Religious ideologies

[DBZgirl88]

[COLOR=#004a6f]First of all, this isn't meant to be a 'what is your relgion?' thread. But I thought i'd ask relgious OBers what shapes their beliefs.

My mother recently had a chat with her ESL teacher about religion. Her teacher claims that she is Chrisitan, but she told my mom that she didn't believe that Jesus was the son of God --she believed he was prophet. Since this was the Islamic perspective of Jesus, my mother further questioned her about Muhammad. Her teacher told her that she believed that Muhammad was also a prophet. My mother asked her, if that's the case, why isn't she a muslim?

Her teacher simply said that she disagrees with polygamy, which is permitted in Islam.

I find it odd how many people nowadays seem to be only choosing aspects of religion that appeal to them than the religion as a whole.

Why is it that some christians believe that the Bible is the word of God, yet at the same time don't believe in hell? The Bible states that evil-doers and infidels will go to hell doesn't it?

It just doesn't make sense.

What are your views on this?[/COLOR]

[Syk3]

Well when you declare yourself completely one religion, you're kind of thrown into all of their beliefs and practices and so forth, and seems to me as if you're basing your beliefs on your religion and not your religion on your beliefs. That makes much less sense to me than if someone were to discover and create their own beliefs based on studying many religions, seeing which individual parts they agree with most and holding a self-religion, if you will. That way you can include your own thought, your own philosophy, your own morals, your own beliefs, your own everything; you'll be able to argue your side and provide proof for believing what you do, rather than someone telling you what you believe and you have to sort of deal with it. :D Some Christians will believe in the bible but not take it literally, and then simply fill in the rest, and that might be what you're seeing.

And now I'd like to cite a quote from a book I'm currently reading called [i]Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance.[/i]

"To doubt the literal meaning of the words of Jesus or Moses incurs hostility from most people, but ... if Jesus or Moses were to appear today, unidentified, with the same message that he spoke many years ago, his mental stability would be challenged. This isn't because what Jesus or Moses said was untrue or because modern society is in error but simply because the route they chose to reveal to others has lost relevance and comprehensibility." -Robert Pirsig

[Anime Elf]

I honestly think that if you say that you're a __(fill in the blank)__, act like it. There are some people who think that a lot of whatever __(blank)__ said is outdated, but it's not too hard to bring older philosphies and teachings to modern day. We do it with the Constitution all the time (not the best example I admit, but it was the first to come to mind).

Anyway, picking and choosing what you want to believe it kind of stupid. I do realize that there are divisions in religions, and I'm okay with that, but you would still be a __(blank)__. Picking from multiple religions isn't that good, because you're refusing the parts you don't like. This isn't your dinner. I think that's why a lot less people are becoming less religous, and more aligning themselves with the values of certain religions while not committing themselves fully to that religion.

All this to say, if you claim you're a __(blank)__, act like it. Don't sit around and pick and choose from anything while you say you have committed yourself to religion or ideology or philosophy.

[Retribution]

[size=1]Well, the foundation of my religious ideology was shaped by going to church every Sunday -- a Protestant one. As a result of learning Christian beliefs during my "formation" years, I consider myself a Protestant Christian, and share most of their beliefs.

I grew up in a very liberal, open-minded area, where people had those "War is not the answer," "Peace on Earth" signs in their yards, where people played the guitar in the park with friends, where half the neighborhood was vegetarian, you get the point. This, I think, was a really great nuturing environment, and instilled in me a sense of acceptance and appreciation of diversity. I kept an open mind about religion, and made sure I didn't turn into some crazed zealot.

Now, I attend a Catholic school, which has forced me to look at the other side of the Christian fence. My values haven't really changed at all, but I do pray to the Virgin Mary now -- a very minor change from my Protestant (no belief in Saints) views.

I personally believe that if you lead a good life, that if you have a truly good heart, no matter your religion (or lack thereof), you will be in heaven. I think that Christ is just, and that He will see the kindness in everyone's hearts, rather than be a Pharisee and discriminate against Gandhi just because he wasn't Christian. And yes, I believe in Hell.[/size]

[TheShinje]

[color=crimson] I myself, am a comitted Christian, and I believe in all aspects of the faith.

I can in one way put that down to my parents, and in a way, I can put it to myself. I was born and raised as a Catholic, however a few years ago I fell-out with the Catholic doctrines and, of a while, I grew distant, in the end, however, I foudn a church that taught all the things that I truly believe in,a nd I started going there on a regular basis, which caused some controversy in the predominantly Catholic side of my family, but they now respect my decision to cross-over, as it were.

So, in a sense, I have mxed up my original faith a litle, yet, that's within the confines of Christianity itself. I can't see myself adopting any aspect of another religion into mine, since my beliefs are pretty much solid-footed.[/color]

[Retribution]

[QUOTE=Shinji][color=crimson] I myself, am a comitted Christian, and I believe in all aspects of the faith.

[...]

So, in a sense, I have mxed up my original faith a litle, yet, that's within the confines of Christianity itself. I can't see myself adopting any aspect of another religion into mine, since my beliefs are pretty much solid-footed.[/color][/QUOTE]
[size=1]How can you believe in all aspects of the faith, when there are many, many denominations? Catholics believe in praying to Saints, whereas Methodists believe you should only pray to Jesus. Catholics confess their sins to a priest, while Baptists confess directly to Jesus. I think I know what you mean in general, I just wanted to know what you meant specifically.[/size]

[DBZgirl88]

[COLOR=#004a6f]Syk3, That still doesn't explain how wanting something to be true simply makes it true.

Logically speaking, if God does exist, and he did create hell, and sent down a book to humans stating so, how does not believing in hell suddenly make it dissappear? There's a big difference between hopes and reality.

Ofcourse, if you didn't believe in any specific religion, then that would mean that you would also believe they are man-made. And that would make the teachings one accepts from each religion simply based on human philosophies. Why would God (or gods) send down so many different relgions if they contradict one another?

Isn't religion what people believe God wants from us? How he wants us to worship him?

For instance, the only reason I follow Islam, is becuase I believe the Quran is the word of God verbatim. And the reason I believe this is because to me, the book itself is a miracle. It has divine qualities. I can feel it in every word I read from it.

Not only that, I also believe that the book has not been altered by humans.

Now, maybe not everyone feels the way I do about the Quran (for others its the Bible, the Torah, etc), but since I feel this way about the Quran, would it not be logical for me to follow its teachings? How would not liking one aspect make it not true? Just because I don't like hell, that reality would cease to exist?

I'd say the only logical alternative to following any specific religion is simply to believe in some sort of creator, and perhaps you could assume some of the attributes that creator would have (love, mercy, power). And perhaps that righteous people will be rewarded and the wicked will be punished. But that would be that. Only then can a human philosophy of what is right and wrong be put in place.

Religions tell us what [B]God[/B] thinks is right or wrong, so the only reason not to follow any of these religions is if you think they are not what God thinks.

[quote name='Retribution']I personally believe that if you lead a good life, that if you have a truly good heart, no matter your religion (or lack thereof), you will be in heaven. I think that Christ is just, and that He will see the kindness in everyone's hearts, rather than be a Pharisee and discriminate against Gandhi just because he wasn't Christian. And yes, I believe in Hell.[/quote]But then what would the point be of being christian? The only thing about this ideology that doesn't make sense is its connection to christianity. Chrisitanity teaches that only christians go to heaven, it's a complete contradiction. So why would you believe in this religion? (I mean no offence or pressure Retri).[/COLOR]

[Syk3]

[QUOTE=Anime Elf]I honestly think that if you say that you're a __(fill in the blank)__, act like it. There are some people who think that a lot of whatever __(blank)__ said is outdated, but it's not too hard to bring older philosphies and teachings to modern day. We do it with the Constitution all the time (not the best example I admit, but it was the first to come to mind).

Anyway, picking and choosing what you want to believe it kind of stupid. I do realize that there are divisions in religions, and I'm okay with that, but you would still be a __(blank)__. Picking from multiple religions isn't that good, because you're refusing the parts you don't like. This isn't your dinner. I think that's why a lot less people are becoming less religous, and more aligning themselves with the values of certain religions while not committing themselves fully to that religion.

All this to say, if you claim you're a __(blank)__, act like it. Don't sit around and pick and choose from anything while you say you have committed yourself to religion or ideology or philosophy.[/QUOTE]Sure, if you officially declare yourself to be of a certain religion, that's fine. I don't have a problem with people who are in a religion and believe what that church teaches. I'm just saying it might not be the best option if, in the process, you're sacrificing your creativity and individuality. What's wrong with refusing parts you don't believe if you [i]don't[/i] decide to be utterly committed to one? Surely people are allowed to think and come to their own conclusions through study.

One last quick thing I wanted to say was that it would be hypocritical to think of one committing themselves to just one ideology or philosophy. If you're searching for knowledge and truth, then that entitles you to change your mind, make exceptions, or borrow from whatever you want as much as necessary.

[QUOTE=Chabichou][color=#004a6f]Syk3, That still doesn't explain how wanting something to be true simply makes it true.

Logically speaking, if God does exist, and he did create hell, and sent down a book to humans stating so, how does not believing in hell suddenly make it dissappear? There's a big difference between hopes and reality.

Ofcourse, if you didn't believe in any specific religion, then that would mean that you would also believe they are man-made. And that would make the teachings one accepts from each religion simply based on human philosophies. Why would God (or gods) send down so many different relgions if they contradict one another?

Isn't religion what people believe God wants from us? How he wants us to worship him?

For instance, the only reason I follow Islam, is becuase I believe the Quran is the word of God verbatim. And the reason I believe this is because to me, the book itself is a miracle. It has divine qualities. I can feel it in every word I read from it.

Not only that, I also believe that the book has not been altered by humans.

Now, maybe not everyone feels the way I do about the Quran (for others its the Bible, the Torah, etc), but since I feel this way about the Quran, would it not be logical for me to follow its teachings? How would not liking one aspect make it not true? Just because I don't like hell, that reality would cease to exist?

I'd say the only logical alternative to following any specific religion is simply to believe in some sort of creator, and perhaps you could assume some of the attributes that creator would have (love, mercy, power). And perhaps that righteous people will be rewarded and the wicked will be punished. But that would be that. Only then can a human philosophy of what is right and wrong be put in place.

Religions tell us what [b]God[/b] thinks is right or wrong, so the only reason not to follow any of these religions is if you think they are not what God thinks.[/color][/QUOTE]It's not about [i]wanting[/i] things to be true. It's about discovering for yourself as a free man and not a whipped mule, free of stubbornness what things are true or even what they mean to be true. If it means changing your mind, go ahead, but don't confuse this with any wishful thinking.

By your logic, I would first have to acknowledge the premise that God exists. But what if I do not? Then your argument ceases to apply. Of course something that exists in the noumenal (actual, as opposed to a human experienced world) wouldn't disappear by simply not believing in it. But some people want to discover truth for themselves with logical support instead of having a book tell them. Therefore the truth of the bible is also in question, and as such some desire further proof. What else do you have to give me?

It's not necessarily one or the other here. Perhaps if one does not believe in a sole religion, the individual believes that each may have gotten some correct with help from a higher being, but not entirely. Mix and match what you can see the logical proof in. You tell me why God would send down so many religions. Which is the right one, and what if none of them are right? What if God didn't send them down and they were created by man, like you brought up?

Yes, religion is what people believe does God's bidding.

Your beliefs of truth to the Quran are your own. This does not require me or anyone else to follow Islam as you do. But it's not about denying it out of like, but denying out of lack of proof. No one should accept what they think are the good aspects of religion (God loves you, you can go to Heaven), and then deny what they don't like (you can go to Hell, God is angry). I form my beliefs around the basis of arguable truth. I'm saying that it's possible that some religions note particular things that [i]are[/i] arguable and I may agree with the premises.

But you're correct in saying that I may not believe that this is what God wishes. I think it's more important to become excellent in life for your own reasons before worrying about what may happen in the afterlife. While it's logical to assume that human function is what we should be doing, God's bidding is too unknowing for myself to use as an actual goal.

[Retribution]

[quote name='Chabichou][COLOR=#004a6f']But then what would the point be of being christian? The only thing about this ideology that doesn't make sense is its connection to christianity. Chrisitanity teaches that only christians go to heaven, it's a complete contradiction. So why would you believe in this religion? (I mean no offence or pressure Retri).[/COLOR][/quote]
[size=1]I think you should be whatever feels most comfortable to you. To me, that's being a Christian -- it's a personal decision. There's an example for you that'll hopefully give you an idea of what I mean.

Your father is very nice to you, and therefore you thank him. Your father is very nice to your brother as well, but he doesn't thank him to his face. Instead, he expresses his thanksgiving through giving back to him, by helping others, by doing extra chores around the house. You would be the Christian in this example -- you thank who I believe to be God directly, and your brother isn't a Christian, who praises his father through other acts.

I find it more satisfying through thanking Him directly.

Christ once said that you should not follow the law as it is written to the point where the divine law becomes unjust. Christ taught that you can and should help someone out on the Sabbath, despite him being a Jew, and it being a Commandment to do [b]no[/b] work on the Sabbath.

I think it's the same way with religion -- that if you blindly say "You're not ____, so you're going to hell," you're no better than the Pharisees who said "You're not in line with your teachings, so you're (insert negative adjective here)."

Sorry if that didn't completely explain it.[/size]

[Pumpkin]

[SIZE="1"][LEFT]I'm not going to talk about my own "faith" because honestly that most likely could offend some of the people here that are highly religious. People take parts of other religions because of their views, does being in a religion mean that you have to follow every rule? Actually I think you don't.

As you know, some christians believe the bible to say that gays are wrong when in fact, many christians I know are fine with gay rights. You don't have to believe in every point in the bible to say that you are a "true" christian, it's not right to go against what you feel in your heart. If god "loves everyone" then he will love you for what you feel is right (as long as its not murdering innocent people, then we might have a problem there). I've never heard of someone who believes in Heaven but not hell but I have to say that having your own belief is not foolish or stupid. It's a part of your idendentity and morals. Keep this in mind, not everyone reads the bible the same. You may read the bible and take it completely different from the person next to you. Everyone has their own views on it and everyone has their own morals based on it.

All religions have something in common and that is [b]god[/b] whether he has a different name or not. If you can get past the specifics of the bible and not take it TOO seriously word for word, then maybe you will see my point. But then again, who am I too say? I've never been a very religious person myself. But I just had to state that setting your own set of beliefs from religion(s) doesn't sound like a dumb idea to me. [/SIZE][/LEFT]

[Gavin]

[SIZE=1]Interesting, most interesting.

Well like Retri I was born and raised Roman Catholic, my parents took my to Mass every Sunday in our local Church, and I received some of the sacraments through school, First Confession, First Holy Communion and finally Confirmation. At some point I began to question the entire idea of religion, how without hard scientific proof anyone could accept the idea of some omnipotent creator. However the more I found myself questioning my beliefs, the more I found myself being able to accept that something as wondrously complex as the universe could not simply happen at random and that all it's beauty was proof of something greater.

Eventually my devoting myself to Roman Catholic belief boiled down to a leap of faith, I had always been Catholic and I agreed with everything I had been taught, that is to say what little we are taught via the so-called "religion" classes in secondary school. I know it sounds somewhat like I only remained Catholic because there was no alternative, but consciously I have always found the Church and Catholic shrines to be very spiritually peaceful places. Something I just don't feel when I am in other religious buildings, even other Christian faiths.

I visited Vatican City a few years ago as part of a school trip to Rome and Italy, and just walking around in such a sacred place was indescribable, it felt as if I were closer to God there than I had ever been before. We were supposed to hear Mass in Latin given by Pope John Paul II as well, but sadly never got the opportunity, I think actually hearing the Holy Father giving Mass would have been a very personal experience. I really can't explain why it is that I believe exactly what I believe, why I'm Catholic and not Jewish or Muslim to give two examples, it's really just down to faith and I genuinely can't give a better explanation.[/SIZE]

[Panda]

I was raised in the [u][URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missionary_Church]Missionary Church[/URL][/u]. I went to Sunday School, Youth Group and Sunday Services. I learned how important it is to care about one another and how things like murder and stealing is wrong. I never had any issues with those teachings. It is the "only Christians go to Heaven everyone else goes to Hell" teachings that bothered me.

The majority of my family is [u][URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nichiren_Buddhism]Nichiren Buddhists[/URL][/u]. This includes my father, grandparents, aunts and uncles...all Nichiren. When the Sunday School teacher said that anyone who hasn't accepted Jesus as their Lord and Savior would go to Hell it made me sad. That means, even though my grandparents were good, caring, law abiding citizens they are in Hell right now. My dad would go to Hell too unless he converted. That really bothered me. I was taught that God was a loving and caring being, not the hateful/vengeful God that some religions teach. So why would he do that to good people?

This is something that has bothered me for many years. I have come to the point where I am just not sure what to believe. I do believe that caring for the world around us: people, animals and environment is important. I also believe that there is a higher being watching over us.

In the end I guess I will continue to do what I have all my life. It's very hard for me to put into words. I will continue to live life with both teachings in mind. I will pay my respects at the family shrine by burning incense, leaving flowers and food for my grandparents. At the same time I will say a prayer to God to watch over them. It may seem a bit strange to some, but this is what I have been doing for longer than many of you have been alive.

[Delta]

[COLOR=#790A43]What shaped my religious beliefs, huh? Clergymen, the Bible, people around me, the environment I live in and, of course, my own biases. From them I've learned that sometimes religious texts shouldn't be taken literally but I always have to ponder on them with a degree of seriousness. "Ponder" being the word that is most stressed.

Religion doesn't come as a one whole package. It's like a program with numerous patches and expansion packs, yeah? What you receive in the original program are its core values and teachings, which I believe are, by and large, the same for different religions. It provides a relatively stable base/foundation for the expansion packs, aka. your beliefs.

[quote name='Chabichou][COLOR=#004a6f]Chrisitanity teaches that only christians go to heaven, it's a complete contradiction. So why would you believe in this religion?[/COLOR'][/COLOR][/quote]Hrmm... I disagree. I've yet to hear that from a member of the clergy, a nun, or a catechism teacher. Everytime I ask them if non-Christians can go to Heaven, they say yes, non-Christians do go to Heaven. The only thing that matters is how good one was in one's life, they say. It's kinda like that heart-weighing thing with Osiris and the scales of Ma'at. [SIZE=1](awright! 10 Internets for Egyptian mythology allusion!)[/SIZE]

[Adahn]

[size=2]Nobody believes completely in the words of any religious text. Your faith is not in the bible, quran, or whatever. Your belief is in an interpretation of those books. You can scold people for picking and choosing things from religions, but it should be obvious that every denomination of every religion picks and chooses different things. If there were an interpretation of a holy book that was absolutely certain, then there wouldn't be denominations. What does that tell us? It tells us that either one of the denominations is correct and all others are wrong, or all the denominations are wrong. The latter seems more likely to me. Don't judge others for making their own interpretations. Our ancestors did the same thing, as can be seen by the different denominations. What has robbed those of our time that right? Is it because those interpretations are aged that they are to be accepted without question? With age comes not wisdom, goodness, or infallibility. Bad things come with age in the same amount as good things. If the old (or new) ideas don't appeal to you, then reject them. But, reject them within yourself, and leave all other things be.[/size]

[DBZgirl88]

[COLOR=#004a6f][quote name='Adahn][size=2']Nobody believes completely in the words of any religious text. Your faith is not in the bible, quran, or whatever. Your belief is in an interpretation of those books.[/size][/quote]Well sure, some aspects of holy scriptures are subject to interpretation, which is why there are sects in religions, but I'm really refering to the basic fundamental ideas of the religion. If the Qur'an says not to consume alcohol, that's just a simple basic instruction. How is that subject to interpretation? "Don't drink alcohol" means.... "don't drink alcohol!"!

If you go back to my first example, my mother's teacher, she accepts the fact that jesus and muhammad are prophets sent down by God. She simply doesn't agree with polygamy, which is only permitted, but not encouraged in islam. Not only that, the subject of polygamy is found in the Quran, not simply muhammad's teachings.

Even if she doesn't like polygamy, how does that tie in with the basic fundamentals of the religion? It doesn't make sense for her not to follow the religion if she believes it's from God.[/COLOR]

[Boba Fett]

[quote name='Chabichou][COLOR=#004a6f'] If the Qur'an says not to consume alcohol, that's just a simple basic instruction. How is that subject to interpretation? "Don't drink alcohol" means.... "don't drink alcohol!"!.[/COLOR][/quote]

[color=green]So am I allowed to eat a dessert prepared with liquor? Would drinking a non-alcoholic beer violate the spirit of that passage?

Everything is interpreted.[/color]

[quote name='Chabichou][COLOR=#004a6f'] She simply doesn't agree with polygamy, which is only permitted, but not encouraged in islam. Not only that, the subject of polygamy is found in the Quran, not simply muhammad's teachings.[/COLOR][/quote]

[color=green]Just curious as to why an all powerful god would, when creating a book you claim has never been altered by human hands, place within that text something he permits but does not encourage.

If you're god, why settle for anything less than perfection in your laws?[/color]

[TheShinje]

[quote name='Retribution][size=1']How can you believe in all aspects of the faith, when there are many, many denominations? Catholics believe in praying to Saints, whereas Methodists believe you should only pray to Jesus. Catholics confess their sins to a priest, while Baptists confess directly to Jesus. I think I know what you mean in general, I just wanted to know what you meant specifically.[/size][/quote]
[color=crimson] I should have been more specific in my explanation, I believe in all aspects of my faith, which is a faith derived from the protestant movement in Christianity.

So it means that I do not pray to the saints to believe in offering up prayers to Mary, and like my fellow Baptists, I cofness sin directly to God, and a trusted friend. (We are encouraged in the Bible to cofness sins to one another.)[/color]

[Adahn]

[size=2]Hell is a nine-month sentence to the womb, and God's gift to the world through the sacrifice of his son was an opportunity to escape it and live forever on earth as we were always meant to be.

These things don't sound very "Christian", and that's because they aren't what the vast majority of Christians believe. However, in reading the Bible, I have found these things to be the truth.

People shouldn't turn away from God just because they don't believe in the widely accepted interpretation of His word. Panda has confirmed what I already believe; that Christianity as it is today turns people away.[/size]
[size=2][/size]
[size=2]If the widely accepted view of Christianity were God's word, then it would be acceptable to all good people who hear it. I know good people who can't accept Christianity as it is now, and that is a sure a sign as any to me that Christianity today is not what God intended it to be.[/size]
[size=2][/size]
[size=2]It should require only faith to accept God, not a hardening of one's heart to the eternal torment of innumerable souls.[/size]

[Sara]

[font=trebuchet ms][color=33333]Chabi, when you are puzzled by these things, it's simply because you look at things a different way. You are Muslim, and in conjunction with that, you believe that the Quran is, as you said, God's word verbatim. You believe that it is an absolute source of truth, and that is a large tenet of your faith.

But many people do not have the same absolute faith in their respective holy books. I think, here, that you are wrong in making no distinction between "disliking" what something says and "disagreeing" with what it says.

Julie is a Christian, and believes "all Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness." (1 Tim 3:16) She believes that she was sinful, is redeemed by Christ, and will go to heaven. However, she finds herself questioning certain aspects of the Bible. For instance, she finds herself deeply troubled over Ephesians 5:22, which states: "Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord." An enlightened, 90's kind of girl, she doesn't just dislike that verse, she disagrees with it. It isn't an issue of, "Oh, well, I'll just ignore that bit since it's so old-fashioned." It is something that she has thought about, prayed about, and simply cannot reconcile with her personal beliefs--call it faith, stubborness, or perhaps conscience. For reasons of her own, Julie cannot and will not accept "submit to your husband" as a rule of her faith.

Is this picking and choosing what you want to believe in? I don't think so. Belief is a very personal thing--when it comes right down to it, faith is the business of just two beings--one person, and one God. (I am speaking here, I suppose of only monotheistic religions, but I think my point stands--what you believe is the business of no other human.) Julie believes firmly that she and her loving husband entered their marriage as equals, and they will continue to live as equals in all aspects of their relationship.

Does this make Julie any less of a Christian? No. A Christian, fundamentally, is someone who believes that Jesus saved them from a life (and/or) death of misery. Whether or not someone applies that verse to his or her life has [i]nothing[/i] to do with it.

"Wives, submit to your husbands" is an example of a controversial passage, not a point that I wish specifically to debate.[/color][/font]

[DBZgirl88]

[COLOR=#004a6f][QUOTE=Lore][COLOR=#33333][FONT=Trebuchet MS]Chabi, when you are puzzled by these things, it's simply because you look at things a different way. You are Muslim, and in conjunction with that, you believe that the Quran is, as you said, God's word verbatim. You believe that it is an absolute source of truth, and that is a large tenet of your faith.

But many people do not have the same absolute faith in their respective holy books. I think, here, that you are wrong in making no distinction between "disliking" what something says and "disagreeing" with what it says.[/FONT][/COLOR][/QUOTE]Allright, Lore, the way you put it, it makes more sense to me.

I'm sorry, but I would like to still go back to my first example of my mother's teacher.

If she believes that both Muhammad and Jesus were prophets, shouldn't she believe there is at least some truth behind their teachings? Islam for instance, isn't really about polygamy or women covering themselves, or holy wars or whatever comes to your minds when you think of the religion. It all really boils down to worshipping one God. So I ask you, logically speaking, if she believes Muhammad is a prophet sent by God, that the Quran is a holy scripture, why not at least worship God, why not just follow the fundamentals of the religion? Do you get what I mean?[/COLOR]

[Adahn]

[size=2]Chabichou, it is possible to know of God and still not choose Him. When God gave us that choice, I think He knew that there were some who would take it. Why this woman chose this path is as much a mystery as why God allowed her to follow it.[/size]

[Ellerby]

[quote name='Chabichou']Chrisitanity teaches that only christians go to heaven[/quote]
[color=#333333]In a sense, that is true.

It is said in the bible that when you die, you will be put in a holding place until Judgement Day (I believe that's what it's called) when God will confront you and ask you one simple question. Basically, it's do you believe in God/Jesus and love them with all your heart.

If you answer yes, then you will go to heaven and if you answer no, you will be sent to hell. There is more to it then that, such as a huge battle, but that is the short version. I know that is what Pentacostal Christians believe.

I was raised as a Pentacostal Christian and so, that is my religion. However, my parents would not prohibit me from changing my religion (although they would not approve).

I believe everything the Bible says, and so that is what I follow. I am only 15 and am just learning more and more about my religion, but so far it is all as I thought and I continue to remain Christian.[/color]

[Sara]

[QUOTE=Chabichou][COLOR=#004a6f][COLOR=#004a6f]I'm sorry, but I would like to still go back to my first example of my mother's teacher.

If she believes that both Muhammad and Jesus were prophets, shouldn't she believe there is at least some truth behind their teachings? Islam for instance, isn't really about polygamy or women covering themselves, or holy wars or whatever comes to your minds when you think of the religion. It all really boils down to worshipping one God. So I ask you, logically speaking, if she believes Muhammad is a prophet sent by God, that the Quran is a holy scripture, why not at least worship God, why not just follow the fundamentals of the religion? Do you get what I mean?[/COLOR][/QUOTE][color=33333][font=trebuchet ms]Ah, I see what you are saying. To rephrase: The ESL teacher said she believes Jesus was a prophet. So, too, she believes Muhammad was a prophet. If she believes that they were prophets (and by inference, agents of God's will), why doesn't she follow their teachings?

I don't know the woman, of course, so I cannot make any accurate comments about her specifically. However, I have heard several people say similar things--That Jesus was a prophet, or Muhammad a prophet, or both. Several of my Christian friends claim to believe Muhammad was a prophet. I would be very surprised if any of these people had more than a passing knowledge of Islam.

I guess I can't answer your question except to say that in many cases admission that "Oh, he was a prophet" seems to be a fairly easy, politicaly correct, polite conversation ender.[/color][/font]

[EVA Unit 100]

[quote name='Chabichou][COLOR=#004a6f']If she believes that both Muhammad and Jesus were prophets, shouldn't she believe there is at least some truth behind their teachings? Islam for instance, isn't really about polygamy or women covering themselves, or holy wars or whatever comes to your minds when you think of the religion. It all really boils down to worshipping one God. So I ask you, logically speaking, if she believes Muhammad is a prophet sent by God, that the Quran is a holy scripture, why not at least worship God, why not just follow the fundamentals of the religion? Do you get what I mean?[/COLOR][/quote]

Well, you're supposed to worship God in Judaism and Christianity as well. The 3 big monotheistic religions are basically just different paths to the same goal. It really all about which religion someone feels most comfortable with.

[Guest The Eighth Sin]

I'm a Satanist, no I'm kidding. I'm agnostic. I'm going to find out the truth of the world, debunking beliefs, religion, and society. :animeswea