way without being able to heal. I fought Matador, who wanted my candlebraum(sp) as if it were some test of strength. He whipped me pretty good at first, but I fused and got some new demons around L18-19 and used a lot of support skills. He really killes you with his evasion, so using a skill that boosts accuracy and attack wiped him out pretty good. I was hitting for 100+ damage and finally took him down.[/Spoiler][/quote]

Heh, I wanted to cite that battle since Sennen mentioned the difficulty.

To me, it's really the first major battle in the game, since [spoiler]Forneus is a push-over[/spoiler]. The standard enemies surrounding [spoiler]Matador[/spoiler] are challenging... I was able to finish them off, but the battles were longer than most. If you can't pretty much blow through these guys, however, you're just not going to stand against [spoiler]Matador[/spoiler]. Lots of leveling up an fusing helped me out lol. I've still yet to try the Sacrificial Fusing though.

[spoiler]Plus, I noted that his affinity was Force when I battled him the first time (and got absolutely massacred). There's a Magatama for sale in the junk shop that voids out Force for your main character and those furry trunk enemies prior to him are healed by Force, I believe. Very useful.

Even then, though, we're talking about a guy who dodges probably 50 to 60% of your physical attacks, gets two attacks per turn and has a spell that removes all -unda effects (stuff that would lower his accuracy, power, etc). Quite a *****.[/spoiler]

Just have to play the cards, I suppose heh.