Tupac Amaru Shakur

[Your Mother]

[SIZE=1]The man. The myth. The legend.

Never have I listened to a song by 'Pac without [I]feeling[/I] the meaning behind the words. He is every rapper's idol, he's been imitated and learned from, and his life's work is tremendous.

Right now I'm listening to "Street Fame", a song about the streets, and even though that's not new, his lyrics are AWESOME. No one today can top them. [I]No one.[/I]

Even though he died in 1996(Believed to have been killed by a henchman from the gang of rival East Coast Rapper Biggie Smalls), he is still making money to this day.That's amazing. His albums are extensive, his lyrics meaningful and rhythmitic.

So what do you think of 2pac? Feel free to post your thoughts, but, if you just want to bash rap in general, don't post in here. If you're not going to be openminded, don't post in here. If you don't like 2pac, that's fine, but state your reasons in a constructive way.

[URL=http://www.azlyrics.com/19/2pac.html]Albums and Lyrics[/URL] [/SIZE]

[boxybrown305]

[COLOR=DarkRed]To be honest i don't like rap, not at all. However there are some cases that i do still respect it. In this case, he has earned my respsct. Mostly for reasons listed above. Basically someone who can make a decent rap that actually has meaning to it (and is more than a string of the same synthesised "beat" repeated over and over/ same lyrics over and over/ random swears over and over), has my respect. I [I]really[/I] don't like most new rap. A lot of the older stuff, though, i don't listen to, i do respect.[/COLOR]

[Retribution]

[SIZE=1]He still doesn't get my respect. Sure, he may be a great rapper of the time, but he's still enslaving black people to the same stuff we've been through for the last forty years. A rapper gets my respect once they try to fight that stereotype. I'll give you an example from Pac... Keep in mind this song is called [b]Young Black Male[/b]

"I'm ****** the sluts and hoes
The bigger the butts the tighter the clothes
The gimminy jimminy grows
Then whaddya know, it's off with some clothes
Rowd when the crowd says hoe
That let's me know, they know I can flow
Love when they come to my shows
I get up and go, with skins before
When I'm collecting my dough
I never respect, the one that I back
The quicker the nigga can rap
The bigger the check, now watch how they sweat
What kind of style is that?
The style of a mack, and ready to jack
I rendered up piles of black
The wacker the pack, the fatter the smack
I hate it when real nigga bust
They hate when I cuss, they threaten to bust
I had enough of the fuss
I bust what I bust, and cuss when I must
They gave me a charge for sales
For selling the tales... of young black males

Yes nigga, N-I-G-G-A niggaz"

I've let the OB censorer take its toll on the lyrics -- anything else that fell through I'm sorry about.

Anyway, the lyrics are ridden with remarks that have been drilled into black people's minds over time... such as referring to ourselves as a "nigga." This was the name we tried to shake for the past several hundred years? The word of disdain and racism? The word that King died trying to stop?

And he just uses it.

The first and last few lines of the verse I quoted are probably the worst. This is a reason I don't like rap. Too many "niggaz" and talking about killing people, and "******* hoes" ... too much for me to want to put up with.



I remember he had some song about his mother... it's probably the least offensive of his. Either way, I can only recall this small portion of it.

"Even though she was a crack fiend mama
She always was a black queen mama
When she caught me running from the police (that's right)
Mama catch me put a whoopin' to my backside"

In conclusion, he doesn't deserve my respect. You don't get it if you use the word nigga. Ever.[/SIZE]

[boxybrown305]

[COLOR=DarkRed]A strong point by Retri there, i must rethink my post. I do still respect some rappers.[/COLOR]

[Juke Box Hero]

[QUOTE=Your Mother]
his lyrics are meaningful[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Retribution]

"I'm ****** the sluts and hoes
The bigger the butts the tighter the clothes
The gimminy jimminy grows
Then whaddya know, it's off with some clothes
Rowd when the crowd says hoe
That let's me know, they know I can flow
Love when they come to my shows
I get up and go, with skins before
When I'm collecting my dough
I never respect, the one that I back
The quicker the nigga can rap
The bigger the check, now watch how they sweat
What kind of style is that?
The style of a mack, and ready to jack
I rendered up piles of black
The wacker the pack, the fatter the smack
I hate it when real nigga bust
They hate when I cuss, they threaten to bust
I had enough of the fuss
I bust what I bust, and cuss when I must
They gave me a charge for sales
For selling the tales... of young black males

Yes nigga, N-I-G-G-A niggaz

[/QUOTE]

Meaningful my ***. Do you ever listen to what he is saying? This is uncultured, unrefined, barbarous nonsense. Geez man this is some offensive stuff, "nigga"? Bloody hell, read a book about the 1830's and the 1960's and you'd have a vastly different view of that word. I am sickened by your adoration of manic debauchery... Degradation of women, racial slurs, extreme profanity, gratuitus violence... what is constructive, or meaning ful or amazing about any of this?

Nothing.

I sincerely hope that you are a rare case, because if this country is full of these opinions, we are in very big trouble.

[boxybrown305]

[COLOR=DarkRed]It is complete. I've lost respect for the man. I suppose i should have looked into it a little more before jumping to conclusions. :animedepr [/COLOR]

[Genkai]

Sure, this man is talented. There's no way to deny that. His rhymes reek of skill and experience, and bring out heavy emotions.

BUt to be honest, I got to go with Biggie.

[jean_san]

I'm not a hardcore rap fan but I recalled watching Tupac Resurrection on the TV. Pac's portrayal of the hungry waiting for food was simply clever and witty. If you don't know what I'm talking about, here it is...

Kindly waiting for some food...

"We're hungry, please let us in... we're hungry, please let us in..."

A looong time later...

"I come up through the door blasting!"

Anyways, just felt like mentioning that. :D

[Retribution]

[SIZE=1][QUOTE=Genkai]Sure, this man is talented. There's no way to deny that. His rhymes reek of skill and experience, and bring out heavy emotions.

BUt to be honest, I got to go with Biggie.[/QUOTE]
Biggie's no better, probably less intelligent in this raps. Sure, it does take alot of skill, but his message loses him all points he may have gained. You say nigga and spoon-feed children this sh**, you will [B]never[/B] be respected by me.[/SIZE]

[conpiracymonki]

[SIZE=1]I'm not black so I can't ever say that word affects me in any way but if you're not willing to look at what they're trying to get at instead of just skimming through a song and picking at no-no words, then obviously you won't see what attracts people to them.

If you wanna take them as they are, I just wanna say that for every "Young Black Male" there's a "Mama's Just A Little Girl". And I'll shut up now.[/SIZE]

[Retribution]

[SIZE=1]True... but mostly not. You're right, I may be missing the "bigger picture" by looking for no-no words but the point I'm making is the same. How many "Mama's Just A Little Girl" are there? Read Pac's lyrics, and tell me what they're talking about?

Bustin caps, ****** hoes, living in the ghetto, broke as hell. Fine, sing about what you want, but when it hits the mass media, and kids are trying to fulfill this thug fantasy, something's wrong. The media is part of the problem, kids try to live up to this glorified thug-life, and sure, there's problems at home too. But if rappers like this would cut it out and start rapping about something worth while and omitting the word "nigga" that has enslaved blacks for the past x-hundred years, they'd get my ear.[/SIZE]

[Zen]

[color=sienna][size=1]

You'd be hard pressed to find a rapper of color not using the big N-Word. You have to think that, since rapper's are all about rapping with the lingo they hear everyday, it would take a prominent role in their lyrics. Yeah, Tupac did use the word alot, but hey, there is a reason he rapped the way he did. The use of the N-Word (I say that out of respect), busting caps, hoes, and all that, have a reason. The way he was brought up was in between his father, a real street thug, all of his friends and the people around him, who mostly were thugs, and his mother, who was, of all things, a revolutionary Black Panther. I mean, his mom was pregnant with him in prison. So, yeah, him rapping about his surroundings and what he's been through has some reason to be as vulgar as it is. Rapper's don't look for kids to listen to there music, its not like they encourage it, and it's not their fault that it falls into the hands of children that young.

But then again, I never really got into the whole Tupac thing. I never really listened to his music, so I have no place to say how his lyrics spoke to minors.

Jay-Z, a rapper who has a similar vulgar style and talks about drug dealings in the past and gun toting, but then, he says things that tell you that thats not the way to go... like in "Izzo".

"Hov' is back, life stories told through rap/
Niggaz actin' like I sold you crack/
Like I told you sell drugs; no, Hov' did that/
So hopefully you won't have to go through that/"

Thats my defense for some MCs, who speak of the street life in a negative way. [/color][/size]

[boxybrown305]

[COLOR=DarkRed]I agree with Mugen on the point that many rappers say what they say based on previous experience, but there's no need to give that excperience, even with lyrics, to younger generations. Of course, as Mugen said, that's not neccessarilly their fault, we greatly have MTV among others to thank for our increasingly vulgar pop culture. I do approve of Jay-Z's little anti-drug campaign there, but that's four lines compared to how many more vulgar lyrics?

At any rate, the most rap i like is a rock/rap hybrid. Linkin Park comes to many people's minds immediately, and their ok, but i'm mainly thinking of Cypress Hill, and especially Rage Against the Machine. Rage had an excellent MC, and some extremely good band members as well. Their final album they made, Renegades was the most heavily rap influenced, and it did throw around the N-word a little, but all of their albums hold an [I]extreme[/I] political statement. It wasn't random trash about growing up in "da hood" or anything. It was some of the most meaningful lyrics i've heard, way more than Tupac or Biggie ever did. The other thing is that the music is so amazingly complex. It sounds like nothing more than a regular rap song at times, with scratching and synthesizing or whatever, but absolutely ALL of their music is done with nothing but a guitar, bass, and drums. I highly recommend them to anyone who likes rap or rock.

That's the other thing, i also have a huge respect for DJ's. In terms of rock, again Linkin Park comes to most minds, but i think of Slipknot first, although in this case, both (Sid Wilson and Joe Hahn) are exceptionally good. Most of what i listen to for DJ's is techno, though. Stuff like Chemical Brothers, Prodigy, Hive, so many more.

Anyway, having digressed quite enough, my point is that there is so much out there that is very similar to rap, but has so much more meaning and power and talent poured into it than a rap about growing up in the ghetto, with vulgar language.[/COLOR]

[Juke Box Hero]

[QUOTE=Mugen][color=sienna][size=1]

You'd be hard pressed to find a rapper of color not using the big N-Word. You have to think that, since rapper's are all about rapping with the lingo they hear everyday, it would take a prominent role in their lyrics. Yeah, Tupac did use the word alot, but hey, there is a reason he rapped the way he did. The use of the N-Word (I say that out of respect), busting caps, hoes, and all that, have a reason. The way he was brought up was in between his father, a real street thug, all of his friends and the people around him, who mostly were thugs, and his mother, who was, of all things, a revolutionary Black Panther. I mean, his mom was pregnant with him in prison. So, yeah, him rapping about his surroundings and what he's been through has some reason to be as vulgar as it is. Rapper's don't look for kids to listen to there music, its not like they encourage it, and it's not their fault that it falls into the hands of children that young.

[/color][/size][/QUOTE]

Like hell its not their fault! That's like saying a pot dealer has no control over who his customers are. I agree that his music reflected his tragic life, and thats not wrong, but he [i]targeted[/i] the teen market! Pac's music is very adult in nature, and has no place in the lives of children (or teens for that matter). In fact, I question its relevancy to modern US Culture....

[Zen]

[quote name='Raid3r]Like hell its not their fault! That's like saying a pot dealer has no control over who his customers are. I agree that his music reflected his tragic life, and thats not wrong, but he [i]targeted[/i'] the teen market! Pac's music is very adult in nature, and has no place in the lives of children (or teens for that matter). In fact, I question its relevancy to modern US Culture....[/quote]
[color=sienna][size=1]

Tupac was barely out of his teens when he became a famous rapper, I mean, he died at 25, and that was after a five year career as a rapper. So in all reality, if he was reaching a teen audience, then he was speaking to, basically, his peers. Now, as for your saying he was targeting children, I must disagree. Tupac might have tried to get his message to the 16+ crowd, but he didn't target children. He would have been a very bad role model, yes, but he didn't try to be a role model, he just rapped about his life.

Also, as for his relevance to US Culture, he is considered one of the greatest recording artists of the our generation, as far as Hip Hop goes, aswell, his murder is still unsolved, and is wrapped in contraversy. Again, I am not a big Tupac man, but I do know that most gangsta rappers are not targeting 'children' with their message. Maybe mature teens, but not children. It's not the rapper's fault who gets their hands on the music, its the people who publish and distribute the rapper's music.[/color][/size]

[Ima]

Rap is nothing I like and I will probably never like. But one rapper dose have my respect and this is tupac. Its obvious your looking at the younger tupac Because if youve ever listened to any decent song by tupac then you would understand what he is about. Listen to changes and tell me you cannot respect a man like Tupac. I hate it when people judge others on one song. There may be one artist who has not made a bad song and that man is of course Jimi Hendrix. Tupac is quite amazing and if you listen to songs I will list below then you will respect this man.

Tupac sings about what he believes in and I do not believe he was killed by Biggie Smalls. Tupac Sparked somthing that will continue until end of history if youve ever heard him speak then you would rethink and what you have said about him. Tupac was changing the world for the good. I hate to say this but many people have been killed by none other than the Machine... Yes thats right to all of you nay sayers the goverment is corrupt and if you had half of a brain you would see this. Listen to anything by Rage Against the Machine and you might understand unless you of course cannot understand there lyrics. Tupac sparked somthing that could have very well turned a big majority of the people on the goverment. If you do not understand why MTV is trying to get young kids to vote then you are blind. I respect very few Rap Artists but if you listen very closely you will get there message. Rap is not only Swearing and Killing there are messages.

Songs:
Smile
Changes
Ghetto Gospel(Feat. None Other Than Elton John.)
All Eyez On Me
Hail Mary
Keep Ya Head up(Or Your)
Dear MaMa