Mysticism - your points of view

[Guest tanukioh]

O.o My other thread on POVs kinda died, and I didn't wanna put another post on it since I thought it might be grave digging.... :) So I started a new thread.

o.o This time around, I guess I'll leave science out for the most part, since most people concidered it the perfect answer (though I disagree) and I don't feel like starting a fight. I want this to be a peaceful thread with intelligent discusion on: Magics, philosophy, myths and mythical creatures, how they are linked together, who believes in them [color=DarkOrange](NO INSULTING ANYONE THAT BELIEVES, EVEN IF YOU DISAGREE!!!)[/color] alchemy, and any other such things. :animesmil

I hope for as big a turn out as my last thread, if not bigger.

OH! I promised in my other thread that I would explain how my magic works! :P i almost forgot! It's like this: [color=DarkGreen]^_^ nature gives off energies that flow into the body. O.o it's kinda how if someone around you is in a good mood, they can make you in a good mood, or you can put them in a bad mood. Senergy, i think it's called.

anyways, nature gives all living things energy. but it's not a 1 way link. We give energy back. By controlling what form the energy takes, where it goes, and what it does, we can cause things to happen. this is called "Magic".

We also get energy from other living things, which is why we can do magic on them. ^_^ so basically, magic is controlled energy exchange that uses only a life form, its energy, and what the energy is acting on/acting to do.

o.o that's my idea, at least. I think it applies to all magics. v.v but i'm not sure.

what do you think? [/color]

I don't want discussion on ^ this to be the only thing on here, but I do want it discussed. :D

Let the fun begin! :cool:

[color=DarkGreen][font=Trebuchet MS]Ohoho, amusing thread title. Didn't really tell anyone what the thread was about, though, so I changed it. If you've got a different idea of what it should be called, PM me and I'll change it again. Take a look at the [u][thread=52331]Otaku Lounge Rules[/thread][/u] for more info on informative thread titling.
[/font][/color] [right][color=DarkGreen][font=Trebuchet MS]-Raiyuu[/font][/color]
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[Guest Gun Preacher]

I think maybe i could have been possible for anything involving mythology to be real ounce opon a time maybe dragons,spirts,gods,mages,witches,ect. proballly did walk the earth the just died out like the dinosours.

i dont know but with all the stuff left behind from those days something has to be true.

[The_Mix_Breed]

I certinly agree with magic, well, at least wiccan. The art of auras in the air and everyone having untapped ablities with them. Those who have taped into them are called psychics. For some, it's to be able to see a break in the dimesional lines, and to look into the futre. Others can sense emtotions and energy waves in our minds and read our thoughts. Others can simple take these auras and turn them into a physical energy, like fire or water.

Then theres seeing spirts, the higher life forms, heaven and hell, all that relates some how to magic. But one must not confuse magic with religion. One can not veleive in god, but still see angels, or they can be strongly faithful and say archangels and guardin angels are fakes and don't excist. Some people see spirits of the past, and while some people say there crazy, I beleive those ghost are there. Maybe their just emotions on overdrive progecting a imagine, but I beleive there is an imagine, at least in the mind of the one creating it.

Now I do not beleive in witchs on broomsticks or magic wands but potions and spell I do beleive in. Lighting incese and candles, while muttering incantations my not summon things as seen in movies, but it does wonders for stress and unlike yoga, it comes from a spiritaul sense, not a muscle sense. And I for one do not like doctors, I use natural remedies, potions, and I'm healthy.

So, in conclusion. I do not beleive in fairytale magic. I beleive in natural magic with an spiritaul sorce and good purpose. Wiccan. If what I said makes no sense to you, there are many Wiccan books that will easliy clear your mind, and you'll know I didn't make any of that up. I simply beleiv what I've read and decided was right. And wow, this is a long post, for me anyway.

[Guest tanukioh]

[QUOTE=Gun Preacher]I think maybe i could have been possible for anything involving mythology to be real ounce opon a time maybe dragons,spirts,gods,mages,witches,ect. proballly did walk the earth the just died out like the dinosours.

i dont know but with all the stuff left behind from those days something has to be true.[/QUOTE]
O.o please explain some of this dying out thing. o.o as far as I've heard, gods don't die, and spirits are...hard to kill.

^_^ as for mages and witches, there are probably many of them around today (including myself, though I prefer to be called an "onmyouji")

:D thank you very much for your reply!! :) I hope to hear much more from you.


[quote=The_Mix_Breed]
So, in conclusion. I do not beleive in fairytale magic. I beleive in natural magic with an spiritaul sorce and good purpose. Wiccan. If what I said makes no sense to you, there are many Wiccan books that will easliy clear your mind, and you'll know I didn't make any of that up. I simply beleiv what I've read and decided was right. And wow, this is a long post, for me anyway. [/quote] Cool. :) I hold some of the same thoughts, though I'm not wiccan. I'm into onmyoudou. >.> I hear they are similar. ^_^only I treat mine as a philosophy, and I hear some wiccans consider wicca a religion.

However, (cut it out, sorry) I'm not sure about the summoning-not-real thing. O.o I tried a summoning about a week ago, and I got a kappa for like a half a minute. v.v then it vanished (I chickend out and revoked my spell). o.o then I tried a summoning again today at a big lake, but I wasn't strong enough and ended up with a head ache. >.> so I think summonings are possible. :D They're just really really hard.

Thank you for your reply. I'd love to carry on a conversation comparring our magics on PM, if you want. And I look forward to your next post.

[The_Mix_Breed]

[QUOTE]Cool. I hold some of the same thoughts, though I'm not wiccan. I'm into onmyoudou. >.> I hear they are similar. ^_^only I treat mine as a philosophy, and I hear some wiccans consider wicca a religion. [/QUOTE]

Its true, some consider wicca a religion, but as I stated, it doesn't all evolve on angels and demons, and though we have shrines, we don't use them for worship. We use them as mediums between our world in the next.

It's cool you managed a summoning, if only breifly. I don't really focus on that type of wicca or onmyoudou, I likeusing incantations and rituals to try to speak to someone of a higher evolution, like an angel. I also makes potions, and I study the art of telling what dreams mean. it's cool, if not sometimes scary.

[Albert Flasher]

[QUOTE=tanukioh]

OH! I promised in my other thread that I would explain how my magic works! :P i almost forgot! It's like this: [color=DarkGreen]^_^ nature gives off energies that flow into the body. O.o it's kinda how if someone around you is in a good mood, they can make you in a good mood, or you can put them in a bad mood. Senergy, i think it's called.

anyways, nature gives all living things energy. but it's not a 1 way link. We give energy back. By controlling what form the energy takes, where it goes, and what it does, we can cause things to happen. this is called "Magic".

We also get energy from other living things, which is why we can do magic on them. ^_^ so basically, magic is controlled energy exchange that uses only a life form, its energy, and what the energy is acting on/acting to do.

o.o that's my idea, at least. I think it applies to all magics. v.v but i'm not sure.

what do you think? [/color]

[/QUOTE][FONT=Times New Roman]
[COLOR=Sienna]
What do I think? You've watched one too many DBZ rerun. But that's besides the point.

Just a little history listen from the Zigster here on witches that may not be relevent but is nontheless interesting. Ever wonder where the riding-a-broomstick idea came from? It's rather interesting. In parts of North America there is a tree that's sap acts as a drug, a euphoric drug at that, when it gets into the bloodstream. NOW, what is the quickest way to get something into you're blood stream? (Needles didn't exist at this time) For women at least, the vagina - and the blood capilliaries located there. You can figure out the rest.

So than you must ask yourself... if flying broomsticks were made up, what about everything else about witches? It seems highly unlikely that they'd make up one thing and everything else would be true. What's the logical conclusion?
[B]
Witches.
Do not.
Exist.
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[Guest tanukioh]

[QUOTE=The_Mix_Breed]
It's cool you managed a summoning, if only breifly. I don't really focus on that type of wicca or onmyoudou, I likeusing incantations and rituals to try to speak to someone of a higher evolution, like an angel. I also makes potions, and I study the art of telling what dreams mean. it's cool, if not sometimes scary.[/QUOTE]
:animesmil Oooo cool. :) Perhaps we should share spells? hehe. though onmyoudou deals more in the focus poriton of things. ^_^ all rituals, and such are simply to increase said focus and are up to the onmyouji to decide what goes into them.

[quote=Ziggy Stardust]

What do I think? You've watched one too many DBZ rerun. But that's besides the point.

So than you must ask yourself... if flying broomsticks were made up, what about everything else about witches? It seems highly unlikely that they'd make up one thing and everything else would be true. What's the logical conclusion?

Witches.
Do not.
Exist.
[/quote] :) LOL. Perhaps I have, but perhaps I'm right on the energy thing.

Interesting history (cut it for space), ^_^ and thought that may be made up, there ARE practicing witches in the US and other countries today. >.> not to be confused with wiccans, since that's 2 different magics. On top of this, even if witchcraft is bull, there is other schools and types of magic that exist, and may true. :)

Thank you for your input. ^_^ I look forward to your next post.

[Fasteriskhead]

Well first of all, being a nitpicker I really have to object to how the word "mysticism" is used in the topic title. T tanukioh I think in your talk about "nature" you're coming close (mysticism is, if I can get technical for a second, an ontological mode), but I really would like to be clear about the term. Mysticism doesn't necessarily have anything to do with myths, magic, or even philosophy (well, understood in the typical modern sense at least). It is a certain way that the world is (and, usually, how God is) and, in an inseperable way, how the world is to be experienced by human beings.

Do things like gods and spirits actually exist, that is, are there physical beings out there who will match their descriptions? I have no idea, although I guess it's remotely possible for me to open my door and see one wandering along the street one day. But even if they don't "exist" in the traditional scientific sense, certainly they still [i]participate[/i]. Anyone who thinks that, for example, a chinese earth god for a local village doesn't do anything in the community is kidding themselves. Anyone who thinks that magic (I use this word in the wide sense) has no effect on human lives is really just not understanding the situation. Magic may not [i]work[/i], obviously, and I dare anyone to keep up something which is intended to have an effect but never pans out. But the usual way that we understand any meaning magic (or whatever) may have as merely psychological, ideological, etc. already misrepresents what's going on and from the beginning fails to get any grip on it. Or, to put this another way: the most interesting questions about magic (or whatever), the ones that are actually going to matter, are not the ones devoted to showing very quickly that it's all fakey, hokey nonsense. Instead, they're the ones which try to understand how it works (the logic behind it), why it means anything, i.e. fundamentally the questions that try to address magic [i]as[/i] magic, as a [i]phenomenon[/i] in itself and not as something just psychological.

And at [i]that[/i] point you can do a really [i]good[/i] job of showing that it's fakey, hokey nonsense, if you'd like. But probably more useful than merely axing a certain "belief system" (I put it in scare quotes because "believing," commonly understood, has nothing to do with what's going on) is gaining a far greater understanding of how human beings fundamentally think and interact with their world. Which may or may not include gods, spirits, etc., by the way.

Okay, one more thing and then I'll stop.

[quote name='tanukioh']O.o please explain some of this dying out thing. o.o as far as I've heard, gods don't die, and spirits are...hard to kill.[/quote]Actually, this happens fairly commonly; I'm thinking in particular of some of the deaths that take place in Norse myth. Closer to home, Buddhist gods also die (their being really immortal just wouldn't make sense in the context). And, of course, there's always Nietzsche's infamous "God is dead! God remains dead! And we have killed him!"

[Guest Gun Preacher]

When i say die out i mean there was a big war and they killed each other our just left this world.

And for people who call theres selves mages i dont think you are until you make lightnig falls from the sky or your hands glow.

no offence

[Guest tanukioh]

[QUOTE=Fasteriskhead]Well first of all, being a nitpicker I really have to object to how the word "mysticism" is used in the topic title. T tanukioh I think in your talk about "nature" you're coming close (mysticism is, if I can get technical for a second, an ontological mode), but I really would like to be clear about the term. Mysticism doesn't necessarily have anything to do with myths, magic, or even philosophy (well, understood in the typical modern sense at least). It is a certain way that the world is (and, usually, how God is) and, in an inseperable way, how the world is to be experienced by human beings.

Actually, this happens fairly commonly; I'm thinking in particular of some of the deaths that take place in Norse myth. Closer to home, Buddhist gods also die (their being really immortal just wouldn't make sense in the context). And, of course, there's always Nietzsche's infamous "God is dead! God remains dead! And we have killed him!"[/QUOTE]OoooOOOooo. :) very good points.
o.o I originally named it something else, but the mods changed it....
sorry if it bothered you....

Ohhhhh... ok. ^_^ thanks for clearing that up. is very shibby

thanks for posting. can't wait to see what you put in next. (sorry for editing the biggest part of your post :( ^_^ but it was very cool, with very good points.)

[quote=Gun Preacher]When i say die out i mean there was a big war and they killed each other our just left this world.

And for people who call theres selves mages i dont think you are until you make lightnig falls from the sky or your hands glow.

no offence[/quote]None taken.

Coolness. :) Yes. that could have happen (given the evidence from Fasteriskhead, which I cut out for space. [sorry, again] ). But what would that mean for us humans? ^_^

>.< those would be hard to do. :D good thing I call myself an onmyouji, not a mage. LOL

[NekoSama101]

I belive magic can be used for good or evil and i believe that mstical creatures exsist. i don't think it's possible for someone to create such detailed creatures from imagination only.

[Guest tanukioh]

[quote name='NekoSama101']I belive magic can be used for good or evil and i believe that mstical creatures exsist. i don't think it's possible for someone to create such detailed creatures from imagination only.[/quote]
Cool! ^_^ I thought you'd say is all bad.