Younger Kids

[kenshinsbabe]

Is it just me, or are kids who are younger just more stupid? You see, at school, I'm in band and i sit next to a seventh grader, myself being an eighth grader. Obviously, she doesn't know how things work around here. She never puts the music folder away, she never hits the right notes and she never gets the key signature right. I suppose that only music people will get that stuff, but I'm sure other people share my thoughts.

[AzureWolf]

[FONT=book antiqua][SIZE=2][COLOR=blue]Well, kids aren't stupider (hey, they could be smarter than all of us even): they just aren't being taught as much stuff as they used to be taught. I imagine there's a multitude of reasons why, but two factors stand out in my eye.

The first reason is all the religious conflict that's been going on. I know there was blatant and obvious advertisement of Christianity when I was younger, so I learned a lot about a religion I was never a part of. Some of those Christian ideas were implied, since reasoning and logic was derived from them (for example, God was with America during the American Revolution). Mention of God was a pretty standard fare.

The point of these examples is to show that religion and other random things were expressed rather freely in my time, so I became somewhat familiar with them. Nowadays, I think teachers are more restricted and forced to teach only what they are required to. This means students don't even learn etiquette, general things about life that they should know, and, of course, about other religions (well, they do learn about them, but they [i]experience[/i] other religions). All of these consequences stem from the religious politics.

The second reason is the outdated material schools use. This thought may just concern science, but it's still an important one. There are many new things and facts that are being discovered, and older material does become either invalid or different. Schools tend to use books for long periods of time, and only update every so often. Lots of material is changing much faster, so kids learn things that aren't true or aren't necessary.

The only example I have to go on is my younger brother. He never learned some basic things that I thought would be commonplace for people his age. His friends didn't either. In addition, I thought I'd browse his molecular biology text and see what he was learning. To my surprise, not only was a lot of information left out, but there was also stuff that was now debunked![/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT]

[lavonia]

Stupidity is a rampant disease that effects people of all ages, IMO. :smirk:

[Brasil]

In this particular instance, though, I don't think religion or outdated material is remotely close to the cause of this 7th grader's musical difficulties.

It's a middle school music class. There are going to be some sore spots. That's just how it is. I know. I went through years of music classes in high school, and also did things with the middle schools. The girl sitting next to you is not stupid, and calling her stupid simply because she's struggling with a musical instrument is...despicable, in my opinion. And instead of bitching and moaning about it, or making fun of her, or so vehemently criticizing her, why not help her? She obviously does need some assistance in the class.

I just fail to see how a lack of musical ability automatically translates into someone being stupid. Playing an instrument is hard work, and takes years of practice to be able to do it well. My high school buds didn't get where they are by playing every few months.

As for the more general issue...I don't really think anyone is getting dumber or smarter. For the most part, you'll find that student behaviors and abilities are roughly equal to preceeding classes. Now, there is a greater presence of negative behaviors (drinking, smoking, sex, etc), and that is a problem. But nobody is getting "stupider."

[Sara]

[quote name='Siren']The girl sitting next to you is not stupid, and calling her stupid simply because she's struggling with a musical instrument is...despicable, in my opinion.[/quote][size=1]Alex took the words out of my mouth.

I don't know the exact situation, or whether or not she has come "special circumstance" that explains her difficulties (Is she new to school? Did she just pick up the instrument recently? etc.), but struggling with band has nothing to do with a person being, as you so delicately put it, stupid. Having such a callous neighhbor probably isn't helping her confidence or performance, either.

Age has nothing to do with musical ability, either, as it happens. No matter how early (or late) you start playing an instrument, everyone starts at the same level and has to practice to get better.

I played clarinet for six years in middle and high school, and I can guarantee that a [i]large[/i] chunk of my life (although perhaps not quite as large as it should have been, heh) was dedicated to playing that instrument. Especially when you're beginning to play (or after picking an instrument up after, say, a summer of not playing), there's a lot of stuff to take in and get used to. Reading music, in and of itself, can be very hard when you're first learning, never mind getting all the fingerings, counts, and key changes right.

Even with all the time I've spent playing music (Did anyone else have to play recorders/flutaphones in grade school?), I haven't done much with it in the last two years. I can [b]guarantee[/b] that my kid brother (who is four years younger than I am) is better at sax than I am at clarinet, if only because he's been playing consistantly for the last few years, where I haven't. [/size]

[wrist cutter]

kenshinsbabe, sooner or later you will find out that almost everyone is an idiot. In fact, you may even discover that you yourself are an idiot. Don't worry, most idiots could potentially improve but are often too stupid to realize it.

What you have described is not actually a case of stupidity, however. Your inability to differentiate between stupidity and being talentless may indicate that [i]you[/i] have been inflicted with the disease, and not the person you have described.

To help you through this time, I give to you my patented, almost fail-proof plan:
a) Stop watching TV.
b) Stop listening to whatever music it is you listen to.
c) Pay attention in school, do your work, get good grades.
d) Do as your parents tell you (if age is wisdom as you imply, then this is obvious).
e) Get lots of sleep, eat right, exercise.
f) Abandon all of your friends, because they're probably idiots too.
g) Don't have sex.

For maximum results, do all of these things. Any combination will help your condition, however.

All part of wrist cutter's plan for a better America. Vote for me in 2004.

[Godelsensei]

[COLOR=Gray][FONT=Courier New]Actually, Sara, if you don't practice playing an instrument for at least 1000 hours before you reach the age of 18 or so, you'll never get very good at it.
But that's rather beside the point.

You can't consider some one who's in a new environment, just picking up a musical instrument (most school bands start in grade seven, as far as I'm aware), to be stupid without some further justification. If, by the end of the year, she still doesn't know how to open and close an instrument case, then maybe there's a problem.

And don't march around saying people who don't know key signiatures are stupid. Most people don't bother even learning them until school or extra-curricular theory tests demand it.

Hell, most people don't even bother learning their music until school or extra-curricular [i]playing[/i] tests require it.

When was the last time you heard some one going on enthusiastically about how much they love to identify intervals?

Besides, if kids are getting progressively stupider, then why are more and more authors being published at fourteen? And why is the age range in this thread quite possibly greater than ten years?

Besides, according to evolution's natural propensity to improve the species, the only logical assumption would be that we're getting smarter.

What Azure-jiji said is true, too. My school still uses textbooks from the [i]seventies[/i]. It's pitiful.[/FONT][/COLOR]

[SaiyanPrincessX]

Well put Siren.

Actually with the way schools are now, kids will be getting smarter, or at least know more than they should at a young age. First grade isn't how we remember it. They no longer make arts and crafts for Thanksgiving, or have nap time. Younger kids are being loaded with un-godly amounts of homework for such a young age.

I'm not sure if this is so through out the whole United States however, but I'm sure it will eventually.

*votes wrist cutter for president*

[Gavin]

[SIZE=1]Interesting, most interesting.

Again I find myself in agreement with Alex's points, the girl sitting beside you in your music class may just be a little slower than you are, or perhaps she's just not fully aware of the procedures involved. To go so far as to ***** and moan she's not as good as you is down right cold, how would you like it if a fellow in Ninth Grade was doing the same thing to you as you are doing to her ?

As for the whole Younger Kids are Stupid issue I think that is completely farce, by that same sentiment I could say that anyone here who is younger than myself is stupid and anyone who is older than me is more intelligent than I am. The fact is that as we age most of us grow in [b]maturity[/b], the longer you've been around the more mature you are, at least hopefully.

I can't really comment on the Musical Instrument issue because I've only ever learned how to play the Tin Whistle and it's been so long since I've played it I doubt that I'm any good anymore. However I would agree that it takes a hell of a lot of practice to become proficient at any musical instrument, as Lore has said it takes a lot of time and some natural skill to become good.[/SIZE]

[MissWem]

[COLOR=DarkRed]Well, I agree with a bunch of the other people..and I'm really too lazy to give them credit. The ones who say something about stupidity being a terrible disease that infects us all and the ones who say that it changes with levels of maturity.

I won't say anything about the girl that sits next to you who can't follow proper procedure, I think a number of people already ripped you a new one for saying what you said :p

I personally think the greatest amount of stupidity lies with the sexuality of kids these days. I might be slightly off topic, but it's a terrible concern. Maybe I grew up in a prude environment..in fact maybe my friends and I grew up in a prude environment, but today I'm finding that a rather innocent 13yr old has already had two boyfriends. Her friends don't read 'teen' magazines like Girlfriend, instead they read Vogue (I just hope like hell they're not reading Cosmopolitan). At that age I didn't exactly read those magazines, but my friends certainly did.

I often hear about 9 yr old boys that have a girl friends as well. As far as I know they've already been experimenting.

The worst bit is seeing girls as young as 8, wearing mini-skirts, halter tops, calf high leather boots and whatever other kind of slutty clothing you can think of. It's...disturbing.

Then you have all those freaky teenagers online that are asking some of the stupidest questions to do with sex. The stupidest I've seen is "How do you hump? My bf wants to know."
1/If he doesn't know she should know.
2/If they had to ask it then they shouldn't even think about doing it.
Seriously, I have actually seen more than one person ask that...so there isn't just one of them -_-""

AARGh...I can't exactly lay the blame in any particular direction. But what I wrote in my most recent myotaku entry has a significant amount of relevance I believe. It specifically targets the music industry, or more specifically the horror I've been seeing in music videos lately.

Anyway, I'm tired and angry with this. However what I typed looked reasonably coherent. Good night all.[/COLOR]

[InuyashaLvr]

[SIZE=2][I][COLOR=DarkRed]O.k.... I really have to argue with you on this one kenshins babe.

First off.... making fun of or putting someone down because they are younger than you is dispicable and rude.... Sure all of us do it everynow and then, but try not to over exxagerate such a small thing...

Second.... MAYBE just MAYBE their having trouble! You could help them. I've been in the band for about 4 years now, it's not very easy when you first start out, and it takes a year or two to get used to everything am I not right? We're you a little confused when you first started?

Third... TECHNICALLY you're a younger kid... so am I... but I am a freshman in highschool... So next time.... think of a better title, cause' it kind of puts all of us down.

Sorry if I sound irrational, but I don't think this is right. You're younger than alot of us on here, and technically you fall under your own title...

thanks for listening to my consitant blabering...
*-. InuyashaLvr .-* [/COLOR] [/I] [/SIZE]

[Transtic Nerve]

[quote name='kenshinsbabe']but I'm sure other people share my thoughts.[/quote]

Well looks like you were wrong, I'm sure getting something wrong doesn't make YOU stupid now does it? Of course, that could only be other people, not smart, intelligent, ridiculously arrogant you would it?

[Panda]

It appears that this thread has run it's course. Please remember when responding to a thread that you make your point without trolling.