Mormons: What's The Deal?

[Esther]

[SIZE=1]I was just at work going over some major problems we have in-game. I was sitting at my desk and drinking a delicious Blended Vanilla Bean from Starbucks (^_^). Then I came across this one report, which made me very, VERY, upset.

"Mormons are *******, all they do is dress up in these ugly suits, and ride around on bicycles! And on top of that they have like 500 wives!"

AHEM AHEM AHEM! Well excuse me! I really don't think that's what Mormonism is all about. And why must everyone pick on the religion? Seriously, isn't there someone else that can get fired upon all the time?

Even on Late Night shows (Jay Leno, David Letterman) are starting to take aim at my religion. It's not funny, and not fair. I mean, God forbid someone makes a crack on a Catholic (no offence people, really). The whole church would go crazy and the person who said it will go under fire.

And as I know it, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints does not practice polygamy anymore.

Yet, there is this one show on HBO called "Big Love" about some Mormons in SLC, Utah. I think the main character has like two wives and 10 children or whatever.

What do you think about Mormonism always under fire?

For those of you who ARE Mormon, do you find shows like these offensive?

And finally, do you think if other religions such at Catholicism, were to be made fun of, would they be very upset and make a big deal about it?[/SIZE]

[Morpheus]

First off, Catholocism is made fun of much more than Mormons.

Mormons aren't well recieved because of the recruiters. Do you like salesmen trying to sell you something you don't need? It's the same principle. People expand it to include everyone of the faith because it seems that the "service" they sell is a religion of annoyance, constantly being a pain in the ***. I'm not incriminating you or any other mormons, but the real problems are within.

[Albert Flasher]

[COLOR=Sienna]Why do people make fun of Mormons? Because it's so [i]damn easy[/i]. The religion is just hilarious, especially how it was founded. It's tremendously easy to make fun of it - I mean, some guy generically named Joe Smith comes running out of the woods claiming he talked to god at [i]52 friggin people believed him[/i]. That alone is hilarious, but there are a lot of other tidbits that make it the most make-funnable religion on earth (Save the Amish), that's why. I mean... he read some gibberish on gold plated because of 'seer stones' and than told some people about it, and they all believed him. It sounds like a D&D novel or something.[/COLOR]

[Gavin]

[SIZE=1]Interesting, most interesting.

Honestly I've never met Mormons/Latter Day Saints so I can't really comment on their activities/belief system. However they seem to be rather reminiscent of the Jehovah's Witnesses and I have had the distinct displeasure of having just got home from Mass and then ten minutes later having to deal with a family of JWs at the door. I mean why bring the kids ? Do they think it will make me slightly more pliable to join the Witnesses ? Fat chance, all I end up thinking is what a crap Sunday these kids must have.

[B][url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_Jesus_Christ_of_Latter-day_Saints[/url][/B]

Anyway there's the LDS Wiki article for all of you who like me knew relatively little about the group.[/SIZE]

[quote name='Grace][SIZE=1']I mean, God forbid someone makes a crack on a Catholic (no offence people, really). The whole church would go crazy and the person who said it will go under fire.[/SIZE][/quote]
[SIZE=1]Oh yeah, because everyone knows that nobody ever takes shots at the Catholic Church. I seem to recall a film with Tom Hanks recently based on a book that cast doubts on the entire foundation and structure of the Catholic church based on no more than a Renaissance artists painting from five hundred years ago. I mean sure it's easier to believe that Leonardo da Vinci happened to recreate the exact setting of the Last Supper than to simply acknowledge The Da Vinci Code is a load of crap. Anyway I digress, however the point remains that we Catholics get way more flack than any other Christian denomination.[/SIZE]

[Fasteriskhead]

Actually, there are a couple of denominations of Mormonism which split off from the main LDS Church at one time or another who still practice polygamy, although obviously they're well in the minority. The topic of Mormonism and polygamy is a very interesting one, both historically and theologically - personally, I think that in a very strange way the issue is very much related to the question of who was supposed to succeed Joseph Smith (although obviously when the church officially renounced the practice... what? around the turn of the century?... it was mainly to keep the feds off their back).

As for why Mormons get ridiculed, you've got me. I would think it has something to do with it being a sect that formed in fairly recent memory - unlike, say, first temple Judaism, you can actually go and find newspapers from the time, records, testimonies, still-intact historical sites, etc.. Maybe that takes some of the magic away. And yes, there's the polygamy thing AND the Jesus visiting America thing AND the finding two ancient tablets thanks to an angel thing, although frankly I haven't quite grasped how any of this is more strange than dunking a kid in water. Personally I don't really make fun of Mormons - not because I think it's wrong or unjustified, but mainly because I haven't put in the work necessary.

I would say the following to my fellow amateurs out there. We can either keep making the same four dumb jokes about Mormons over and over again (1. they have a silly religion, 2. they marry lots of people, 3. they annoy by way of handing out free pamphlets, 4. they dress way too neatly and are way too polite/organized and don't drink booze or coffee), or we can give it up for awhile and leave it to the pros; Mormons are much, MUCH better at making fun of Mormonism than we are. If one is even to make it to the minor leagues as far as ridiculing something goes, it requires a lot of work and not a little respect for the thing getting roasted.

[Sunadokei-chan]

I actually think that Mormons can be highly intellectual. Just look at Ken Jennings, who won 72 rounds of Jeopardy straight. I'm not necessarily saying that all Mormons are pure geniuses, but I'm just trying to make a point.

It's a person's natural instinct to make fun of others to make themselves seem like the most clever, awesome person in the entire world. Most of the time is backfires. Just shows how idiotic people can be. Just because they can't accept someone doesn't mean they should poison everyone else around them with their stupidity.

...Ken Jennings was awesome. He carried a Totoro plushie with him too!

[Dale_Valley]

Ah, here we have it; I always knew a thread would start like this. Alas, here am I, probably the only active Mormon on OB. Yes, I openly admit, we are very much of a different breed of worshipers, Christians, religionist, whatever. And I have taken fair amount of ridicule from others of a different faith. 8 times out of 10, when I say I?m Mormon, the 1st thing the person asks is "um, do you like have a bunch of wives or moms?" at 1st it was funny, now it gets on my nerves a tinsy bit ( and it is really hard to actually bother me). It has gotten to the point that i despise the very word Aztec (don?t ask, long story).
Our entire history is filled with a whole lot ridicule and hatred, and even the simple "making fun of". In the beginnings of the church, members were sometimes mobbed, leaders were tarred-and-feathered. Why, a main reason was that Mormons were abolitionist, or against slavery. And in some areas of the US where slavery was allowed, people didn?t want any abolitionist votes being cast. it got to the point where at one point, the governor of (I?m pretty sure it was this state.) Missouri initiated an Extermination Act. Declaring that all Mormons were to be out of Missouri by a certain date or face consequences. This is only one a many horrendous acts done
Since then, things have become less violent, but are still, as I see it, pretty much nasty and dishonest. Anti-Mormons have created storms of people tossing out pamphlets of Anti-Mormon literature at large Mormon assemblies. My favorite act to quote is how they have gone as far as to rent billboards on major highways in major cities, and then discredit the Mormon Church with scripture taken out of context. As with the older days of the church, there is too much to list here.
As for the making fun of stuff, ah, it?s not to bad, as long as the audience isn't full of not so bright people who may take what is said to literally.
oh and by the way, yah, Mormons are the best at making fun of Mormons. Me and my buddies love to sit up at night and come up with Mormon jokes.
I Have to admit, I don?t think that the Mormon Church is the most made fun of. The Catholics surely get more rap than us.
I usually don't even try to make fun of other religions, not even the Jehovah?s Witnesses. I feel that unless you have actually tried to study that religion, from a member?s point of view, you really have no right to make fun of what you don?t understand.
I think that I will end this here. I may post more later I may not. I?m just curious to see what others have to say that are non-member, members, and even the couple of ex-members I know of.

-Endure to the End

[Corey]

[quote name='Grace][SIZE=1][i]I mean, God forbid someone makes a crack on a Catholic.[/i'][/SIZE][/quote]
[size=1]Go rent the movie [u][b]Dogma[/b][/u] and then re-evaluate that statement.[/size]
[quote name='Grace][size=1][i]Seriously, isn't there someone else that can get fired upon all the time?[/i'][/size][/quote]
[size=1]How about homosexuals, people who can't speak english, the homeless, the poor, foreigners, illegal immigrants, blacks, whites, hillbillys, drunks, addicts, fast food places, angsty teenagers that go on shooting rampages, murderous postal workers, giant corporations that own sweatshops, drug dealers, fat people, and those crazy French?
And I've barely scratched the surface.

Don't make it out to sound like you're the only one.[/size]

[Esther]

[QUOTE]That alone is hilarious[/QUOTE]

[SIZE=1]Erm, no it's not. It's one of the most important events in Christian history (my opinion). And the religion is not funny at all, I don't start laughing at Catholics because their leaders are old, wear big hats, and sit in a room discussing who will be the next "Pope". I don't. I really don't know what your religion is, so I'm not going to go more in-depth into this comment.[/SIZE]

[QUOTE]Oh yeah, because everyone knows that nobody ever takes shots at the Catholic Church. I seem to recall a film with Tom Hanks recently based on a book that cast doubts on the entire foundation and structure of the Catholic church based on no more than a Renaissance artists painting from five hundred years ago. I mean sure it's easier to believe that Leonardo da Vinci happened to recreate the exact setting of the Last Supper than to simply acknowledge The Da Vinci Code is a load of crap. Anyway I digress, however the point remains that we Catholics get way more flack than any other Christian denomination.[/QUOTE]

[SIZE=1]And the church made a big deal about the film didn't they? Yep, they did. My point EXACTLY. When I wrote that last part of the post I was thinking of the Da Vinci Code, and that's what I meant by "the church will go crazy".

And I want to add some other notes relating to Mormons:

Have you seen the commercial of two young women sitting in some sort of eating area? One woman (the Mormon) hands the other one a Bible. And tells her that it's good to read, and that she should check it out. Then at the end it says something about this being a message from the Mormons.

See? She didn't just barge in there and tell the woman to go baptize herself as a new Mormon now did she? That's how I feel we should feel portrayed.

And for those of you who like Napolean Dynamite (spelling -.-) well that had some Mormons in it. Hehe.[/SIZE]

[Morpheus]

[QUOTE=Grace]Have you seen the commercial of two young women sitting in some sort of eating area? One woman (the Mormon) hands the other one a Bible. And tells her that it's good to read, and that she should check it out. Then at the end it says something about this being a message from the Mormons.

See? She didn't just barge in there and tell the woman to go baptize herself as a new Mormon now did she? That's how I feel we should feel portrayed. [/QUOTE]
The problem is, actions speak louder than words. Mormons still annoy me at my house, and that is the root of the problem. Mormons bring these things upon themselves. If you want to find someone to blame, go to your church and look around. If the KKK had a commercial saying "Have you tried not being black?", we still wouldn't like them, and the same principle, albeit to a lesser degree, is present here.

Also, let's not make this a Da Vinci Code debate. It's a work of fiction, and people act as though it is a shotgun to the head. Remember, Sticks and Stones.

[Farto the Magic]

[COLOR=DarkGreen][FONT=Trebuchet MS]Didn't the mormon church basically have the Utah government by the short and curlies for a while? And there was that hubub about one of the top 10 guys is a crazy mormon extremist who made up a religion that pairs up people for marriage and siphons off their income money. I watched a show on him. He's a crazy guy, I tell ya what. And you know who's even crazier? The people who don't think he's crazy. But I do wish that the mormons would leave me alone, since i'm pretty proud of my denomination. And it makes them seem like jehova's witness. I tell ya, the mormons are like the sunnis of christianity. One thing i'd like to do though, is when they stop by to talk at me, greet them with a "Hail Satan." That outta make their day.[/FONT][/COLOR]

[Albert Flasher]

[QUOTE=Grace][SIZE=1]Erm, no it's not. It's one of the most important events in Christian history (my opinion). And the religion is not funny at all, I don't start laughing at Catholics because their leaders are old, wear big hats, and sit in a room discussing who will be the next "Pope". I don't. I really don't know what your religion is, so I'm not going to go more in-depth into this comment.[/SIZE]



[SIZE=1]Have you seen the commercial of two young women sitting in some sort of eating area? One woman (the Mormon) hands the other one a Bible. And tells her that it's good to read, and that she should check it out. Then at the end it says something about this being a message from the Mormons.

See? She didn't just barge in there and tell the woman to go baptize herself as a new Mormon now did she? That's how I feel we should feel portrayed.
[/SIZE][/QUOTE][COLOR=Sienna]

Yea... yea it is. Imagine you were walking around one day, and some guy comes running up to you, long hair astray, nasty smell, crazy look in his eyes, and he starts shouting "Hey dudez! I just talked to Jaybus! I swear man, I was just walking along and than BAM! Jaybus! He told me some crazy things, told me to start my own church! Want to join?!" I mean, would you say "Here's a dollar..." and continue walking, or bow down and start worshiping with him? It [i]really[/i] is funny.

And on the other thing... that's called an 'advertisment.' Perhaps you've heard of them? They are designed to paint whatever their advertising in the best light possible? Ever see a McDonalds commercial? They got the holy-grail halo and the beautifully done burgers, they look absolutely awesome - but in reality their grey, droopy, thin peices of tastless garbage. [/COLOR]

[Transtic Nerve]

The only problem i have with mormons or any religion for that matter is when they begin to push their beliefs onto other people. I mean you wouldn't appreciate me coming up to your door and forcing your son or brother (or you) to be gay would you? I mean, thats not a really good comparison, but the point is made either which way you look at it. I dont appreciate when someone challeges my beliefs and puts their own in its place. Thats not only completely annoying, its rude.

Im sure the Mayans appreciated it when Cortez came to their land and forced them all to become christian under penalty of death.

[Touchstone]

[FONT=Georgia]There's been criticism of Mormon missionaries who go door to door, and I'd like to say something about that-I think what they have to say is really INTERESTING! I come from a big Episcopal family, and know a fair amount about my own denomination, but really nothing about Mormon beliefs. It was really fascinating, and I found the guys who stopped by to be really nice. The Book of Mormon is still in my room, and I've read some of it. I think it's cool to learn about different things...what people know little about they can make fun of. Badly. As others said, only those who know a lot can be experts at poking fun of. When you're ignorant you get malicious.

I will admit, it is hard for me to come to grips with a denomination that is only about a century or so old, but then mine still gets crap because of Henry VIII. Mainly Catholics bring this up :animesmil But, what I haven't grown up with and haven't known I can't condemn because that would be wrong, and I'd ultimately end up looking like an idiot.

And I think we've established that Catholics get more fired on. :animesigh [/FONT]

[Cat]

[font=Comic Sans MS][size=2][color=purple]Personaly I don't think that you should be offened Grace. If I had a dollar for all those movies and show that made fun of Paganism then I would be rich. You shouldn't worry about it. What matters is what you think, not others. You have more insite then all those people that make fun of Mormonism, just like I have more insite on Paganism then those people that make all the movies. Sorry I can't offer no more then that.[/color] [/size][/font]

[SunfallE]

[COLOR=RoyalBlue][QUOTE=Grace][SIZE=1]I was just at work going over some major problems we have in-game. I was sitting at my desk and drinking a delicious Blended Vanilla Bean from Starbucks (^_^). Then I came across this one report, which made me very, VERY, upset.

"Mormons are *******, all they do is dress up in these ugly suits, and ride around on bicycles! And on top of that they have like 500 wives!"[/SIZE][/QUOTE]Perhaps you could explain what this report is that you are referring to? [quote name='Grace][SIZE=1]And why must everyone pick on the religion? Seriously, isn't there someone else that can get fired upon all the time?[/SIZE][/QUOTE]Others have already mentioned that pretty much any religion is made fun of. And since Mormon?s have been around for a much shorter time frame, well it?s pretty obvious that other groups have been picked on far more than Mormons. [QUOTE=Grace][SIZE=1'] Even on Late Night shows (Jay Leno, David Letterman) are starting to take aim at my religion. It's not funny, and not fair. I mean, God forbid someone makes a crack on a Catholic (no offence people, really). The whole church would go crazy and the person who said it will go under fire.[/SIZE][/quote] As for shows just starting to make fun of Mormonism? They?ve been doing that for as long as I can remember. It may seem recent, but Mormon?s have been made fun of from the very beginning. And besides, since when was being made fun of fair? And last time I checked Catholics get made fun of all the time. [QUOTE=Grace][SIZE=1]And as I know it, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints does not practice polygamy anymore.

Yet, there is this one show on HBO called "Big Love" about some Mormons in SLC, Utah. I think the main character has like two wives and 10 children or whatever.[/SIZE][/QUOTE]Of course they don?t, the federal government made it very clear that polygamy was not acceptable so naturally the church discontinued that practice. Not that I care about that anyway, unless it?s with a minor who isn?t old enough to consent to being married to a man more than twice her age.

What?s really ironic about the show Big Love is that until some[I] Mormon?s[/I] got upset and started circulating petitions in attempt to shut the show down, it was getting terrible ratings. What made it stupid is that many of the people who signed the petitions had never even seen the show. They just assumed the show was bad. And yes I?ve seen it; it?s actually kind of funny in that it pokes fun at polygamy in general. Yes there are references that make it clear that they used the Mormon Church as a model when making the show, but unless you are a Mormon, you wouldn?t catch it. [quote name='Grace][SIZE=1]What do you think about Mormonism always under fire?[/SIZE][/QUOTE]The same thing I think for all religions, it?s pointless to get upset over someone making fun of it. It?s not going to change and do you really care what others think? They haven?t even got their facts straight so who cares? [QUOTE=Grace][SIZE=1'] For those of you who ARE Mormon, do you find shows like these offensive?[/SIZE][/quote]For someone who, many years ago, was Mormon , (and in case you are confused I no longer belong to any religion) I find nothing offensive about the shows or over being made fun of. I think part of the problem here is that most Mormon?s don?t take the time to learn what others have been told about them. The LDS/Mormon Church is infamous for keeping their members as ignorant as possible. If you want to understand what I am referring to just pick up a copy of [B]An Insider?s View of Mormon Origins[/B] by Grant H. Palmer.

In a nutshell, much of what Mormon?s take for granted as literal history has been tailored over the years, slightly modified, added to, one aspect emphasized over another, to the point that the original narratives have been nearly lost. In other words, the rest of the world has known from the beginning that many things the Mormon?s teach as truth is in fact not the truth. And the Church?s response? They ex-communicated the author for daring to tell the historical truth. [quote name='Grace][SIZE=1']And finally, do you think if other religions such at Catholicism, were to be made fun of, would they be very upset and make a big deal about it?[/SIZE][/quote]We already covered this, and though they might find it annoying I?ve yet to see the Catholic or other religions get all worked up over being made fun of.

In summary, I wouldn?t worry over it, there?s really no way to force others to not make fun of something. [/COLOR]

[2010DigitalBoy]

I have found my ultimate response to threads about people of diverse cultures such as this.

[COLOR=DarkSlateBlue]Don't knock it till you've tried it :animesmil [/COLOR]

[Gavin]

[quote name='Grace][SIZE=1']Erm, no it's not. It's one of the most important events in Christian history (my opinion). And the religion is not funny at all, I don't start laughing at Catholics because their leaders are old, wear big hats, and sit in a room discussing who will be the next "Pope". I don't. I really don't know what your religion is, so I'm not going to go more in-depth into this comment.[/SIZE][/quote]

[SIZE=1]Eh Grace I must admit I don't follow your logic there, just out of curiosity why would anyone laugh at the election of a successor to a religious post, or any post for that matter ? The hats aside, as I know mitres tend to draw a few chuckles, what you are effectively saying is that you don't laugh at an old man assuming office, I don't mean to burst your bubble but not very many politicians are young men when they assume political power either.[/SIZE]

[quote name='Grace][SIZE=1']And the church made a big deal about the film didn't they? Yep, they did. My point EXACTLY. When I wrote that last part of the post I was thinking of the Da Vinci Code, and that's what I meant by "the church will go crazy".[/SIZE][/quote]

[SIZE=1]OK this too confuses me slightly, you knew that a Catholic would respond by saying we would make a big deal of the Da Vinci Code and yet you made the statement that somehow Mormons take more flack than other Christians, even when you knew the Da Vinci Code was the biggest piece of flack ever hurled. Now really any Christian denomination, not only we Catholics should oppose the Da Vinci Code as being portrayed in any way as fact, I mean Christ is one third of the Holy Trinity so somehow claiming that he was a fraud should offend all Christians. [/SIZE]

[Sandy]

What's the deal, indeed?

Why are there prejudice against Mormons? Or Jehova's Witnesses? Or Scientology?

These are all small religions in comparison to e.g. Christianity or Islam, but there are certain other thing that connects them as well. There's a wide (mis?)conception that the followers of these religions are a bit cuckoo from their heads, blind in their belief and arrogant in their ways to force others to believe the same.

As an atheist, I'd dare to say that many Christians and Muslims are the same way, but when that type of behaviour comes from a member of a smaller religion, it's easier to label the whole institution as a bunch of like-minded crazies.

I [I]personally[/I] think it's stupid to believe in Great Alien Zorg (or whatever the alien-guy from Scientology was called), or that only some specific amount of believers will fit into heaven (which leaves the question why do Jehova's Witnesses still recruit more followers when that amount has been full for a long time now). I also find many questionable things from Mormon religion (as well as other religions as well), but [I]still[/I] I don't judge people on basis of their faith.

I might make some rather innocent fun of religions, but that's just my humor and it shouldn't be taken as a personal attack.

On that note, the movie [url=http://www.latterdaysmovie.com][B]Latter Days[/B][/url] was great! ;D

[Guest goladith]

One thing I gotta say, was I was raised with tolerance to all religions. So, I don't see anything wrong with any religion, just the way some people practice their religion. But, as somebody that is Wiccan, we have had alot of issues fairly recently of violantions of the Bill of Rights (not gonna get in to that right now, as i don't have access to the links, but they took place in the south). But I don't think the Mormans are the butt of all jokes. I personaly try to shy away from pokeing fun at other religions. I haven't seen anything on TV that was remotly close to makeing fun of Mormans, expet that South park episode, but, you can't take anything you see on that show seriesly. /rant off

[Guest Ezra Black]

Why do people make fun of the LDS? Simple. It's funny.

Just like it's funny to make fun of Muslims, Baptists, Catholics, Buddhists, Pentecostals, Methodists, Wiccans, Atheists, Freemasons.......yeah, it's just funny. And when you grow up enough to realize that, you'll be a lot happier.

[Raiyuu]

[quote name='Gavin][font=verdana][size=1]...you made the statement that somehow Mormons take more flack than other Christians, even when you knew the Da Vinci Code was the biggest piece of flack ever hurled.[/size'][/font][/quote][font=trebuchet ms]If I read Grace's earlier posts correctly, I think she's trying to say Mormons (as a rule) don't make a big deal out of the jokes made at their expense, whereas the Catholic Church can be trusted to get prickly and make a hoo-hah out of a piece of controversial fiction.

I don't know whether that's true. I've never knowingly met a Mormon, I didn't actually know they once practised polygamy, I don't know any jokes about them and thank goodness I've never had one knocking on my door with pamphlets.[/font]

[Gavin]

[QUOTE=Raiyuu][font=trebuchet ms]If I read Grace's earlier posts correctly, I think she's trying to say Mormons (as a rule) don't make a big deal out of the jokes made at their expense, whereas the Catholic Church can be trusted to get prickly and make a hoo-hah out of a piece of controversial fiction.

I don't know whether that's true. I've never knowingly met a Mormon, I didn't actually know they once practised polygamy, I don't know any jokes about them and thank goodness I've never had one knocking on my door with pamphlets.[/font][/QUOTE]

[SIZE=1]Ah, thanks for the interpretation Raiyuu, as I said I wasn't sure exactly what Grace was trying to say. However I still feel that religious people have a right to become offended when someone offends them, just as any one else has the right when they're insulted.[/SIZE]

[Hanabishi Recca]

I think everyone where ever they are, they will get made fun of for something... Its the same as that.

I get made fun of because I'm a Christian, but I'm not going to get all upset over it.
Just calm down and you will be fine.
Someone [Either friend, family, etc] has made fun of you for something, right?
Well, like them, other people are going to make fun of or say something that you are going to take offence of. I always thought, if it is going to come I might as well deal with it. Well, maybe not deal with it, but walk in love. And when you walk in love, you won't ever lash out in anger, and you won't take offence to little things such as this.
Do whatever you want to, I just wanted to offer alittle advice :)

Thanks for your time,

THE DOCTOR [I'm kidding :p]
Dae

[DeathKnight]

[quote name='Grace][SIZE=1']Erm, no it's not.[/SIZE][/quote]

[color=crimson]Then you have a pretty poor sense of humor.[/color]

[quote name='Gavin][SIZE=1']I mean Christ is one third of the Holy Trinity so somehow claiming that he was a fraud should offend all Christians. [/SIZE][/quote]

[color=crimson]It shouldn't, really. I find it pitiable that what you consider the 'right' response is little more than a denomination-wide tantrum.

I don't recall Jesus as that kind of person. I remember reading of his strength, his wit, his wisdom in the face of persecution.

Many centuries later it seems all his self-proclaimed followers can do is ***** and moan.[/color]

[quote name='Gavin][SIZE=1']However I still feel that religious people have a right to become offended when someone offends them, just as any one else has the right when they're insulted.[/SIZE][/quote]

[color=crimson]I doubt anyone disagrees with this. However the [i]sensitivity[/i] of the church or it's church goers is often pretty high.

How easily offended are you, Gavin? Or, more importantly to the topic, how easily offended is the Church?[/color]

[quote name='Sandy'](which leaves the question why do Jehova's Witnesses still recruit more followers when that amount has been full for a long time now).[/quote]

[color=crimson]It's pretty simple. Any [b]Jehovah's[/b] (:p) Witness would have been able to answer that question for you.. and then they would promptly spin into a rant that involved giving you some literature. For the 144,000 they are granted the responsibility and position of being co-rulers of Earth with Jesus after Armageddon.

For those not of the 144,000 they get to take care of Earth with the goal of keeping it paradisiac and perfect. Sickness will be no more, disease will be no more, war will be no more and they will live "forever".

That's a pretty cut and dry, simplified version of the doctrine but it should give you some answers.[/color]