Manga Naruto Manga [Warning: Spoilers]

[chibi-master]

HEY! Waitta minute! Gavin, didn't you just say that it's highly unlikely that Sasuke would beat Itachi?! Now you're assuming he'll win and Tobi(*squeal!*) is going to tell Naruto about his victory?! You're hurting my head here!:bash:

[TwistedChick]

[quote name='chibi-master']HEY! Waitta minute! Gavin, didn't you just say that it's highly unlikely that Sasuke would beat Itachi?! Now you're assuming he'll win and Tobi(*squeal!*) is going to tell Naruto about his victory?! You're hurting my head here!:bash:[/QUOTE]

I'm pretty sure we all went into this fight believing Sasuke would have a [I]much[/I] harder time defeating Itachi than he's had so far. At this point, since Itachi's purpose for this confrontation has been revealed, the only plausible way for Sasuke to survive this fight is if he defeats Itachi, and we know Sasuke won't die here without facing Naruto again, he [I]will win[/I], at least to the point of completely debilitating his brother. Gavin's comment just points out the obvious, that Itachi [I]should have been[/I] an extremely formidable opponent, but he sure hasn't been portrayed as such thus far. He still seemingly has displayed power, but his skill is near nonexistent. With Kishimoto taking such "artistic liberties" with his characters, we could see just about anything from just about anyone at this point. Having Tobi reveal the current state of affairs to Naruto and co. would be a dramatically fulfilling moment. Kishi will probably jump at the chance.

[Gavin]

[quote name='TwistedChick']I'm pretty sure we all went into this fight believing Sasuke would have a [I]much[/I] harder time defeating Itachi than he's had so far. At this point, since Itachi's purpose for this confrontation has been revealed, the only plausible way for Sasuke to survive this fight is if he defeats Itachi, and we know Sasuke won't die here without facing Naruto again, he [I]will win[/I], at least to the point of completely debilitating his brother. Gavin's comment just points out the obvious, that Itachi [I]should have been[/I] an extremely formidable opponent, but he sure hasn't been portrayed as such thus far. He still seemingly has displayed power, but his skill is near nonexistent. With Kishimoto taking such "artistic liberties" with his characters, we could see just about anything from just about anyone at this point. Having Tobi reveal the current state of affairs to Naruto and co. would be a dramatically fulfilling moment. Kishi will probably jump at the chance.[/QUOTE]

[SIZE="1"]Pretty much sums up what I was going to say, thanks TC.

Basically I assumed that Sasuke was going to get utterly pwned when he entered the fight, right now though it's looking increasingly likely that he will end up winning. Now I'm assuming (again) he's actually going to win, which is what the manga seems to be screaming at us every chapter, and that Tobi/Madara will be aware of it, and then pass that info on to the Konoha-nin/Naruto to either distract them away from the area, or make Naruto fight harder.

Sorry if I made your head hurt, I didn't think I did that big of a 180, or at least one that didn't come about for obvious reasons.[/SIZE]

[Solo Tremaine]

[quote name='TwistedChick']With Kishimoto taking such "artistic liberties" with his characters, we could see just about anything from just about anyone at this point.[/quote][COLOR=#503F86]Well, they are his characters :p He's probably been planning this for a very long time. I don't imagine he just woke up one day when these chapters were coming up and thought 'I know, I'll make Sasuke Lord of Everything'. There's reasoning in there somewhere, heh. Let's hope Sasuke does actually get balanced out somehow (perhaps eliminating his Cursed Seal powers in this battle, or [i]something[/i]), or it will get boring. If there's no jeopardy for the characters then there's no excitement.[/COLOR]

[Gavin]

[quote name='Solo Tremaine'][COLOR=#503F86]I don't imagine he just woke up one day when these chapters were coming up and thought 'I know, I'll make Sasuke Lord of Everything'.[/COLOR][/QUOTE]

[SIZE="1"]You know, for some reason, I actually wouldn't be surprised if Kishi did. Heh.

The weirdest thing about it is that Sasuke originally wasn't even one of the manga characters, I'd say Kishi has taken very much to him since then.[/SIZE]

[Kei]

[color=darkblue][size=1]With his "Life Hack" no jutsu powers, you really can't say that you didn't see it coming eventually. I knew from the start that Sasuke was going to be someone that would eventually be powerful beyond belief, but I didn't think Kishi would take it that far.

I'm also sure that Kishi is in some ways tailoring things toward the fans, as well as himself. Sasuke's got plenty of drones in his fanperson army, so it's likely there'd be a revolt if something happened to him outside of getting somewhat injured.

Like Gavin, I'm really more interested in seeing Naruto's powers develop more. I was so happy to see Naruto find new uses for his Kage Bunshin way back before all this retconning and crap started happening. I want to go back to that. D:[/color][/size]

[Magus]

[COLOR="Red"][SIZE="1"]I actually like the side track away from Naruto. They focus too much on him anyway. (They need to change the name of the series too.) Yep, I can't stand Naruto lol.

I didn't think much of Sasuke's technique. God-modded... Perhaps, but then again, it was already god-modded when Gai said Kakashi could cut lightning with the Chidori ^^. And seeing that I would think Sasuke is fire and lightning/thunder type, controlling lightning would come up sooner or later.[/SIZE][/COLOR]

[chibi-master]

I don't really understand why you don't like Naruto. Anyway, I DON'T like the break from Naruto because he's fighting Tobi:love2: Wow...I guess I don't really care about the break from Naruto...I just miss the break from Tobi...OH! You're right, Memphis, they SHOULD change the title! To....TOBI!!!!! (sorry, I have an obsession for Tobi...)

[Tifa Strife]

I think Sakura has changed over the years.Since learning that sasuke is not cominh back.I think she wants to be stronger.And which i know she can do it~!^^:animesmil

[KisukeUrahara]

My friends have all given up hope on Naruto; they're going as far as to call it [I]Sasuke[/I] from now on. I guess it's kind of a more fitting name if you really think about it :P

[Magus]

[quote name='chibi-master']I don't really understand why you don't like Naruto. Anyway, I DON'T like the break from Naruto because he's fighting Tobi:love2: Wow...I guess I don't really care about the break from Naruto...I just miss the break from Tobi...OH! You're right, Memphis, they SHOULD change the title! To....TOBI!!!!! (sorry, I have an obsession for Tobi...)[/QUOTE]

[COLOR="Red"][SIZE="1"]"Deep breath". I could make this short and sweet by just saying I like silent / calm characters.

When it first started out, Naruto was rash, idiotic, naive, annoying (and so many other words.. I'd lose my job if I use them XD). He played pranks to seek attention. I don't mind it, but at the same time I don't care for attention seekers. The only thing I acknowledge that Naruto is good at is seeking to learn and his determination. Don't get me wrong, throughout the series, I saw the progression of his character, but that don't mean a thing with me.

He's not funny, so he loses there as well. Sexy Jutsu... People are easily amused by guys with nose bleeds. And I understand the little sex jokes that Japan uses, they're just not funny. But then again, I don't have much of a sense of humor... (I don't think that's the case though. ^^)

Now that we're in this time leap... Naruto = Sora (KINGDOM HEARTS) [strike]and Akatsuki = Organization XIII..[/strike] And like Sora, Naruto's still naive and rash. Naive characters are idiots. Sasuke tried to kill him twice now, yet he still wants to bring Sasuke back to the leaf village. (He's loyal that's for sure) But being the realistic type that I am, our friendship is over (after the first attempt), and I'd be quick to launch a knife at your throat. (Vengful indeed XD)

Now I'm pretty much just tapped out on rash characters. I've watched (read for Naruto and Bleach) DBZ, Rurouni Kenshin, Yu Yu Hakusho, Naruto, Inuyasha, Bleach and back to Naruto back to back. And this whole rushing in without using your brain is tiresome and annoying. I like, and I'll admit that Naruto's using his head more. But it's too little, too late.

As I said before, I like characters that're silent, calm, and use their heads. (The arrogant ones comes to mind XD)

With all that being said, though, Naruto, at this point will probably continue to gain my respect but I will never like him. It's not really all that hard to understand why some people don't like Naruto. Afterall, it's a preference in what I prefer. Hope that gives you a better understanding :animeswea "exhale" " winded"

Edit: Oh, as for the name changing. I prefer something dealing with all the characters and not just one, because there are so many characters in this one with there own story, and to just up and call it Naruto just seems "bleh". I've got this issue with all anime/manga that decides to name there series after a character in the story itself.[/SIZE][/COLOR]

[Gavin]

[SIZE="1"]I actually agree with a lot of what Memphis has said in his post, as much as I hate [strike]Sasuke[/strike] the way in which Sasuke's powers have been built up, Naruto still irritates me in a lot of way.

The comparison between Goku and Naruto comes up a lot, not only because of their originally weak strengths eventually giving way to lead character pwnage, but also because like Goku with Vegeta, Naruto has an undaunted belief in the inner-good of his friend/rival Sasuke. The biggest problem here is that we could actually see Vegeta turning good a heck of a lot sooner than we can see Sasuke.

Sure Vegeta was pure evil when he was introduced, then had his priorities change until by the end of the Buu Saga, he was genuinely good. But Sasuke just doesn't have the potential for his redemption in my opinion, because what pushed Vegeta towards his redemption was that Goku was not only continually stronger than Vegeta, except for certain circumstances, but also that Goku achieved Vegeta's main goal, to kill Frieza for the murder of their people. Sound familiar ? And Goku beat Frieza at the peak of his strength, unlike the cripple-beater Sasuke.

Really, even if Naruto is still young, he really needs to mature a heck of a lot to catch up with the other characters. He had three years away and came back a slightly taller, slightly more grown up version of himself, but only barely. Where was the Yondaime Junior we were expecting ? Yes he has shown himself more capable of deeper thought than before, but ultimately, aside from less orange in the jumpsuit, he's the same Naruto we've always known. Naruto is supposed to be like Jiraiya, but in all his fights, Jiraiya showed himself to be a very tactical, capable fighter as well as the joker of the Sannin. Naruto has yet to show this.

So yeah, Sasuke's growth = Suck-assness. Naturo's lack of growth/maturity = Suck-assness.[/SIZE]

[chibi-master]

Well, Gavin and Memphis, you're both right about Naruto and his stupidity. After hearing all this I have now lost any care about Naruto whatsoever. Oh well. Although, Memphis, I still have to stick to my wish for a Tobi title...

[Gavin]

[quote name='chibi-master']Well, Gavin and Memphis, you're both right about Naruto and his stupidity. After hearing all this I have now lost any care about Naruto whatsoever. Oh well. Although, Memphis, I still have to stick to my wish for a Tobi title...[/QUOTE]

[SIZE="1"]Maybe I went a little over-board. Even if Naruto is still rather immature, I have to admit, I like him as a character. He has several qualities, completely aside from his strength, his capability as a fighter or his status as the main character, which make an audience root for him.

He's got a lot of guts, heart and determination, and he's got one hell of a mark on him which has given him a very ****** life. At least Sasuke knows who his parents are, Naruto has always had to question why he was the one picked to carry the burden of the Kyuubi, and why the villagers hated him for it. He's been alone his entire life, and yet he's not a complete emo, in fact, it's given him a lot of depth as he never judges other people straight off as he's been so often.

Naruto's also been side-stepped by teachers for various reasons, even Kakashi, his supposed Jounin instructor always favoured Sasuke above Naruto, and the same with Sakura. In reality, Jiraiya has always been Naruto's most influential teacher, and now he's lost him as well.

The biggest problem for Naruto is really when we see him in conversation now, we see his depth, but the moment he fights, it all vanishes and the audience suddenly sees pre-Shippuuden Naruto again. He needs to prove he's learned more, and we already know he can learn at a rate two-thousand times that of a normal shinobi. Really, Naruto, if he went about it the right way could probably catch up to Sasuke a lot faster than would seem possible.

So yeah, I may not like his lack of development as a fighter, but I still like him now as a character.[/SIZE]

[TwistedChick]

I also have always liked Naruto as a character. He isn't my favorite from the show, but he's a decent person who doesn't sulk the way we could expect him to (i.e. Sasuke), but rather has a goal that would involve protecting those very people that shunned and despised him when he was younger, a goal that he is 100% serious about achieving. We are supposed to believe, and I do, that he has the potential through his own strength, not relying on the kyuubi or cheating with some Stage 2 bullcrap like Sasuke, to finally come into his own and live up to his father's name. As of yet, he hasn't seemed to really get the flow of battle the way we would expect from Yondaime's son, but once he can get into the moment and combine all he's learned with what I'm sure he is about to learn, we should finally be able to see some of Konoha's Yellow Flash.

[Magus]

[COLOR="#8B0000"][SIZE="1"]Chibi-Master, don't let my words persuade you from liking Naruto. (or any other characters) If you like Naruto, then so be it. Persuading's never been my thing. I'm just indifferent about majority of what other people think about certain fan favorites :) (It's pretty obvious that I can't stand Jiraya as well lol.)

I actually like Sasuke's growth, but at the same time I not much of a fan of Sasuke, although, I've been growing fond of him. He's impressed me quite a bit from the start of the time leap to now. He don't complain about lacking power anymore, so that's a plus. Kishi turned him into a mini Itachi.

Another reason you can say I like Sasuke's growth is because I'm substituting it for Neji's limited amount a time he's been shown since the time leap. When he was shown, he (nor Lee) did nothing spectacular to show any type of improvement. Yet Shikimaru gets ample amount of time... (No Neji development Kishi?)

Forgot what else I was going to say.[/SIZE][/COLOR]

[Gavin]

[quote name='Memphis'][COLOR="#8B0000"][SIZE="1"]Neji's limited amount a time he's been shown since the time leap. When he was shown, he (nor Lee) did nothing spectacular to show any type of improvement. Yet Shikimaru gets ample amount of time... (No Neji development Kishi?)[/SIZE][/COLOR][/QUOTE]

[SIZE="1"]Yeah, I have to admit, I was expecting a lot more from Neji than has been shown so far, I mean we know he's made Jounin but yet there's nothing there that really shows how he earned the rank. Neji was established as a sort of pre-massacre Itachi character, I want to see what that potential has developed into that doesn't just include refining the techniques he already has.

It's the same again with Lee, but then, his whole lack of chakra does limit his character potential. [/SIZE]

[Starwind]

I do agree, I'd like to have seen more developement from both Lee and Neji, since I'm a fan of both charaters. But, despite everything, and the fact that he's such an idiot that it's almost painful, I think my favorite character is Naruto. I know he hasn't had much development, but at the same time, I feel like I idetify with him more then any of the other characters of this show.

I can understand growing up with no one believeing in you and looking down on you all the time. I had to deal with that with my own family, and I still have to to this day. And I think it's because of that that is why I've come to almost admire him at times.

I know it sounds kinda stupid, but that about sums it up for me. I just feel a connection to him and no matter what happens I have to say he is far and away my favorite character.

[Solo Tremaine]

[COLOR=#503f86]Ironically enough, Sasuke and I share the same birthday, according to the databooks...[/COLOR]

[COLOR=#503f86]The problem with putting Neji in now is that he hasn't got much plot to drive him. Where before he had the whole destiny/fate thing going on, he's past that and as a secondary character there's little else he has, except fighting. And Byakugan can only entartain so much. I'm much more interested to see Hinata break out of her shell.[/COLOR]

[Gavin]

[quote name='Solo Tremaine'][COLOR=#503f86]The problem with putting Neji in now is that he hasn't got much plot to drive him. Where before he had the whole destiny/fate thing going on, he's past that and as a secondary character there's little else he has, except fighting. And Byakugan can only entartain so much. I'm much more interested to see Hinata break out of her shell.[/COLOR][/QUOTE]

[SIZE="1"]Yeah, it seems when Naruto relieved Neji of his destiny angst he also took away his entire plot, heh. ^_^; I suppose Neji's story could continue with his efforts to change the Hyuuga for the better, but really, it would have been far more interesting for him to snap and repeat the Uchiha massacre for Konoha's remaining doujutsu clan.[/SIZE]

[Kei]

[color=darkblue][size=1]To be honest, I would like more Hinata development. I was happy when we actually got to see her come into her own a little more (though that was primarily during the epic-length filler arc in the anime).

Honestly, I can see Hinata eventually becoming the head of the clan with Neji as her second. We've seen her grow over the course of the story somewhat relative to Naruto's. As long as he keeps developing, so will she. Though with the way things are going now, that won't be for a while...

As far as characters go, I'm still quite inclined toward Naruto myself. There's just something about his drive and attitude that draws me. But that's from the main characters. As far as secondary characters go, Iruka wins forever. The way he grew and fit into Naruto's life like a father figure has always touched a soft spot with me. He's also pretty amazing as a shinobi, so he's definitely got me in his corner, heh.[/color][/size]

[Gavin]

[quote name='Kei'][color=darkblue][size=1]I can see Hinata eventually becoming the head of the clan with Neji as her second. We've seen her grow over the course of the story somewhat relative to Naruto's. As long as he keeps developing, so will she. Though with the way things are going now, that won't be for a while...[/color][/size][/QUOTE]

[SIZE="1"]I don't know, there'll have to be an eventual face-off between Hinata and Hanabi over the rulership of the Hyuuga clan for Hinata to succeed cleanly, which would definitely make for a good smaller arc. I can see Neji training her for it and eventually developing a new respect for his cousin, as the failure of the Main Family and the Genius of the Branch, they make an interesting contrast which should be expanded upon.[/SIZE]

[Magus]

[COLOR="DarkRed"][SIZE="1"]392 was pretty interesting... (A day early?) Question. What is Susano suppose to be? In a way, it looks like a summoning type jutsu.

I can't help but laugh at Orochimaru's attempt to come back only to be sealed away. I also can't help but wonder if that's the last time we'll see him.[/SIZE][/COLOR]

[Gavin]

[quote name='Memphis'][COLOR="DarkRed"][SIZE="1"]What is Susano suppose to be? In a way, it looks like a summoning type jutsu.[/SIZE][/COLOR][/QUOTE]

[quote name='Wikipedia']Susanoo creates a massive spiritual warrior resembling a yamabushi, which will fight on Itachi's behalf, weilding a shield in its left hand, and in its right, the legendary Totsuka no Tsurugi (十拳剣, lit. "The Sword Ten Hands Long"?), also known as the Sakenagi Longsword (酒刈太刀, Sakenagi Tachi?, lit. "Sake Cutter Longsword"). The Totsuga no Tsurugi, commonly sheathed in a sake jar held by a third hand growing from Susanoo's right forearm, is an etherial weapon with an enchanted blade capable of sealing anything it pierces in an eternal dream-like illusion, and is described as the perfect counter to Orochimaru's Kusanagi Sword[/quote]

[SIZE="1"]Guess that explains it, welcome back the Itachi we knew.[/SIZE]

[quote name='Memphis'][COLOR="DarkRed"][SIZE="1"]I can't help but laugh at Orochimaru's attempt to come back only to be sealed away. I also can't help but wonder if that's the last time we'll see him.[/SIZE][/COLOR][/QUOTE]

[SIZE="1"]Yeah, poor Oro, he thinks he finally has a chance, assumes what appears to be his most powerful form, and then gets sealed away forever by a blind, chakra-less Itachi. Wonder if this means Sasuke has lost the abilities he gained from Oro too ?[/SIZE]

[Kre]

[quote name='Gavin']


[SIZE="1"]Yeah, poor Oro, he thinks he finally has a chance, assumes what appears to be his most powerful form, and then gets sealed away forever by a blind, chakra-less Itachi. Wonder if this means Sasuke has lost the abilities he gained from Oro too ?[/SIZE][/QUOTE]

Last I checked, Itachi still wasn't fully blind, I believe there's a spot in 391 that shows his vision. But yes, this chapter was interesting. And as Gavin said 'welcome back the Itachi we knew.' I just hope he still wins this fight like he should have all along.