Worse types of bullying?

[Vicky]

[SIZE=1][B]What the title says.

What would you class as bullying? And what do you think is the worse type of bullying? There's even bullying online, you know. Older members of forums (not here, well not very often) who bully around the newbies, mocking their post, teasing them and making the newbies want to leave. So I'm talking about all kinds, online and offline.

I'd class anything that makes someone feel "wrong" or uncomfortable bullying. Okay, let me say someone feels uncomfortable standign around you, you must have done something to make them feel left out or lower than you. Hitting, punching, or even pretending to be someone's friend and not being it truly is bullying. Mental bullying is really bad, and if it weren't for some people bullying me around in my younger years (wait... I'm still young... well... you get my point), then I'd make friends a lot easier and I wouldn't be like what I am today (if you know me in real life then I seriously pity you). Bullying is a really, really low horrible thing to do, it's pitiful. Why can't people just like someone for who they are? What's wrong with me watching Cartoons and drawing cartoons? What's wrong with me liking to do English homework because I like writing? Nothing really. I used to like who I was, note the word used too. Because of some forms of bullying, today I don't have the same personality as years ago.

Mental. Mental is the worst. It drives people to change, to do things they don't want to, and it hurts more than a knife. In fact, because of some mental bullying, some people can feel the big gap of pain between mental pain and a knife. I'm talking about Self Harm. Inflicting pain on yourself. I'll be honest, I'm pretty much depressed from some things happening in my school (and Cloud, you don't know everything that goes on, so don't even think about agruing back), and I'm therefore depressed at home, making me bored, and basically... Self Harm, just cuts basically. I only told a few people, because others think you're sick if you're a Self Harmer. One friend, when I showed the scratches and said that my cat did them (well, I did them) called me a Self Harmer in a mean way, which means if I told them I was one, they wouldn't be my friend.

Mental makes you feel left out, alone, sometimes it makes you want to change, but when you can't it makes you sick even. I don't want to change anymore than I have, because I lost a good side of myself that I liked. Anyway, it's annoying when people do call you, and sometimes you can't help but join in yourself because of what happened to yourself. Other types of bullying might have marks, cuts or bruises on your body, and may look the worst, but Mental is the worst. So, what about you? Which is worst, and what do you class as bullying?[/SIZE][/B]

[Prince Van]

yes mental is the worst, I used to get called off a little puny wimp but then I punched him and he shut up(You know who I mean).

And I'm not gonna argue 'cos I know it's msotly me who bullies ya but you bully me aswell like today.

I say the worst type of bullying is mental becuase they know you'll keep it to yourslef and they know it doesn't leave a mark unlike a punch which leaves a bruise.

[Hevn]

[B][SIZE=1][COLOR=RoyalBlue]Mental bullying does hurt people emotionally. One harsh word and you get all quiet and think low of yourself. The fact is other people don't think of what they say and just blurt it out even though they don't really mean it. But I also listen to whether those bullies are telling the truth about me or not because only I know the real me.

For me this is the worst type of bullying and personally people who bully little children and especially women suck. But I also have to add that sharp words does hurt me but I don't let it get the best out of me. I learned to believe in myself no matter what other people say. I live my life according to how I want it to be and not how others want it to be because I am responsible for my own happiness.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B]

[wrist cutter]

[QUOTE=vicky]
Mental. Mental is the worst. It drives people to change[/QUOTE]

Actually, that sounds like a good thing. Bullying could potentially cause you to change for the better, in order to avoid more bullying. It's called "growth".

[Balmon]

[quote name='wrist cutter']Actually, that sounds like a good thing. Bullying could potentially cause you to change for the better, in order to avoid more bullying. It's called "growth".[/quote]

WHOA WHOA WHOA.

I'm sorry WC - but I cannot begin to fathom the ethics in that reasoning. Especially when it comes to change, the ends NEVER justify the means. WHY you change is fundamental element of change - it's not just a motivation, it affects the change itself. Who's to say what change would be better or not? Change is something that is so personal, the only kind that is any good is the kind brought on by yourself.

What you call "growth", I call sick manipulation, and only the criminally insane can claim to better the lives of people through such tactics.

[Prince Van]

Hey, how can you be so heartless? you're just some power crazy bully who thinks they help people but you don't you're the kind of person that makes people's lives a misery, and maybe make it end early.

How can any change from who you truly are be a good thing, maybe you should chnage for the better and you could start by shutting up and say somethign nice, atleast once a week but that's if you can manage it.

[black bird]

I've been bullied mentally so I can kinda realate to you in some way . I think mental bulling is bad but toutching someone phycicall is now plesure either . There both wrong . I acually wouldn't know witch form is worse . You said something about wanting to change . I also did that because after all everyone likes to be accepted and liked . So you start to think it's better to change ..well it's NOT . I've been there . For example a girl used to like to say to me that I was a walking corpse and she would ask why arn't you more lively ? I call it calm and laid back maybe even bored by your face but I changed . And then she told me that I was annoying . This didn't hurt me or annything , it just helps me get my point across . And my point is , it's never good enough , just be yourself . Cuz if you keep on changing you will not get accepted by them ( cuz they never will ) and lose yourself in the process .

I know the pain and how you feel when you get mentally bullied . I never was , never will be populair but I now know it's better to be who your are . Yeah I still feel lonely and depressed at times and sometimes I wanted to cut myself but I never did . Cuz it isn't going to change annything when I do , it's isn't going to solve my problems . Yeah it could take away the pain on the inside but what will I get in return ? The pain on the inside stays and I get more pain on the outside . My advise , try to be who you are . They maybe like you , they maybe not but at least you can be happy with who you are . I think that Kurt Cobain once said ; it's better to be hated for who you are , than to be loved for who you are not . And guess what ? I think he's right .

If people are still bulling you now , try to not let them get to you . Do not doubt yourself for one second because there's nothing wrong with you . Believe me I doubted myself . What I got from it is a low self esteem and still being shy and not being able to make friends very easilly . I'm doing okay now , it's been a few years ago since I've been bullied but working on being less shy .

I've always been the weird kid for some reason . But you know what? I love being the weird kid and I'm starting to like myself again , the good things and the bad things . I'm never going to let anybody talk me down again . I sugjest you take my advice and do the same thing . That's all I've got to say

bye bye

[Vicky]

[SIZE=1][B]I really admire the fact that everyone's posting opinions in one of my threads for once, well to get to the point, I think we my need to be a little careful some of us, just so this doesn't turn into a flame war ;) (Though I am in no way saying anyone is wrong or has no right to disagree, but I'll leave that there).

Back to the topic.

Trying to be who you once were is a very hard job, well in my shoes. For almost a full school year I've been different, so it's hard to change back, people have gotten used to the fact I'm pretty much insane-like. Though no one else, well hardly any other girls are like me. One girl, Mary-Kate (Yes Cloud knows) is more insane than me, but if I went to the same insane level I'm treated differently. I'm not saying Mary-Kate is really horrible and whatnot, she's a good friend in fact, it just proves a point that it's [I]me[/I] people don't like. Because of some mental bullying, I'm afraid to act normal, because that would be my only chance to be who I am, and if people don't like me as me, then I'll just change completely.

The reaction I'll hate most is "Creepy" or "Freak". Okay, saying I've got no sanity is no problem, because I'm not too bothered about that. But Freak and Creep are two different things. I don't want people to think that, though it's likely most people all ready think that. I'm already really easy to get at, too easy to get at, and that bothers me a lot too. Mental bullying really messes with your school work too, in small ways and big ways. I stopped making my story in English longer and just did a rubbish ending because someone said I was a crap writer and it would just drag on, and being depressed makes you think about other things that your work.[/SIZE][/B]

[wrist cutter]

[QUOTE=Balmon]WHOA WHOA WHOA.

I'm sorry WC - but I cannot begin to fathom the ethics in that reasoning. Especially when it comes to change, the ends NEVER justify the means. WHY you change is fundamental element of change - it's not just a motivation, it affects the change itself. Who's to say what change would be better or not? Change is something that is so personal, the only kind that is any good is the kind brought on by yourself.

What you call "growth", I call sick manipulation, and only the criminally insane can claim to better the lives of people through such tactics.[/QUOTE]

You know, that's one of the few optimistic things I ever say, and yet I still get a response like this.

Haven't you ever seen on talk shows how people turn a bad experience into a positive outcome? Like those with a currently incurable illness raise awareness for it or something. Just one of many examples. So maybe bullying leads you to change for the better. You took a bad thing and turned it into a good thing - people get recognition for this ****.

I'm not condoning bullying or anything, but some of you make it seem like all change is bad. Like "I am the way I am and any change would be to change who I am"... which isn't really true (it's hard to pick perfect words to fit this situation). You don't need to become an entirely different person, but changing small aspects of your personality can have positive effects. Nobody's perfect, but hopefully we all strive to be (even though we never can be - which should be obvious). If bullying helps you to identify things about yourself that could use improving (for example, you're too egotistical), then turn it into a good thing and change it. And they'll stop bullying you too. Many positive outcomes.

So stop ******* jumping all over me. Damn you people act like every thing I say is straight out of Mein Kampf.

[Balmon]

[QUOTE=wrist cutter]You know, that's one of the few optimistic things I ever say, and yet I still get a response like this.

Haven't you ever seen on talk shows how people turn a bad experience into a positive outcome? Like those with a currently incurable illness raise awareness for it or something. Just one of many examples. So maybe bullying leads you to change for the better. You took a bad thing and turned it into a good thing - people get recognition for this ****.

I'm not condoning bullying or anything, but some of you make it seem like all change is bad. Like "I am the way I am and any change would be to change who I am"... which isn't really true (it's hard to pick perfect words to fit this situation). You don't need to become an entirely different person, but changing small aspects of your personality can have positive effects. Nobody's perfect, but hopefully we all strive to be (even though we never can be - which should be obvious). If bullying helps you to identify things about yourself that could use improving (for example, you're too egotistical), then turn it into a good thing and change it. And they'll stop bullying you too. Many positive outcomes.

So stop ******* jumping all over me. Damn you people act like every thing I say is straight out of Mein Kampf.[/QUOTE]

I see. Interesting response.

I never said change was bad. If you read what I said, it was that the motivation for change is important.

Also, WC, underlying most of your posts, including some on another thread regarding bullying, is this overwhelming feeling that you believe the person being bulied usually deserves it - that they bring it upon themselves. You seem to live in the world which functions on the premise that the bad guy is the way he is because the good guy FORCED him to do it. Like: that guy doesn't dress cool... he so TOTALLY brings this harassment upon himself. Or: I just made fun of him, and since he's defending himself from embarassment at a time when self-respect and image is so important him, I should further embarass him because he reacted.

Since when does being accepted by bullies equal a positive outcome? Also, think for another second or two about your comment about a victim who is perhaps being too egotistical, then witness the irony unfold before you.

What I don't understand, WC, is when did bullies suddenly becoming the microscope for the things that are wrong with each of us? Somehow, the thought of bullies being the most able people to identify those tragic character flaws of ours is utterly depressing... and stupefying. How can you compare incurable illnesses with bullies? Are you telling me that Bullying has become a disorder? Help, I've been diagnosed with wanting to constantly deride and lower the self-esteem of people and I can't help it? Think again, WC.

Last of all, your comment was anything but optimistic. It was a straight-out admonishment to the people here who are sharing their problems. Don't play the victim here, WC, what you have offered so far has been anything but helpful advice to the people in this thread.

[eleanor]

[color=firebrick] I'm not in any way totally agreeing with wristcutter, but I'm sort of glad that I've been rejected or bullied in my past. So I can say this: I've been an outcast and a popular person, I've bullied and been bullied. If I ever met a dying person who's never been bullied in his/her life, they're missing out on something.

Of course I never changed any of my beliefs to stop being bullied. [/color]

[Balmon]

[QUOTE=maladjusted][color=firebrick] I'm not in any way totally agreeing with wristcutter, but I'm sort of glad that I've been rejected or bullied in my past. So I can say this: I've been an outcast and a popular person, I've bullied and been bullied. If I ever met a dying person who's never been bullied in his/her life, they're missing out on something.

Of course I never changed any of my beliefs to stop being bullied. [/color][/QUOTE]

OK, I think I may have missed your point. Really, there are a lot of things in your life you should experience - having a ridiculously strong crush on someone, being dumped, breaking someone's heart (unintentionally would be best), getting married, having kids, having you kid do the exact dumb and stupid things you did as a kid, getting that job, that first kiss, etc. etc. Being bullied is not one of those life experiences that everyone should have. As a music student, there are a lot experiences that they say you really need to go through to fully grasp the import of some pieces of music. As I said, I don't think being bullied has ever been one of them.

Please tell me Maladjusted... what exactly would they have missed out on?

Phil

[wrist cutter]

[quote name='Balmon']is this overwhelming feeling that you believe the person being bulied usually deserves it - that they bring it upon themselves.[/quote]

Most of the time they do. I'm not a bully myself, and again I don't condone bullying, but there are bullies out there and you must accept that fact. These people are going to harrass people given the opportunity. I suggest, if you don't want to be bullied, don't do anything that's going to instigate it, ie: dress up like an anime character and go to school. That's a rather extreme example, but even something silly like decorating your binder with anime pictures is going to get you made fun of. Live with it.

[quote name='Balmon'] You seem to live in the world which functions on the premise that the bad guy is the way he is because the good guy FORCED him to do it. Like: that guy doesn't dress cool... he so TOTALLY brings this harassment upon himself. Or: I just made fun of him, and since he's defending himself from embarassment at a time when self-respect and image is so important him, I should further embarass him because he reacted.[/quote]

My world is that of teenagers so I think I share the environment most of us here do. I'm not saying bullying is a positive thing to do but IT HAPPENS. So to repeat myself: if you do something that's going to get you bullied, expect it to come to you.

[quote name='Balmon']Since when does being accepted by bullies equal a positive outcome? Also, think for another second or two about your comment about a victim who is perhaps being too egotistical, then witness the irony unfold before you.[/quote]

Hahaha. The irony is delicious isn't it. Anyway, I'm not saying you have to be accepted by bullies, you just have to not draw their attention and you're fine.

[quote name='Balmon']What I don't understand, WC, is when did bullies suddenly becoming the microscope for the things that are wrong with each of us? Somehow, the thought of bullies being the most able people to identify those tragic character flaws of ours is utterly depressing... and stupefying.[/quote]

I never said they were most able and they certainly aren't. But like I said - if you come to school with a binder full of anime crap and spend your classtime drawing anime, you're going to be picked on. Face it. If you make the mistake of doing this, you have two options.
a) Go home and cry about it.
b) Realize that no one cares about what anime you like and stop flaunting it.
Why is the second one so much better? Because not only are bullies not going to be able to pick on you anymore, you're going to be a much cooler person by being not so engrossed in anime anymore.

[quote name='Balmon']How can you compare incurable illnesses with bullies? Are you telling me that Bullying has become a disorder? Help, I've been diagnosed with wanting to constantly deride and lower the self-esteem of people and I can't help it? Think again, WC.[/quote]

Slow down there. You're making a jump in my analogy. The comparison was that people took something that happened to them that sucked and turned it into a positive thing. I didn't say bullying was a disease.

[quote name='Balmon']Last of all, your comment was anything but optimistic. It was a straight-out admonishment to the people here who are sharing their problems. Don't play the victim here, WC, what you have offered so far has been anything but helpful advice to the people in this thread.[/quote]

What's your advice? Or do you have any? Are you just going to offer pity? It's HIGH SCHOOL. ****, who cares? Do well in school, get a higher paying job and then you can bully them around if you're so inclined. I think my advice is rather sound: don't do obviously stupid things and you won't get bullied. You can breeze through high school and then carry out the plan.

[Balmon]

[quote name='wrist cutter']Most of the time they do. I'm not a bully myself, and again I don't condone bullying, but there are bullies out there and you must accept that fact. These people are going to harrass people given the opportunity. I suggest, if you don't want to be bullied, don't do anything that's going to instigate it, ie: dress up like an anime character and go to school. That's a rather extreme example, but even something silly like decorating your binder with anime pictures is going to get you made fun of. Live with it.[/quote]

WC, you seem to be missing an integral part of this whole thing. People shouldn't have to hide what they may love, or really anything at all about themselves, because of some group of people who feel better by preying on them. By your replies to everything I've said so far, you are obviously still confused. You still make it out as though the bullies are doing what they do out of necessity. IT'S NOT A NECESSARY PART OF HIGH SCHOOL. I managed to make it through high school without being bullied, why? Not because I wasn't something of a geek - I mean... I'm a frickin' pianist for God's sake! But it just wasn't something anybody in our school felt was necessary to do. Bullying is NOT a necessary evil in our world of necessary evils.

[quote name='wrist cutter']My world is that of teenagers so I think I share the environment most of us here do. I'm not saying bullying is a positive thing to do but IT HAPPENS. So to repeat myself: if you do something that's going to get you bullied, expect it to come to you.[/quote]

I just left the world of teenagers 6 days ago. It's not that I don't share the environment. But again, you still blame the victim, and not the person acting out on their own insecurities.

[quote name='wrist cutter']Hahaha. The irony is delicious isn't it. Anyway, I'm not saying you have to be accepted by bullies, you just have to not draw their attention and you're fine. [/quote]

I hope you see the irony, and aren't just saying that to save face. Again, the comment about victims asking for trouble.

[quote name='wrist cutter']I never said they were most able and they certainly aren't. But like I said - if you come to school with a binder full of anime crap and spend your classtime drawing anime, you're going to be picked on.[/quote]

WC, if there are people that enjoy doing that... what the hell is wrong with it? You are giving too many excuses to the bullies. Just because you don't really give particularly well-thought out responses to my comments doesn't mean I should come to your school and make your life a living hell. Just because your one-liner responses to people annoy me doesn't mean I should make fun of you.

[QUOTE=wrist cutter] Face it. If you make the mistake of doing this, you have two options.
a) Go home and cry about it.
b) Realize that no one cares about what anime you like and stop flaunting it.
Why is the second one so much better? Because not only are bullies not going to be able to pick on you anymore, you're going to be a much cooler person by being not so engrossed in anime anymore.[/QUOTE]

They have more than two options - as do the bullies. From the way you hang on to this anime analogy, it sounds like you have some issues with it yourself. In this particular example, I will again re-iterate my question, what is wrong with people who are into anime - or into whatever it is they are into?

[quote name='wrist cutter']Slow down there. You're making a jump in my analogy. The comparison was that people took something that happened to them that sucked and turned it into a positive thing. I didn't say bullying was a disease.[/quote]

I REALLY loved this one. There is no jump to be made there. You really could've chosen a better comparison. What I'm saying, which you obviously didn't get, is that I agree there are times, as in your example, where something good can be derived from something horrible. However, bullying is NOT one of those instances. Get it?

[quote name='wrist cutter']What's your advice? Or do you have any? Are you just going to offer pity? It's HIGH SCHOOL. ****, who cares? Do well in school, get a higher paying job and then you can bully them around if you're so inclined. I think my advice is rather sound: don't do obviously stupid things and you won't get bullied. You can breeze through high school and then carry out the plan.[/quote]

People should not have to compromise themselves for the sake of others based on a purely irrational need of some to be primitive. Of course it's high school, but it's a time in people's lives where much of their opinions, beliefs, and morals are being challenged and reformed. It's also where they're discovering who they really are. Of course, bullying is inevitable - there will ALWAYS be fools out there, but the answer is not to put up with it. Of all the things that happen in your teenage years, which are great by the way, bullying is not of the things that are necessary.

I mean, there are realistic solutions to these things. In my last year of high school I was asked to participate as a coach in a Violence Awareness program. We learned how to mentor aggressive students, how to mediate conflicts between students.. etc., etc. While these programs are obviously not to efficient in high schools, they actually have worked wonders in elementary school. Prevention is key to this sort of thing.

So, WC, rather than just putting up with it or watching others just deal with it, I actively participated in the process. So, before you go on to presume my lack of involvement, save for my pity, ask.

Pity? Of course. Everyone deserves sympathy and pity at many points in their lives. I pity you now for your obvious need to convince people of THE HARD TRUTHS OF LIFE; but before you decide that certain truths are irrefutable, challenge them.

I suggest that if we are to continue this discussion, let's just keep it to PM.

ADDITION - We have since taken this to PM. We've tentatively agreed to disagree.

[eleanor]

[color=firebrick] As a music student I've learned to accept and respect all types of music. In life you better get used to accepting things or you won't get very far. Bullying is one of those things.

You said that people need to go through some experiences to truly grasp the importance of some music. What if you grew up without ever being pushed away or insulted? If you never felt out of place...or if your thoughts and beliefs tended to always follow the majority? What if you grew up without ever being beaten down or shown the extent of how far people can go?

I told a boy at my school I didn't support George W. Bush. He insulted me for the rest of the year.

Tell me, do you think I learned something out of that?

Sure as hell I did.[/color]

[Heaven's Cloud]

[quote name='Balmon']WC, you seem to be missing an integral part of this whole thing. People shouldn't have to hide what they may love, or really anything at all about themselves, because of some group of people who feel better by preying on them. By your replies to everything I've said so far, you are obviously still confused. You still make it out as though the bullies are doing what they do out of necessity. IT'S NOT A NECESSARY PART OF HIGH SCHOOL. I managed to make it through high school without being bullied, why? Not because I wasn't something of a geek - I mean... I'm a frickin' pianist for God's sake! But it just wasn't something anybody in our school felt was necessary to do. Bullying is NOT a necessary evil in our world of necessary evils.[/quote]

[color=indigo]I don't think that Wrist Cutter is missing an integral part of this post, I think he is just trying to be realistic, per usual. Why should bullies hide an integral part of [b]their[/b] character just to make other people feel more secure with themselves. Perhaps bullies love bullying, although that isn't really a valid argument because murderers may love murdering, that doesn't make it right.

So, I guess I would agree with you on the aspect that bullies are not an appropriate part of childhood, however, learning to cope with bullies in high school helps you cope with bullies that will bother you the rest of your life. If you cannot handle being bullied by something as trivial as anime or band by someone who is a more or less a stranger how are you going to handle your friends when they try and bully you into spotting them for rent because they spent their money drinking or a co-worker that is vieing for your job by slandering you to your colleagues?

Once you have to deal with the "grown-up" bullying that is going to occur no matter how inappropriate it is, being teased because you doodle anime between the margins of your notebook seems pretty insignificant.

And I tend to agree with WC, bullying should lead to growth. Maybe not the growth to change your likes and dislikes, but the growth to accept yourself for who you are. Those are the people that are usually susceptible to bullying in the first place.[/color]

[black bird]

[I]I'm not condoning bullying or anything, but some of you make it seem like all change is bad. Like "I am the way I am and any change would be to change who I am"... which isn't really true (it's hard to pick perfect words to fit this situation). You don't need to become an entirely different person, but changing small aspects of your personality can have positive effects. Nobody's perfect, but hopefully we all strive to be (even though we never can be - which should be obvious). If bullying helps you to identify things about yourself that could use improving (for example, you're too egotistical), then turn it into a good thing and change it. And they'll stop bullying you too. Many positive outcomes.[/I]

[B]Okay ...this is for wristcutter . [/B] You said something about growth , that you are trying to explain in the lines above . I get your point although I don't agree with it at all .

Bulling is something different than critic on someone . It's okay to say something about someone's behaviour . You could say it rude or polite but it's not bulling as far as I'm concernd . Bulling in my opnion is making someone feel less worth of themself in order to make yourself feel good or just for pure fun . Poking fun at someone is not bulling but if you look down on the person and humiliate them and basiclly making someone feel worthless isn't poking fun annymore .

Okay you said something about ; Like "I am the way I am and any change would be to change who I am"...
Okay change is infact a good thing but mentall bulling isn't going to make good changes you know . As I said before you could get really shy and afraid to behave the way you normally behave . It could be acting crazy to hide yourself or being really shy . That all depends on the person and what happened to them . But what I was trying to say is , these changes for example being shy could get in the way of your life . Holding you back from all kinds of experiences and for example meeting new people . Adventually It could get in the way of your personal growth and could lead to hiding yourself and other things .

I do agree with you that every person changes and growth and changes are a good thing . But the way to get there should never be bulling and I really admire people that can turn negative experiences into a positive thing . But not all people do that you know . Bulling can leave a real mark on someone and it's never good to bully someone . If someone thinks oh I'm helping them to be stronger later in life ...sorry but I personally think that's a sick excuse to talk it all right . Wristcutter this is not meant to offend you and I don't think you think that . So please don't be angry or something cuz it isn't meant like that .

Oh and one last thing I really couldn't appreceate your last remark about mein kamph . Please don't say that again .

well bye bye

P.S In another post you wrote you say something about don't do anything to make you get bullied . Uhm ...sorry but I really believe that [B]people should accept people the way they are [/B] . What's so wrong with dressing differently ? Maybe someone doesn't like it but that's no reason to start bulling them . What's wrong with liking anime or having a weird name ? There are tons of reasons to get bullied but why arn't people accept each other cuz there are so manny people you can't possibly live up to all there standards cuz everyone has got different vieuws and opions about for example clothes . Well pheww ...large post but I really needed to get that of my chest .

[James]

[QUOTE=black bird]
Oh and one last thing I really couldn't appreceate your last remark about mein kamph . Please don't say that again .
[/QUOTE][color=#707875][/color]
[color=#707875]wrist cutter only said that people were interpreting him as though his comments were from Mein Kampf. I don't understand why that would be offensive to you -- unless the very mention of "Mein Kampf" is offensive in and of itself.

I would normally say something like "you guys should lighten up", but I think it's more than that. Some of you are lacking the ability to look at the context here. I haven't read over wrist cutter's posts with a fine tooth comb, so I don't really know if I agree with him or not (although I can basically see what he's saying).

But whether you agree or not, at least put in some effort and consider the context of his (and other) comments.

Here is a direct quote:
[/color]

[quote=wrist cutter]
[i]Damn you people act like every thing I say is straight out of Mein Kampf.[/i][/quote]
[color=#707875]All he's saying is that people are overreacting to his comments. I tend to agree with that -- rather than getting offended and replying immediately, it might be a better idea to consider what is being said...and to come up with a response that targets the actual issues/opinions here.

It's not going to do anyone any good to get overly offended, especially when they themselves are taking comments out of context.[/color]

[black bird]

Sorry but what's so wrong with disagreeing with someone ? I Didn't get all mad I just said I didn't liked his comment . I get what his point was but I just didn't liked the way he said it that's all . Sorry ...

[James]

[color=#707875]There's nothing wrong with disagreeing. That's not what I'm talking about.

You said you didn't appreciate his reference to Mein Kampf. I explained the context of that reference to you (something you may have missed, based upon your response).

My comment was also a general one, to everyone in this thread. It's a good idea to read posts carefully rather than skim them, especially so that the context can be understood.[/color]

[Chaos]

SIDENOTE: And that brings us to another point: Why do people hate Adolph Hitler so much? Because he inspired an international movement of racial and spiritual segregation? Because he committed mass acts of genocide? Because he not only approved and endorsed of, but also committed war and hate crimes personally?

Gee, that's not at all like what the Americans, for example, a country of traitors, did to the Indians [P.C. Native Americans] or the Spaniards, or the Cajuns, or the Creoles, or the Mexicans. Please, leave your narrow-minded angst at the door. Just because you don't like a man for his actions doesn't mean he cannot be referenced. Nor must others refrain from mentioning him, [i]especially[/i] when one is being harassed for exposing his personal beliefs. I don't care if you're a Jew, a German, a gypsy, whatever. Native American, Latino, what-the-hell-ever. I am several of what I mentioned prior and I don't find it offensive when someone references an autobiography about a man who lived in poverty, fought in war, and was imprisoned under grueling circumstances.

No, I'm not defending Adolph Hitler. Nor am I directly condemning him for his crimes, due to the fact that they have happened time, time, and time again in human history. If you're going to take offense to something, let it be for someone actually doing something TO you, not for typing out a simile.

Now, onto the point, bullying is common. Worldwide. And yes, it does build character. The reason all of these lightweight little snot-nosed brats today have "developmental issues" and "learning disabilities" and "insecurity patterns" is because they have no structure. Parents today want to give a child time-out for cursing or being smart-mouthed. I was disciplined as a child. My parents told me to shut up, popped me upside the head, and MADE me behave. And they never, ever beat me. There is a fine difference between bringing up a child into maturity and beating it with a shovel.

The problem nowadays is the context in which bullying is transmitted. It's no longer a big eighth grader shoving a fifth grader up against a locker and demanding milk money; it's a guy getting jumped by five dudes with pipes and chains. The world, as a whole, has gone to Hell in a handbasket. Families are getting bigger, mothers are getting younger. STDs are a constant threat, crime is, in most areas of the world, escalating, and moral issues are being thrown down the toilet. We have hate crimes, racial bigotry, and the political world is intruding into home life.

Do you know the worst part?

It's been happening since the dawn of human history.

The worst type of bullying is the unspoken disrespect that parents give kids by not teaching them to mature into strong-willed and well-disciplined individuals. That leads to physical and mental abuse from other children and adults. The stereotypical bully seeks out the weak, and such, without proper backing, the parents are to blame.

I'd like to quote the Indian saying; "We do not inherit the Earth from our parents; we loan them from our children."

Without a sturdy upbringing, we are doomed to a cycle of worsening quality in the world. If our parents would enforce us more as children, we would be more respectable in our lifestyles. But, as humans, we do not seek the best way. We seek the [i]easiest[/i] way, and that, eventually, will spell our demise.

[ChibiHorsewoman]

[color=darkviolet]I'm in an increasingly lazy mood right now so I'm not going to cut, past and quote every single person on here. Instead I'm going to be as close to the point as I possibly can.

Bullying sucks in any form. But have you ever wondered why the bullies do it? **** by my Junior year of high school I actually felt sorry for the girl who followed me into the bathroom with three of her friends to threaten me and call me a lesbian (yes, I'm a closet lesbian. my marriage to a guy just proves how lesbian I am) because for all her popularity, she could never actually feel happy unless she was making others feel bad about themselves. Her choice just had to be me, the over weight out cast girl who honestly didn't give 2 ****s about her. Actually it inspired me to learn a bit about psychology. I think most people bully because they have such a low self esteem they will never be happy unless they feel that everyone around them is miserable. Then there are the ones who get a sick thrill out of feeling more powerful by bringing everyone down. After all this, I now think that that girl was the one who needed paxil and weekly visits to the school psychologist not me.

Of course, not everyone is thick skinned and considers being chased into a bathroom and having her life threatened to be an enlightening experiance. Those people who are constantly bullied can become either suicidal or homicidal. neither of these is an extremely desirable trait. This proves that bullying is not a helpful learning tool, but instead detrimental to a person's mental growth. If the situation is not addressed properly (Ie: [i]not[/i] gathering someone's math class together so they can all say how much they hate a person because some stupid teacher thinks that this could help ease tensions. Oh yeah, that happened to me when I was a Sophomore. One of the kids said that he thought I seemed too smart :rolleyes: and that's why he was rude to me) there could be some pretty dire consequences at the end.

Unfortunately, as long as humans continue to congregate together forge bonds and get all competetive there will be bullying. While I don't feel that bullying is an integral part of life, I do see it as an unavoidable part of growing up. You don't need to be bullied, but some kids do seem to get it more than others. And for different reasons too. You can get bullied for being poor (which coincidentally is something that you really can't change unless you can manage to get your parents to win the lotto. So there goes the pressure to change theory.) YOu can be bullied because of your weight, any other physical condition. Hell you can even be bullied for being to smart. And if that's the case, what are you supposed to do, become a moron so you don't get made fun of?

But there is a point that wrist cutter made. Most of this bullying happens in high school. High school (at least in the US) only lasts for four years. Sure they may feel like the longest four years of your life, but after that you never have to go back there again. Yeah there is always the chance of being bullied on the job by some moron who didn't quite get the idea that they're in the real world now. But if he persists there's always the great American past time of a law suite for harrassment to deture any further abuse on your person.

In conclusion, that stupid rhyme about sticks and stones can break my bones, but words can never hurt me is wrong. Because words can hurt.

Okay. I've said my peice. take it as you will[/color]

[Chaos]

Don't take this as an assault, Chibi, because I know that you know what you're talking about [examples are your friends, all of you future [spoiler]MASTER[/spoiler]debaters.], but I just feel the urge to address some things.

"Bullying sucks in any form. But have you ever wondered why the bullies do it? **** by my Junior year of high school I actually felt sorry for the girl who followed me into the bathroom with three of her friends to threaten me and call me a lesbian (yes, I'm a closet lesbian. my marriage to a guy just proves how lesbian I am) because for all her popularity, she could never actually feel happy unless she was making others feel bad about themselves. Her choice just had to be me, the over weight out cast girl who honestly didn't give 2 ****s about her. Actually it inspired me to learn a bit about psychology. I think most people bully because they have such a low self esteem they will never be happy unless they feel that everyone around them is miserable. Then there are the ones who get a sick thrill out of feeling more powerful by bringing everyone down. After all this, I now think that that girl was the one who needed paxil and weekly visits to the school psychologist not me."

Indirectly, bullying can build a strong will. If you let it. Obviously, this exploit from your high school did not affect you in so many ways. In fact, you persued a well-respected and beneficial study because of it. How can you say bullying sucks? Yes, there can and have been drastically horrid outcomes, but there have also been many triumphant ones. The low self-esteem thing about bullies is a thing of the past. Now, and recently in the past, people used fear tactics to gain ground on another person. Trust me, I know. I used to do it. Hell, still do sometimes. And I have no serious mental defects aside from the fact that I'm obscenely morbid. It helps to accept what you do in life if you understand the basic truth of the world; You are born, you live, you die. That's it. The laws of survival are the only things that are constant in life.

"Of course, not everyone is thick skinned and considers being chased into a bathroom and having her life threatened to be an enlightening experiance. Those people who are constantly bullied can become either suicidal or homicidal. neither of these is an extremely desirable trait. This proves that bullying is not a helpful learning tool, but instead detrimental to a person's mental growth. If the situation is not addressed properly (Ie: not gathering someone's math class together so they can all say how much they hate a person because some stupid teacher thinks that this could help ease tensions. Oh yeah, that happened to me when I was a Sophomore. One of the kids said that he thought I seemed too smart and that's why he was rude to me) there could be some pretty dire consequences at the end."

That statement about people that are constantly bullied is very general, and quite frankly, uneducated. You yourself provided a great example AGAINST that in your first paragraph. However, I will agree, that unchecked, some of the time bullied persons have a [i]risk[/i] of becoming either suicidal or homicidal. However, it is becoming so much clearer that children need more backing these days. School shootings have been accouring more widely in past years, and so have underaged murders. [And I swear, if someone blames it on video games, I'll feed you to ants for being so ignorant.] It is not a situation to be taken lightly.

"But there is a point that wrist cutter made. Most of this bullying happens in high school. High school (at least in the US) only lasts for four years. Sure they may feel like the longest four years of your life, but after that you never have to go back there again. Yeah there is always the chance of being bullied on the job by some moron who didn't quite get the idea that they're in the real world now. But if he persists there's always the great American past time of a law suite for harrassment to deture any further abuse on your person."

Actually, in a lot of areas, bullying is taking place more in middle school and junior high nowadays, at least here. It seems that like over the summer between eighth grade and ninth, kids are a) injected with growth hormones and b) instantly matured into young adults for the most part. The new thing in high school is to have a soap opera-like drama instead of a life. I would get into details, but several friends would come after me with knives.

I personally am enjoying my [strike]four[/strike] five years of high school so far. I've made a lot of great friends and kept a lot of old ones. I do suppose my reputation and physical stature [since I'm not a gimpy fool like I was in grammar school] prevent a lot of trouble, but even from what I see, everyone just tries to get by on their own. Sometimes I wish I could just keep this up forever and not have to worry about the real world. Afterall, these are the best days of my life.

Right?

"In conclusion, that stupid rhyme about sticks and stones can break my bones, but words can never hurt me is wrong. Because words can hurt."

Only if you let them. If you allow what some peon thinks of you actually harm and negatively influence you, then perhaps you deserve to be pushed around. Humans have system of free will for a specific reason; to rise up and conquer whatever stands in our way.


P.S.: If you are offended by my realist views, please grow up. *winks at Charlie*

[Rachael]

wow this is one of the most serious threads I have ever read but than agian this is a serious topic. Anyways

[QUOTE=wrist cutter]I never said they were most able and they certainly aren't. But like I said - if you come to school with a binder full of anime crap and spend your classtime drawing anime, you're going to be picked on. Face it. If you make the mistake of doing this, you have two options.
a) Go home and cry about it.
b) Realize that no one cares about what anime you like and stop flaunting it.
Why is the second one so much better? Because not only are bullies not going to be able to pick on you anymore, you're going to be a much cooler person by being not so engrossed in anime anymore.[/QUOTE]


See what I'm getting from this quote is that you think that everyone should fit in the in crowd and forget individuality. Yes the bully would stop bullying you cus he considers you normal for his/her standards but than you lose your individuality. Like that example you did with the binder full of anime drawings and you start to draw in class and some one bullies you about it. You than say to hide your hobbies and interests that define you who you are as an individual?? I say "screw the bullies" If I like something I'm not going to hide it and if the bullies have a problem with that they can "suck my ***" as a friend of mine would say.

[wrist cutter]

[quote name='Rachael']Like that example you did with the binder full of anime drawings and you start to draw in class and some one bullies you about it. You than say to hide your hobbies and interests that define you who you are as an individual?? I say "screw the bullies" If I like something I'm not going to hide it and if the bullies have a problem with that they can "suck my ***" as a friend of mine would say.[/quote]

Yep, that's exactly what I'm saying.

Who you are is NOT what you have on the outside of your binder. Hobbies and interests change all the time - it doesn't make up who you are. It's still good to have "unique" interests (such as anime) that aren't "acceptable" by bully standards, but if you don't want to be bullied about it I suggest you don't make it obvious. You can like anime and have anime-liking friends and can talk about it with them occasionally... but come on. Golden mean. Don't go overboard or you're going to be bullied.

What I'm [i]not[/i] saying is that you can't like anime... it just doesn't need to be flaunted everywhere, especially at school. Anime really has little place in school anyway, why are you wasting class time in the first place? So yeah. If you do stuff like this, expect to get bullied.