Prostitution

[Roxie Faye]

[color=#9933ff]I'm very aware, in fact, that this has been a thread before. But we haven't had it in a while, and I don't know if I've ever participated, so I'm making this thread again.

So, opinions on prostitution?

I'll share mine. If someone makes the conscious choice to sell their bodies for money or objects or what-have-you, or to make a living off it, I really don't have a problem, and I don't see the need for authorities and such to get involved. However, I do understand the need to make prostitution illegal, in the case of those who are forced into prostitution or can't get out of it or are there against their will.

I guess... I don't understand why, when two people have some random hook-up, people think it's okay, but when there's an exchange of money or items, it's suddenly so horrible.[/color]

[eleanor]

[font="trebuchet ms"] I think consensual prostitution is fine, and I don't agree with laws that make it illegal. You're not harming anyone, unless you have STDs or something, but the person hiring you would know that risk. Sex is just sex sometimes, and if people want to make money off of it, I think that's perfectly ok.

Of course, human trafficking is one of the most disgusting forms of crime today. I find it more important to prevent than drug trafficking, by far, because innocent women are getting kidnapped and forced into a life of servitude and most likely early death due to STDs. [/font]

[AzureWolf]

I think Bender would agree with me that, like smoking, prostitution is cool. Why else would they put it in a cool video game like GTA? For us to imitate and know what is cool. Duh. Get with the program.

Prostitution, or "the world's oldest profession" as someone most likely will call it (sorry to kill your buzz, whoever), is not ok by my book even consensually. While I'm sure the thousands of commenters on sex blogs like Confessions of a College Callgirl would beg to differ, I just see it as lame. There's no requirements, no education, no technique, no training, etc. It's promoting a bad idea or way to make easy-earned money, IMO.

You can think I am a person who lazed through his college degrees (and you'd be right), but that doesn't make prostitution any less wholesome. I applaud those who look for the harder way out, don't give up their bodies, work for $2 an hour or whatever to reach whatever goals they have, because they realize that nothing worth having will come easy.

Also, c'mon, what type of life, no matter how consensual, will you be committing yourself to? There's really no reason to - in the US - to resort to prostitution. Money is everywhere. You just need to know what you want to get at it.

[Raiha]

[COLOR="DarkOrchid"][FONT="Times New Roman"]I don't care if you sell yourself for money. People do it all the time on the internet. Besides, I think porn is funny, and that's of course prostitution caught on film. Or so they say. Then again this isn't about porn, and it is sort of...a different kettle of fish.

But as far as it goes? Not a bad way to make a living if you're dying or desperate for cash. Then again you could make about as much just taking off your clothes next to a pole with less health risk.[/FONT][/COLOR]

[Retribution]

[quote name='AzureWolf']Prostitution, or "the world's oldest profession" as someone most likely will call it (sorry to kill your buzz, whoever), is not ok by my book even consensually. While I'm sure the thousands of commenters on sex blogs like Confessions of a College Callgirl would beg to differ, I just see it as lame. There's no requirements, no education, no technique, no training, etc. It's promoting a bad idea or way to make easy-earned money, IMO.[/QUOTE]
[font=Arial]So? Doesn't this make it a good move for people lacking education and qualification? I see it as a very resourceful way to survive within a capitalist system. If you look good enough and are good enough at what you do, why not get paid if people are willing to give you cash for your "good or [i]service[/i]".

[QUOTE]You can think I am a person who lazed through his college degrees (and you'd be right), but that doesn't make prostitution any less wholesome. I applaud those who look for the harder way out, don't give up their bodies, work for $2 an hour or whatever to reach whatever goals they have, because they realize that nothing worth having will come easy.[/QUOTE]
But if they want to do that, who are you to tell them they can't make a living the easy way? Worry about yourself; don't pay any mind to people who make short-sighted fortunes through easy means.

[QUOTE]Also, c'mon, what type of life, no matter how consensual, will you be committing yourself to? There's really no reason to - in the US - to resort to prostitution. Money is everywhere. You just need to know what you want to get at it.[/QUOTE]
Hey, if they choose that life then it should be theirs to have. My only reservation is if they don't willfully choose prostitution and are intimidated/blackmailed into it.[/font]

[Rachmaninoff]

Even though the religious beliefs I grew up with would disagree with prostitution, I now wonder why we even care what two consenting adults do behind closed doors. Unless someone is being forced into it or are underage, as far as I'm concerned it's their business whether I approve of it or not. Personally I think it's a sad way to make a living, but who am I to decide what people do?

Yes you could argue about the dangers involved but prostitution isn't the only job with risks. Perhaps it may be higher, but firefighters, cops, soldiers and even professional athletes, all of them put themselves at risk in order to 'make a living' I can't help but think that the objection to it is nothing more than an attempt to force your own moral values on someone else, regardless of whether or not they agree.

[Roxie Faye]

[quote name='Rachmaninoff']Yes you could argue about the dangers involved but prostitution isn't the only job with risks. Perhaps it may be higher, but firefighters, cops, soldiers and even professional athletes, all of them put themselves at risk in order to 'make a living'[/QUOTE][color=#9933ff]I think that's a good point. I never thought of it that way, but you're right.[/color]

[2010DigitalBoy]

[quote name='mistressroxie']Prostitution[/quote]

[COLOR="DarkOrange"]Is digitalboy approved! *two thumbs up*[/COLOR]

[OMNOMNOMALY]

[FONT="Georgia"]I'm agreeing with most of the posts in here. People should be able to choose whatever occupation they desire, no matter how "questionable" a choice it is. Nobody should feel like it's their business to regulate what goes on in people's bedrooms. Though I do think regular health check ups should be encouraged, though. I know it's not easy in every area, but it would be better for everyone involved on either side in the long run.

Anybody who is forced into it? Wrong. It's wrong, absolutely.[/FONT]

[Heaven's Cloud]

[color=indigo]To rephrase George Carlin (without all his wonderful profanity) selling is legal. Sex is legal. So why isn't selling sex legal?

You can make it more complicated, factor in religion, morals, and all that mess, but why muck with such an uncomplicated equation.[/color]

[2010DigitalBoy]

[quote name='Chabichou'][COLOR="#004a6f"]Personally, I am getting sick of this growing mentality that people can do whatever they want as long as they're "not hurting anybody".

It's really quite sad that our current society's idea of freedom is simply the lack of morals and dignity and respect.

Prostitution (and drinking, smoking, doing drugs, and many other immoral acts), are all harmful, to the people performing these acts and to their entire society.

Prostitution should remain illegal. It is a a disgusting, immoral act and harms the dignity of all parties involved. I will not sit here harping about the religious perspective of sex (like the idea that people should be married in order to have sex), but I will at least say that sex should only be done by those in a relationship who love each other. Simply using other people's bodies for pleasure (whether they are paid or not) is disrespectful and immoral. Why should we promote these kinds of ideas by making prostitution legal?

Our laws should not only protect people from physical harm, but should protect dignity and morals.[/COLOR][/QUOTE]

[COLOR="DarkOrange"]Dignity and morals are in the eye of the beholder. If we imposed an absolute system, we'd be, like, controlling people's brains and stuff. And... that's doubleplusungood. [/COLOR]

[Vicky]

[SIZE=1]For once I'm going to agree with DB... or at least, the first part of his post. Your life is your own and you have the right to lay down your own morals (for [i]yourself[/i]). If you don't harm anyone then what you do you do to yourself; why should you abide by someone elses morals? It's your life, not theirs.

Prostitution, therefore, isn't something I'm going to be insanely upset about. I think if people want to do it then by all means, they can since it's their choice and that's probably the most important thing to have. I would never get involved in anything like that, to be honest, but I haven't got anything against it.

Sometimes it's a good idea, too. I'll never forget a friend of my mother's who got out of debt by prostitution and went on about how much she loved it...

...yeah. XD[/SIZE]

[Doublehex]

[quote name='Chabichou'][COLOR="#004a6f"]Personally, I am getting sick of this growing mentality that people can do whatever they want as long as they're "not hurting anybody".

It's really quite sad that our current society's idea of freedom is simply the lack of morals and dignity and respect.

Prostitution (and drinking, smoking, doing drugs, and many other immoral acts), are all harmful, to the people performing these acts and to their entire society.

Prostitution should remain illegal. It is a a disgusting, immoral act and harms the dignity of all parties involved. I will not sit here harping about the religious perspective of sex (like the idea that people should be married in order to have sex), but I will at least say that sex should only be done by those in a relationship who love each other. Simply using other people's bodies for pleasure (whether they are paid or not) is disrespectful and immoral. Why should we promote these kinds of ideas by making prostitution legal?

Our laws should not only protect people from physical harm, but should protect dignity and morals.[/COLOR][/QUOTE]

There are many problems with that statement. First off, laws are not meant to protect dignity and morals. Do you know why the very first laws were created - laws that involved cutting off of hands for stealing, or killing immediately for murders? It was because these family wars where someone would kill this guy's father because he killed his uncle who killed his father who killed his nephew who killed his second cousin.

It had nothing to do with dignity, or morals. It was of physical safety. No other reason.

Now, our laws differ, but they all share one common thread - they are there to protect. Stealing? Because it takes the victim's money away. Traffic laws? So we lovely pedestrians don't get run over.

Prostitution only harms due to STD, and that is a risk upon the buyer (I suppose that's the correct term). But beyond that, it in no way, shape, or form brings harm. Now, I agree with you it is an immoral act, but it is not a physically harmful one, and thus, has little reason to be banned.

[Morpheus]

[quote name='Chabichou'][COLOR="#004a6f"]It's really quite sad that our current society's idea of freedom is simply the lack of morals and dignity and respect.[/COLOR][/QUOTE]

Lets see here. A guy cheats on his girlfriend of four years in her house and she catches him in the act. Immoral? Yes. Undignified? Yes. Disrespectful? Yes. Worthy of being charged with a crime? I'd challenge anyone to say yes here and provide some reasons why.

[AzureWolf]

[quote name='Retribution']So? Doesn't this make it a good move for people lacking education and qualification? I see it as a very resourceful way to survive within a capitalist system. If you look good enough and are good enough at what you do, why not get paid if people are willing to give you cash for your "good or [i]service[/i]".[/QUOTE]I wouldn't call it resourceful. Easy? Yes. Resourceful? Hardly. Resourceful implies some sort of... use of intellect. You know, something that requires thought or at least imagination. Cavemen were doing it way before these "resourceful" prostitutes of our age figured it out, and nevermind that you'd be hard-pressed to prove cavemen lived in a capitalist environment.

You are welcome to defend prostitution, but don't raise it up as "going up against the man." It's sex for money, plain and simple. It's not a statement about capitalism.[QUOTE]But if they want to do that, who are you to tell them they can't make a living the easy way? Worry about yourself; don't pay any mind to people who make short-sighted fortunes through easy means.[/QUOTE]Then who the hell are you to tell them they can? If I don't have a right to an opinion, neither do you. I am not beneath you.

Don't use that cop out. Seriously. People worry about others. I worry about my family and friends, and even strangers. So do millions of others. If you think your logic does not apply to something like feeding the starving children of the world but does apply to something like prostitution, go back to your hypocritical statement: who are you to decide what aspects of a person's life others should help with and shouldn't help with? I'd go further, like say you aren't a fan of democracy, but you get my point. That "Worry about yourself: don't pay any mind to people..." is not something I agree with.[QUOTE]Hey, if they choose that life then it should be theirs to have. My only reservation is if they don't willfully choose prostitution and are intimidated/blackmailed into it.[/QUOTE]Never said anything to the contrary. Will I stop people from living that type of life? No. Will I judge them for it and think of them less? Yes. I'm entitled to my opinion. You can glorify prostitution all you want, but anyone with an iota of intelligence doesn't find it respectable. Even looking past that it's sex, the fact that it requires no talent/ability/intelligence/anything makes prostitution just not all that impressive.

Let's be honest with ourselves for a minute: if we really thought prostitution was God's gift to the workforce, I think many more men and women would not attend school and just settle for this easy way out. The reason they don't is it's not a respectable job, not something you put on your resumé, and not something that should be done in the first place.


Keep in mind I don't think people who do prostitution are dumb people or people who can't get better jobs. I think the "profession" or act of prostitution is dumb and degrading. If a person decides to do that instead of something else, I disagree, and while I will think less of them, I won't conclude they are retards or unable to make good choices in life. I mean, hey, I took the easy way out and went to an in-state school that offered full tuition instead of going out of state. People thought less of me for it, but they still thought I am capable of making good decisions.

[SunfallE]

[COLOR="RoyalBlue"][FONT="Lucida Sans Unicode"]Without quoting too many people, I really don't see the issue so long as its consenting adults. Whether or not I agree is irrelevant to a certain extent since my morals or views should not be forced on others. I'm not going to openly support it, but I'm not going to openly oppose it either.[quote name='AzureWolf;801633] Even looking past that it's sex, the fact that it requires no talent/ability/intelligence/anything makes prostitution just not all that impressive.[/QUOTE]Whether or not it's impressive is also irrelevant. There are a lot of jobs out there that don't require talent/ability/intelligence or much of anything in order to do it. Cleaning, basic production work, etc. What matters is that whatever it is, it pays the bills and puts food on the table. In the long run, that's what's really relevant.[quote name='AzureWolf'']Let's be honest with ourselves for a minute: if we really thought prostitution was God's gift to the workforce, I think many more men and women would not attend school and just settle for this easy way out. The reason they don't is it's not a respectable job, not something you put on your resumé, and not something that should be done in the first place.[/quote]Lets be honest and admit that if it was legal, there's no way of knowing if people really would abandon school and settle for the easy way out. And even if they did, that is still [I]their choice[/I]. Your objections to it are personal and nothing more. Telling others what they [I]should[/I] do has it's limits and as far as I'm concerned this is one of those things.[/FONT][/COLOR]

[Zen]

[color=darkred][size=1]

While I don't much care what anyone does aslong as it doesn't bring harm on others, I do see where [b]Chabichou[/b] is coming from due to my position as a romantic. Prostitution really does take all the sentimentality and romance out of sex. If it were legalized in America, alot of people, men especially, really wouldn't have reason to search for a relationship at all unless they were religious or like myself, a romantic.

I wouldn't hire a prostitue on the grounds, not of STDs, but just gross out that she's had so 'many'. The same reason I would never date a porn-star. As well, I like to 'make love' rather than 'bone' or 'have sex', which is pretty much all you do with a prostitute. Emotion makes things sweeter, if you ask me.

So really, I don't like prostitution, and I wouldn't par-take in it. But I suppose it if were legalized, it would eliminate some opposition in the dating scene. So pretty much, I'm un-opinionated, though personally not into it.[/color][/size]

[Retribution]

[quote name='AzureWolf']I wouldn't call it resourceful. Easy? Yes. Resourceful? Hardly. Resourceful implies some sort of... use of intellect. You know, something that requires thought or at least imagination. Cavemen were doing it way before these "resourceful" prostitutes of our age figured it out, and nevermind that you'd be hard-pressed to prove cavemen lived in a capitalist environment.[/QUOTE]
[font=Arial]It's certainly resourceful. Everyone deals with their personal circumstances, and prostitution can be a way out of (or a way to cope with) an undesirable life. If a girl is physically attractive, but failed out of school, she is resourceful if she acknowledges her body as a potential (and, indeed, the most effective at this point) means of accruing wealth and uses it to that end. She uses what she has to make money, essentially.

[QUOTE]You are welcome to defend prostitution, but don't raise it up as "going up against the man."[/QUOTE]
Perhaps you misunderstand when I say it is a "way to survive within an capitalist system". There is no systemic conflict -- on the contrary, there is coexistence. Prostitution is a crude form of entrepreneurialism where the prostitute offers a service to clients, who in return pay money.

[QUOTE]Then who the hell are you to tell them they can? If I don't have a right to an opinion, neither do you. I am not beneath you.[/QUOTE]
I never stripped you of your right to have an opinion. However I do find it presumptuous of you to think you have some obligation to impress upon others [i]your[/i] vision of how [i]their[/i] life should be lived.

[QUOTE]Don't use that cop out. Seriously. People worry about others. I worry about my family and friends, and even strangers. So do millions of others. If you think your logic does not apply to something like feeding the starving children of the world but does apply to something like prostitution, go back to your hypocritical statement: who are you to decide what aspects of a person's life others should help with and shouldn't help with? I'd go further, like say you aren't a fan of democracy, but you get my point. That "Worry about yourself: don't pay any mind to people..." is not something I agree with.[/QUOTE]
I get the general impression that you are not concerned for the well-being of prostitutes, but see it as a morally bankrupt enterprise. Speaking in broad terms, I doubt you are truly worried for the welfare of prostitutes. In this sense, when I say "don't worry about them" I mean "let them live their life" (to be simple). Although semantics are fun, I'm not really interested in being painted an apathetic man.

[QUOTE]You can glorify prostitution all you want, but anyone with an iota of intelligence doesn't find it respectable. Even looking past that it's sex, the fact that it requires no talent/ability/intelligence/anything makes prostitution just not all that impressive.

Let's be honest with ourselves for a minute: if we really thought prostitution was God's gift to the workforce, I think many more men and women would not attend school and just settle for this easy way out. The reason they don't is it's not a respectable job, not something you put on your resumé, and not something that should be done in the first place.[/QUOTE]
I'm not glorifying prostitution, nor do I find it respectable, sry m8.

Granted, I do find the business to be utterly degrading and personally repulsive. And as previously stated, I do worry that lack of regulation could easily lead to a tacit support of human trafficking.[/font]

[Lia]

A lot has been said here that I would like to address, however what stuck out most to me from skimming this thread is the use of "[B]respectable[/B]".

No, prostitution is not respectable. But is a lawyer who defends a guilty client respectable? Maybe in presentation... But by no means respectable beyond the exterior.

Now, I may not agree with prostitution, but I also don't agree with the ignorant throwing around of "no skill", "easy way out", etc. Do you people honestly think prostitution is the easy way out? It is by far not an easy job. Selling your body, your dignity an your pride day in and day out to a number of clients is not easy. Retail is easy. Prostitution is not. Not everyone drops out of college because they want to. Some people can't afford it, some people have other factors in their lives that prevent them from receiving a proper education. If on their own, most jobs that only require a GED or whathaveyou don't pay enough to support an apartment/house, food on the table, and electricity. Some may turn to prostitution simply because it pays the bills, where most other jobs won't.

[AzureWolf]

[quote name='Retribution']It's certainly resourceful. Everyone deals with their personal circumstances, and prostitution can be a way out of (or a way to cope with) an undesirable life. If a girl is physically attractive, but failed out of school, she is resourceful if she acknowledges her body as a potential (and, indeed, the most effective at this point) means of accruing wealth and uses it to that end. She uses what she has to make money, essentially.[/QUOTE]Have you seen prostitutes? Most of them are god-ugly. Every girl's body, no matter how ugly (including transvestites), has "potential." You could say that's subjective, but the diversity of looks among prostitutes makes me believe this isn't a particularly choosy job.

About it being resourceful: How does prostitution require any significant, beyond-the-normal-person-out-of-the-box thinking? It's just the opposite: it's bloody obvious. Read your own statement: most effective (aka most money) = most logical decision. lol, I think most people go for a job that pays the most if they can choose.

Sounds like you are saying it's a last-resort. Something desperate people do. Something worth doing when circumstances call for such extremes. I'm saying this extreme doesn't exist in the US (but it does exist in other countries, and I acknowledge that). The only excuse for prostitution here is you are too lazy.[QUOTE]I never stripped you of your right to have an opinion. However I do find it presumptuous of you to think you have some obligation to impress upon others [i]your[/i] vision of how [i]their[/i] life should be lived.[/QUOTE]You have yet to prove how you are allowed to impress your vision and I'm not. Unless you honestly think we shouldn't stop people from - say - committing suicide or suffering from addiction, then you're being a hypocrite. If you actually believe we shouldn't interfere at all in personal decisions whatsoever (which IMO is ridiculous), then we disagree on a fundamental level, making it beyond the scope of the discussion.[QUOTE]I get the general impression that you are not concerned for the well-being of prostitutes, but see it as a morally bankrupt enterprise. Speaking in broad terms, I doubt you are truly worried for the welfare of prostitutes. In this sense, when I say "don't worry about them" I mean "let them live their life" (to be simple). Although semantics are fun, I'm not really interested in being painted an apathetic man.[/QUOTE]In the states, prostitution is "morally bankrupt." And I care about other people, not the act of prostitution. Don't confuse the person for the service. Ironically, semantics are important, since you are trying to paint me as an apathetic person using them.[QUOTE]I'm not glorifying prostitution, nor do I find it respectable, sry m8.

Granted, I do find the business to be utterly degrading and personally repulsive. And as previously stated, I do worry that lack of regulation could easily lead to a tacit support of human trafficking.[/QUOTE]This part just confuses me. If you think it's degrading and repulsive, why should it be made legal? That would make it harder for people to find respectable jobs and prostitution more enticing. It's already so easy to fall into it, and making it legal will make even more desperate people go towards this bloody obvious choice rather than look for better solutions. Prostitution ads and the like? No thank you. Prostitution schools? Gross...

Again, in the states, there is always a better way to get the money you need, whatever your needs/desires/goals (of course, if you are struggling, be smart about where you live, don't expect five-star hotels every night and living expenses and even education are doable).

Finally, you do know that prostitution is not easy to get out of, right? Even if you willingly leave, you attract stalkers and obsessed clients who will create trouble and stress for you long after you leave. Unfortunately, this is "part of the job" and not something you can arbitrarily omit. If you think prostitution is ok, you imply that being stuck in it when you go in willingly is ok. I know you don't, but you have to realize that is an unremovable consequence and a burden no one should have.


@SunfallE: yeah, there are jobs that require no skill/etc, but the money gap between them and prostitution is unacceptable. I have no qualms with those jobs, but those too are not quite as impressive, and consequently don't pay as much. That's why I dislike prostitution so much, because if that gets you so much money, so should these hardworking jobs.

I guess I was imagining my utopian system, where tasks that don't need special skills or talent would be automated and people can redirect their energies towards things they are good at and enjoy.

Also, I'm glad you can tell the difference between telling people what they should do and forcing people into what they should do, even if you disagree with it. I think it's important to note that I'm not saying we put guns on people's heads and tell them they *can't,* but simply shouldn't. Yeah, I know you disagree, but it's still cool you know the difference.
I think it's like drugs, though (drugs and prostitution, lol). You are taught in school to avoid them, but kids still have the choice to try them or not. Most of said drugs aren't legal, and neither is prostitution. I like it that way. Let's keep it that way. That's my stance.

You are right about the abandoning schools part, though. While I don't know any stats or true effects about it becoming legal, there are signs of what might happen. It is legal elsewhere, and was legal in more places in the past. Mail-order brides are not all girls who cannot get an education. A lot even come with college degrees nowadays.

Finally, I think everyone's morals and views should be expressed, not forced. I don't know why you do not want to openly make a stance on the subject. I think more input from more people gives better insight (well, more *intelligible* people). It lets others adjust their views, think about topics. For example, I thought about Retribution's statements, and I don't think we disagree at all about what prostitution is and what its effects are. I think we just disagree on what should be done about it (i.e., his "live and let live" vs my "die f###ing die").


@ssj chic: I didn't mean it's easy in that sense. I know it has a great psychological toll. That's the reason I don't think it's a profession that should be legalized or made ok. If those aspects of the job somehow didn't exist, it wouldn't be a bad thing. But the nature of the job is inextricably linked with that, and why it shouldn't be legalized.

[eleanor]

[font="trebuchet ms"] I agree with AzureWolf that most prostitutes are pretty unattractive, but then you have to take into consideration people who work at strip joints or Hooters or something. Unattractive? Probably not. Not the hottest girls you've ever seen, but they're still attractive. You could argue that those jobs aren't the same as prostitution, but you're still using your body to a significant degree to get money.

I'm just going to throw out there that prostitution isn't something girls aspire to be or something. It's something they do when they can't do anything else, and it's pretty much a last resort in many cases. It's not like girls, even in poverty-stricken or crime-ridden areas, are wanting to get out of high school just so that they can sell themselves. I really doubt that they'd want to do it even if it were legal.

And while in my first post I wrote that laws against prostitution were unnecessary to me, because I don't think laws are there to make people moral, I don't really see the need to legalize it either. This is like the whole "should marijuana be made legal" thing, because who cares? If you want a hooker, really want one, I'm sure there's a way you can get one.[/font]

[Retribution]

[quote name='AzureWolf']Have you seen prostitutes? Most of them are god-ugly. Every girl's body, no matter how ugly (including transvestites), has "potential." You could say that's subjective, but the diversity of looks among prostitutes makes me believe this isn't a particularly choosy job.[/QUOTE]
[font=Arial]In relation to the discussion at hand, this is irrelevant. Even if a woman is unattractive and realizes she can use her body to pay the bills, I would still it is a resourceful way to getting money. In fact, I might even go so far as to argue an unattractive prostitute is even more resourceful in that she manages to use her sub-par looks to still accumulate wealth.

[QUOTE]About it being resourceful: How does prostitution require any significant, beyond-the-normal-person-out-of-the-box thinking? It's just the opposite: it's bloody obvious. Read your own statement: most effective (aka most money) = most logical decision. lol, I think most people go for a job that pays the most if they can choose.[/QUOTE]
No, the 'equation' is not 'bloody obvious' because the prostitute-to-be will have to factor in occupational hazard, personal dignity, and morals before calling it a good job. With all that considered, the fact that it is relatively high paying would not be enough to call it an obvious 'career' move. This is why most people do not want to become prostitutes -- there is an overwhelming number of negatives against the slim positive of money.

As for it being resourceful, most people [i]do not[/i] consider their body to be [essentially] a standalone money machine. Either this, or people simply cannot bring themselves to become a prostitute. In both, the person is using the means given to them to make money. I consider this entrepreneurial.

[QUOTE]Sounds like you are saying it's a last-resort. Something desperate people do. Something worth doing when circumstances call for such extremes. I'm saying this extreme doesn't exist in the US (but it does exist in other countries, and I acknowledge that). The only excuse for prostitution here is you are too lazy.[/QUOTE]
Well, I'm sorry you judge people so freely.

[QUOTE]You have yet to prove how you are allowed to impress your vision and I'm not. Unless you honestly think we shouldn't stop people from - say - committing suicide or suffering from addiction, then you're being a hypocrite.[/QUOTE]
No, I do support helping others. If you disagreed with prostitution because it is a hurtful business that damages lives (and not because it is 'an escape for the lazy' or 'morally bankrupt'), then I will concede the point.

The funny part about this is, yes, I am impressing my will upon you to prevent you from doing it to an entire group of people. This does seem paradoxical. The difference, however, is that I am willing to allow people to live their life as they see best, while you seem interested in making those judgments for others. I'm sort of morally relativist, so I doubt we'll ever reach consensus here.

[QUOTE]If you think it's degrading and repulsive, why should it be made legal? That would make it harder for people to find respectable jobs and prostitution more enticing. It's already so easy to fall into it, and making it legal will make even more desperate people go towards this bloody obvious choice rather than look for better solutions. Prostitution ads and the like? No thank you. Prostitution schools? Gross...[/QUOTE]
I think stripping is degrading and repulsive, but I am alright with its legality. I'm not sure if this makes it "harder for people to find respectable jobs" (and I would generally disagree with the claim), nor am I sure that its legality makes stripping an enticing gig. Sure, maybe women should look for better solutions, but who am I to close off this one path to making a living? So long as it's not forced against their will by some pimp, I have no problem with a 20something women joining a strip club.

Hell, I find 2girls1cup degrading and repulsive, but that's legal too, lmao.

Degrading/repulsive and legal are not mutually exclusive.

[QUOTE]Finally, you do know that prostitution is not easy to get out of, right? Even if you willingly leave, you attract stalkers and obsessed clients who will create trouble and stress for you long after you leave. Unfortunately, this is "part of the job" and not something you can arbitrarily omit. If you think prostitution is ok, you imply that being stuck in it when you go in willingly is ok. I know you don't, but you have to realize that is an unremovable consequence and a burden no one should have.[/QUOTE]
That's an understood occupational hazard. Test pilots know they could die any given on the job, but if they want that job then let them have it.

[QUOTE]Finally, I think everyone's morals and views should be expressed, not forced. I don't know why you do not want to openly make a stance on the subject. I think more input from more people gives better insight (well, more *intelligible* people). It lets others adjust their views, think about topics. For example, I thought about Retribution's statements, and I don't think we disagree at all about what prostitution is and what its effects are. I think we just disagree on what should be done about it (i.e., his "live and let live" vs my "die f###ing die").[/QUOTE]
I think this is entirely valid. From our discussion, I do feel like I understand where you're coming from more than before this debate.[/font]

[Nerdsy]

[color=deeppink]What's all this emphasis on girls selling their bodies? There's such a thing as a male prostitute, you know. What about them?[/color]

[SunfallE]

[COLOR="RoyalBlue"][FONT="Lucida Sans Unicode"][quote name='AzureWolf']Finally, I think everyone's morals and views should be expressed, not forced. I don't know why you do not want to openly make a stance on the subject. I think more input from more people gives better insight (well, more *intelligible* people). It lets others adjust their views, think about topics. For example, I thought about Retribution's statements, and I don't think we disagree at all about what prostitution is and what its effects are. I think we just disagree on what should be done about it (i.e., his "live and let live" vs my "die f###ing die").[/QUOTE]I'm sorry if I'm not being clear, but that is my stance. I use to get all fired up and oppose certain things like this, but then I got tired of people using their moral beliefs to dictate to others what they should be doing. I use to think that other than marriage any form of sex was unacceptable and yet at the same time, I was limited by the narrow view I had by only understanding what I had been taught in the religion I was raised in.

Now, I've left religion behind and learned to try and be more tolerant since it's clear that a lot of people see things differently, myself included. I personally think it's a bad idea since my views on sex is that I think it should only be with someone you actually care about. Plus I know that even though it's hard to not have money for fun stuff, there are programs out there to help you when you're struggling. So it's not necessary to turn to prostitution to make a living. Granted it may not be as comfortable as one would want, but you can survive without it.

I guess what I'm getting at is if I'm okay with sex outside of marriage, then why would I object to consenting adults using it to make a living? It seems hypocritical to say one is okay and not the other. Though like I said, I think it's better if it's only with someone you actually care for. I know I wouldn't want to have sex with total strangers, even if they were paying for it.

Now mind you, when I saw I'm not openly for it or openly against it... if the state, not Utah since it will never happen here, were to attempt to make it legal without putting something in place to regulate it and help protect those who actually do decide to do it. In that case I would openly oppose it. I'm against exploitation so I won't turn a blind eye to something of this nature if it's clear that they aren't doing enough to protect those who chose to do it. [/FONT][/COLOR]

[Roxie Faye]

[quote name='2008DigitalBoy'][COLOR="DarkOrange"]Dignity and morals are in the eye of the beholder. If we imposed an absolute system, we'd be, like, controlling people's brains and stuff. [/COLOR][/QUOTE]
[color=#9933ff]You know, I think I'm going to have to agree with 2k8DB. Thank you.[/color]

[quote name='Lunox'][font="trebuchet ms"]I'm just going to throw out there that prostitution isn't something girls aspire to be or something. It's something they do when they can't do anything else, and it's pretty much a last resort in many cases. It's not like girls, even in poverty-stricken or crime-ridden areas, are wanting to get out of high school just so that they can sell themselves. I really doubt that they'd want to do it even if it were legal. [/font][/QUOTE][color=#9933ff]Agreed. There are how many penniless girls and boys, men and women, in the world, and how many of them are prostitutes?[/color]

[quote name='Nerdsy'][color=deeppink]What's all this emphasis on girls selling their bodies? There's such a thing as a male prostitute, you know. What about them?[/color][/QUOTE][color=#9933ff]I've been trying to keep my posts neutral in terms of gender, but I see what you're saying. I definitely agree that there isn't a lot of attention paid to the males in this profession, even (or especially) in terms of reach out programs for those who can't get out or don't want to be there and the like. Informational Wikipedia article: [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Male_prostitution"]Male Prostitution[/url][/color]