Gaming Super Mario Galaxy

[Guest The Blue Jihad]

Yes. A sandbag. Mario plops down. Especially when you're jumping over small barriers and trying to keep going in one particular direction while the camera is shifting ever so slightly, which ends up dramatically altering Mario's weird absolute-relative hybrid movement.

[COLOR=red][SIZE=1]Please keep the debate related to Super Mario Galaxy - that's what the thread is about. General "state of Nintendo" discussions should be moved to a new thread. I think that is pretty clear.

I know you're trying to upset/annoy the staff, but I think that's pretty lame for a guy who should have much better things to do. Drop the act and let's get back to enjoying ourselves. - James[/SIZE][/COLOR]

[James]

[font=franklin gothic medium]Well, I just got Super Mario Galaxy last night. I’m now up to the second Observatory (having cleared all the Galaxies in the first…and I’m about halfway through the Galaxies in the second I think).

So I’ll just call these early impressions, since I’m sure others are reviewing this game when they’re much further in.

At this point I’m really enjoying the game. I was hoping that all the reviews I’ve read wouldn’t affect me too much; I’ve kept an open mind and I’ve kept my expectations as low as possible, despite all of the positive comments.

I think I can definitely say that Super Mario Galaxy far exceeds both Super Mario Sunshine and Super Mario 64. It is easily the best 3D Mario game made thus far – whether or not it’s better than games like Super Mario Bros. 3 is going to be purely subjective in the end (given that comparisons between games that play so very differently are difficult anyway).

I also think that Super Mario Galaxy sets a major new standard on Wii – it’s the first Wii game that has really “wowed” me in just about every sense.

I’ve had some experience now, so I feel more comfortable talking about some of the issues that have been discussed in this thread.

First, I guess there’s the whole issue of linearity and so on. As far as I’m concerned, Super Mario Galaxy strikes just the right balance; it’s not as open and “lost” as some elements of Super Mario Sunshine were. At the same time, it allows for far more variety in exploration than Super Mario 64 did. So it really manages to strike just the right balance between guided linearity and “open plan” design.

I like that, depending on which star you select in a Galaxy, the Galaxy’s properties can change significantly. At the very least, you’re always led in new and interesting directions. This adds much-welcome variety when you’re constantly re-entering the same Galaxy.

In terms of control…I really had no issues here. The only thing I miss is the ability to jump and dive at enemies – I found myself wanting to do this quite regularly. However, I had no issue with either the tightness or the fluidity of the controls; Mario runs just as fast as he ever did and he’s just as manoeuvrable. I think one reason why he sometimes seems slower is that the camera is regularly further away from him than it is in other 3D Mario titles. This obviously makes Mario look a little slower, when in fact, he’s really no different than he was before.

I think it would be a good idea to boot up Super Mario 64 right next to Super Mario Galaxy and actually experience the difference in control for yourself. You will find that nostalgia can be a powerful thing!

In terms of camera, I think it’s a mixed bag. It’s a misnomer to say that you can center the camera behind you, in a sense. I noticed that when you’re running around spherical/floating space objects, the camera centers according to the “core” of the object. So in other words, it basically shifts the camera right over your head. This is useful and logical given the context of these little environments.

The camera only shifts behind you when you’re on one of the more traditional levels, where manual camera adjustment is actually required.

Did I ever have camera problems? Sure. There were a couple of very slightly awkward moments where the camera would move the wrong way or take a moment to catch up. These moments were not only rare, but they lasted for a fraction of a second.

So far, I’ve found the camera to be better than in other 3D Mario titles (although I did like SMS’s manual camera; I acknowledge that it was widely unpopular, however).

And in terms of 3D games in general, I don’t think you can really heavily fault the camera – I don’t think you can say it’s game-breaking or responsible for frequent deaths. I mean, out of any third person games that use auto-cameras…Super Mario Galaxy’s is definitely one of the better ones. It’s not flawless, but no game is.

So far I’m finding the game easy, although I’m an experienced Mario player – I imagine some parts of the game are going to be very difficult for people who are not accustomed to Mario titles. And I can also imagine some people having trouble with the spherical world concept in general…especially if you suffer from motion sickness or something like that. For me personally, it wasn’t a problem.

I haven’t yet flown or been underwater, so I’m still reserving a final judgement on some of these elements. But I’ve definitely played enough to have an idea about certain aspects of the game.

In any case, I can see that I’m really going to enjoy going through the rest of Super Mario Galaxy. It just has an undeniable sense of freshness and innovation that the Mario franchise desperately needs – I feel glad that this game really takes things a step further, rather than relying too heavily on old conventions.

One thing I agree with is what Charles said earlier, about the feeling this game gives you. It’s hard to describe…but I don’t think I’ve had the feeling since I played Super Mario 64 for the first time. There’s a certain emotion you get when you come across something so completely new and different as this; I guess it’s just a constant sense of wonder. And I haven’t experienced that in a while.[/font]

[Charles]

I would just like to say that it's nice to see some good sense return to this thread.

Otherwise, I'll comment on the difficulty by saying that although I never found the game very difficult, I did end up dying quite a bit during the later half of the game (especially if I tried to rush through a level). Some of the platforming in the boss stages, in particular, really impressed me. Like Super Mario Bros. 3, the boss stages became events that I looked forward to.

And yes, as far as linearity goes, sure the level design is not as ambiguous as other Mario games, but I find it much more dynamic. Revisiting the same level over and over and finding stars is not as fun as jumping into oftentimes drastic variations of a level (in my opinion).

Plus, the way I look at it, the old school Mario games were never really about going off in every direction exploring. The levels were very straightforward with little nooks and crannies you could find secrets in. Most of my enjoyment of older Mario games was gleaned from the genius that was the level design. Mario Galaxy is sort of rooted in that oldschool concept, except now the player is free to explore every surface of most objects. I never felt as if there was nothing to see--especially with how varied the level designs were.

All in all, still my favorite Mario game and hopefully a blueprint for other Wii developers. to follow. It's nice that anyone who actually doesn't have a vendetta against Nintendo, finally has a killer app to be happy with (although Metroid was quite good too).

[Goodbye, Face]

[font=arial][size=1]Last weekend, I played what will probably my only experience with the game for a long while. My friend has all the stars but the ones in the later levels, so I wound up jumping in on the last world, if they're still being called that.

I've never played a games where the gravity changes so dramatically so often, I had no chance to learn the game in an easier level first (because my friend is really pushy) and it was a total mind**** going around on a conveyor block thing in a square while jumping from place to place and getting attacked by enemies. After I lost half of his 50-something lives, he got on player 2 and started making things freeze around me, which made it much easier for me to deal with. XD

The camera didn't bother me, and I was impressed with it considering how the levels are shaped, etc. I never died because of it, but I only played like three levels.

Also, [spoiler]flying[/spoiler] = WIN.[/font][/size]

[James]

[quote name='Charles']Plus, the way I look at it, the old school Mario games were never really about going off in every direction exploring. The levels were very straightforward with little nooks and crannies you could find secrets in. Most of my enjoyment of older Mario games was gleaned from the genius that was the level design. Mario Galaxy is sort of rooted in that oldschool concept, except now the player is free to explore every surface of most objects. I never felt as if there was nothing to see--especially with how varied the level designs were.[/quote]

[font=franklin gothic medium]Yep. Super Mario Galaxy still gives you plenty of space to explore, but the game provides more specific direction as you go through.

I'm now about 45 stars in and I'm finding that the game is just getting better and better.

There are so many things to mention. For one thing, I love that every galaxy is just so completely different from the last - you just don't see any repetition at all in this game. While it might be easy to think of Super Mario Galaxy as just "Super Mario 64 with sperhical levels", that assessment just couldn't be further from the truth. The variety in this game is something that should embarass every other developer out there; the fact that Super Mario Galaxy never compromises by giving you the same challenge with a slightly different coat of paint is very refreshing.

As I play the game I notice so many little things that are easy to take for granted. This game just innovates at every turn...there isn't a single thing about it that's old and stale. So much of it is boldly [i]new[/i].

I recently played a level where you are [spoiler]in a "ring of water" in the sky - you know, the level where you have to race that shark thingy[/spoiler]. Not only was the concept cool, but getting that star was just breathtaking. I mean, sure, you're pretty much just [spoiler]swimming through underwater rings - in this case, nothing terribly new[/spoiler]. But what makes this unique is the amazing level design and the wonderful controls.

I honestly can't find fault with these controls at all, now that I think about it. Mario moves more nimbly in this game than I've ever seen before. Even compared to Super Mario Sunshine, I feel like I have quite a lot more freedom (despite not having FLUDD, which says a lot).

I'm also now coming across levels with far more complex gravity obstacles. Some of these are just mind-bendingly cool.

Another thing I wanted to mention was something really simple.

In Super Mario 64, for example, you get dropped into a world and within that world you have to find stars. Yes, you may sometimes discover caves or areas that aren't visible in the "overworld", so to speak. But in general terms...you're going back into the same level but you're doing a different task in that space.

What I love about Super Mario Galaxy is that each star in a level is a radically different experience.

I remember going to the ghost house level (I forget the galaxy's specific name) and thinking "I hope it isn't just a ghost house with nothing else".

And of course, I wasn't disappointed. Yes, you go into the house. But as each star comes along, you keep travelling in different directions. One moment you're floating way above the house and another moment, you skip your way through various objects and end up apparently miles from the house itself (but still in the same level).

This really adds so much to the game I think. It means that even though you might be continually visiting a level with a particular theme (i.e. desert), the level itself will be completely new each time you enter it.

[spoiler]I've also enjoyed looking for the green stars. Only found one so far, but you know what they remind me of? They make me think about those areas in the 2D games where you'd be rewarded for "breaking the level". I [i]love[/i] that you can actually discover unmarked places and "break the levels" in Super Mario Galaxy. [/spoiler]

This is an old-school element that really wasn't prevalent in Super Mario 64 or Super Mario Sunshine. I am really happy that it's made its way back into Super Mario Galaxy.

This is definitely a good reason to own a Wii - it's the first Wii game where I've really felt that my purchase was justified (because in all honesty, I don't think I've really felt that since WiiSports, although admittedly I haven't played Metroid yet).

And oddly enough, all of this is coming from someone who owns about twenty times more Xbox 360 games than Wii games. In fact, I have an entire shelf on my wall full of Xbox 360 games. I only mention it because, other than Mario, I haven't seen many reasons to neglect my Xbox 360 for quite a few months. Even as a Nintendo fan I acknowledge that, haha.[/font]

[BlueYoshi]

[color=darkred]Despite the Christmas rush I managed to get my hands on a Wii just last Monday and I love this game! I'm at 102 Stars, having completed the game around two days ago, and I can already say that it's the freshest thing I have played in ages, and that's a huge relief for me. I honestly haven't had this much fun playing a game since Tales of Symphonia in 2004 (for lack of funds, that is).

The graphics are incredible, and I adore the shiny glimmer that Mario has. But even more so than that, seeing enemies return from the 2D era in full 3D mode brought back a sense of nostalgia that I thought was gone forever. I mean, fair enough there are the Goombas and those odd caterpillars, but then there were the ones that took me by surprise, such as those round purple things with the orange spikes from the later stages of Super Mario World.

I can't argue with the controls at all. Everything is smooth and coherent and makes for excellent gameplay, although it's a little bit frustrating when swimming, but it's not so bad as to make it unplayable. As for the camera angles, I can see where some of you are coming from, but truthfully, it has never hindered my game. There are those odd lapses where it'd be nice to have a little more freedom in that respect, but I usually just switch to the first person mode to get a better view of the area I'm having trouble with.

The power-ups rock, but unfortunately flying suffers from the same issues as swimming, though I am yet to use the ability for a proper cause. I just use it to get around the Observatory quicker.[/color]

[quote name='James'][font=franklin gothic medium][spoiler]I've also enjoyed looking for the green stars. Only found one so far, but you know what they remind me of? They make me think about those areas in the 2D games where you'd be rewarded for "breaking the level". I [i]love[/i] that you can actually discover unmarked places and "break the levels" in Super Mario Galaxy. [/spoiler][/font][/QUOTE]

[color=darkred]It's very interesting that you should say this, because I personally got the same feeling from the [spoiler]Green Stars[/spoiler] as I did from unlocking the Special zone in Super Mario World all those years back (apart from the manta ray level, which just reminded me of Super Mario Sunshine). The feeling that it's a reward for the player for kicking so much ***. I also get a Super Smash Bros. vibe in some cases, like when you enter a Prankster Comet stage, it kinda reminds me of the "New Challenger" screen, or sometimes how the music plays whilst you're on a planet.

But, nevertheless, I'm enjoying this game so much. I will finish it completely, and then do it all again [spoiler]with Luigi[/spoiler]. I got a Wii mainly for this game, and I'm not disappointed.[/color]

[James]

[font=franklin gothic medium]So how many stars does everyone have? I just reached the 100 mark last night, after doing a star or two here and there.

At this point I'm probably finding the [spoiler]Purple Coin Comets[/spoiler] to be the most difficult part of the game.

A couple of these challenges have had me sacrificing multiple lives (and have caused much frustration). Some challenges are easier than others, but overall I'm finding them to be significantly tougher than other parts of the game.

One thing I love about these challenges is that the levels themselves accommodate them really well.

[spoiler]In Super Mario 64 it'd simply be a matter of locating red coins within the levels. Whereas in Super Mario Galaxy, you're often put in a specific part of the level with a particular challenge...or the level itself is modified specifically for the coin challenge. This is incredibly cool and it makes these challenges more worthwhile than the red coins in Super Mario 64.[/spoiler]

I'm really wanting to get [spoiler]Luigi[/spoiler] so I have to make sure I get all of those stars! :catgirl:[/font]

[BlueYoshi]

[color=darkred]I've got all 121 Stars with Mario [spoiler]and Luigi[/spoiler]. The game is so incredible that I had to see it out to the end.

The [spoiler]Purple Comets[/spoiler] have to be one of my favourite parts of SMG, especially the timed levels such as [spoiler]Luigi's Purple Coins[/spoiler]. I guess it's SMG's answer to SM64's and SMS's having to collect 100 normal coins in a level to get a Power Star for that one world, which I always found boring. But the cool thing is how Nintendo have tried to make the game as user-friendly as possible without removing any depth from the gameplay. In that particular level, at first I thought I had to collect all of the coins, but I late discovered by reading the sign that only 100 of the 150 were required, which is a far more reasonable task.

Then again, the game's difficulty goes up a notch when playing as [spoiler]Luigi[/spoiler], and he gets real frustrating to use at times.

My favourite level to play in is the volcano themed world because there's usually so much going on at one time. Things like trying to jump across a small lava pit to get a [spoiler]Purple Coin[/spoiler] whilst also trying to avoid a mini eruption, or wall jumping at the same time as dodging the harmful smoke that spews out of them.

[spoiler]I was disappointed with the Grande Finale level though. I seriously thought I was in for a huge, bombastic level which incorporated a lot of the elements of SMG overall, but was I wrong.[/spoiler] Nonetheless, I love the music in that stage.[/color]

[Treble]

Yeesh, you guys are fast! I just got up to 88 stars yesterday. However, now that school finals are over, I should be able to pick up the pace and get all 121 stars soon. Plus, I need to play as the legendary and often overlooked brother, [spoiler]Luigi[/spoiler].

Aside from the very first purple coin challenge, I haven’t really been expose to these levels yet. Not sure if I’m looking forward too them either, since it seems like a lot of people are tearing their hair out just to complete these levels. If I thought some of the earlier levels were tough, I can’t imagine how much more challenging these purple coin levels will be.

At any rate, I like the fact that some of these comet challenges and later levels are challenging me to think and respond quickly while being careful all at the same time. That sense of rushing through a level and being as precise as I can be with the controls is quite exhilarating.

As for a favorite level, I can’t seem to pick one as there have been so much diversity throughout the entire game. I really like Gusty Garden Galaxy simply for the awesome orchestrated music that plays as you float around through the level with those beautiful pink flowers. The sky-like atmosphere in that level is amazing. I also enjoyed most the levels where you get to use the Ice power-up. I’m not exactly sure what it is, but there is something so incredibly fun about skating throughout an ice/water level. Simply put, there is way too many awesome levels and variety in the game to list them all.

[BlueYoshi]

[color=darkred]In all honesty, the Purple Comet levels are more fun than frustrating. I think it only gets frustrating when you're in the situation where you need to find that last one or two of a hundred even though you think you've searched the level inside out already.[/color]

[James]

[font=franklin gothic medium]The only thing that frustrated me about the purple coin levels are the times when the screen is scrolling along (like if you're riding on a platform for example) and you miss [i]one[/i] coin, which you can't go back for. That really sucks.

Other than that, I never had much of a problem. I actually found it enjoyable to find all the coins, especially on the Honey Hive Galaxy (at least I think that's the name, haha). It surprises me because I never liked the red coin or 100 coin challenges in Super Mario 64.[/font]

[BlueYoshi]

[quote name='James'][font=franklin gothic medium]Other than that, I never had much of a problem. I actually found it enjoyable to find all the coins, especially on the Honey Hive Galaxy (at least I think that's the name, haha). It surprises me because I never liked the red coin or 100 coin challenges in Super Mario 64.[/font][/QUOTE]

[color=darkred]That sucks too, but it wasn't such a big deal anyway. It's not like those levels were usually very long, and at least you'd know where the coin is.[/color]

[James]

[font=franklin gothic medium]I just got 120 stars in this game a couple of days ago.

[spoiler]Playing as Luigi is a lot of fun. His control is significantly different to Mario.

For one thing, when you stop, Luigi slides along the ground a little. He generally has a kind of "slippery" movement to him.

He also runs faster and jumps higher than Mario. These abilties can be very useful, but the general slipperyness of his movement tempers any major advantages.

The beauty, I guess, is that Luigi makes some challenges marginally easier and others significantly tougher. I wonder if anything happens when you beat the game with Luigi. Probably nothing, but still, it'd be interesting to try.[/spoiler][/font]

[Solo Tremaine]

[quote name='James'][FONT=franklin gothic medium][spoiler]Playing as Luigi is a lot of fun. His control is significantly different to Mario.[/spoiler][/FONT][spoiler]

[FONT=franklin gothic medium]The beauty, I guess, is that Luigi makes some challenges marginally easier and others significantly tougher. I wonder if anything happens when you beat the game with Luigi. Probably nothing, but still, it'd be interesting to try.[/FONT][/spoiler][/quote]
[spoiler]I was surprised how fresh the game felt with even the subtle character differences- I'm not feeling like playing all the way through again is a chore, unlike other games with an arbitrary 'complete the game again for this extra stuff!' addition. The first Cosmic Luigi level was much more difficult than I was expecting though. It took me many many attempts (mainly because I'm not that great at stringing long jumps together).

The little changes they put into the script are satisfying too- it's nice to know they're not taking things too seriously by admitting they have essentially just substituted a character.

I have about 42 stars with Luigi now. I'm aiming to get as many as I can before facing Bowser. I'm not looking forward to having to blow up that bloody trash again on the Dreadnought level though. Bloody nightmare.[/spoiler]