Revert to Separate Anime Forums?

[ZeitGeist]

Pardon me if this has been asked before, but I was looking at this forums history and saw that you once had forums for spearate series (I understand they were Dragonball, Yu Yu Hakusho, Gundam etc...)

I like this idea, because I think that it could generate more discussion on an anime series than the current model allows for. At present, if you want to talk about Dragonball, you must do so in the Dragonball thread.

With the separate forum, it would encourage different threads based around certain areas of the series. Currenty, in one thread, you have to stay relatively in one line of thought, or the thread will get messy and jump about all over the place. It would become confusing if it suddenly went from, say, favourite episode, to why you thin Saiyans hair is gold, and back again.

It doesn't have to be the same forums though, you could have new ones dedicated to the more currently popular anime like One Piece, Naruto or Avatar. You could even have an event to allow the memberbase to select which anime gets their own forum, and which ones stay in the general anime discussion

I like the look of your Anime Archives, and would like the Anime section to look like that again, if possible.

Thanks for entertaining ym suggestion! :catgirl:

[Korey]

[FONT="Franklin Gothic Medium"]I'm not sure about this idea, it seems like a good idea. But here's the thing I call into question....what happens if new anime come out and beat out the current anime in terms of popularity. Unlikely, yes, but still not impossible. Also, lots of anime fans have varied tastes in anime and may not like the popular series at that time.

Not to criticize DB or any of its series, but if we continue to focus on older series like that, we won't move ahead to see what's out right now and what's on the horizon. I think what we have now is the best thing for Otakuboards right now. If you'd like to discuss Dragonball or any other anime, there is definitely a thread for it in Anime Central. If the thread is inactive, all the more incentive to bring up your seperate questions/discussion points and try to revive the thread. It happens with a lot of threads.[/FONT]

[Desbreko]

[color=#4B0082]This was actually discussed at length in James's last [thread=57798][u]OB Survey[/u][/thread] thread.

Personally, I don't favor moving back to the multiple forum format but I do think allowing multiple threads about a series within our single anime forum is a good idea.[/color]

[James]

[font=franklin gothic medium]I am really eager to consider alternatives to the current format for covering anime, so I really welcome all members to submit their ideas on this.

I think that we need to make our anime coverage far more relevant, especially with Version Vibrant launching soon.[/font]

[Justin]

Well, in my opinion, this is question that hints at OB's future as a forum. For instance, OB was once a forum devoted to anime and gaming, as theOtaku.com itself is.

However, we cannot deny the fact that the focus of most of the regular members has shifted over the years from anime and gaming to a more..err...general discussion community-type view of the Boards.

Now, I think, the larger question here is "Does OB want to reestablish its connection to anime and gaming and the audience that connection would bring? Or does OB want to continue down the path of a less specialized board?"

If we were to open up the anime arena again, I suggest a complete split of the AV District into an Anime District and a Gaming District. One would have to be careful, though, as mentioned: Often people of more obscure tastes in gaming or anime may get left out the equation.

To combat this problem, I suggest an open anime forum--similar to the single anime forum we have now--with two or more sub forums devoted to second or third tier animes, in terms of popularity. I'm not sure if that's possible, but if it is, that is my suggestion. The same process would be followed with the gaming district.

However, my actual opinion is that we should not open up the anime/gaming arena again. At least, no more so than allowing for multiple threads devoted to single animes/games.

I believe OB, as a whole, has progressed far from its games/anime roots; too far, I think to justify trying to reestablish that connection.

-Justin

[Dagger]

It comes down to the "If you build it, will they come?" question. With our current active membership, I cannot think of a single anime franchise that would be able to sustain its own sub-forum. Of course, simply having a sub-forum might increase interest and/or draw new members... it's hard to tell without trying it.

Setting that aside, I'd love it if we could do more to attract members from theO.

~Dagger~

[ZeitGeist]

[quote name='Dagger']
Setting that aside, I'd love it if we could do more to attract members from theO.

~Dagger~[/QUOTE]


TheOtaku is the parent site, isn't it? If it had a link to these forums on the sidebar, you might get a few more newbies swing in from this direction.

I came in through a Google search, of all things.

[Allamorph]

[quote name='Dagger'] With our current active membership, I cannot think of a single anime franchise that would be able to sustain its own sub-forum.[/quote]
[FONT=Arial]What about sub-forums for different genres? Group certain anime together so that it's not so much a mash-up, but there's still a level of cohesiveness present.

Certainly there isn't enough discussion to merit individual forums for shows by themselves, but perhaps some members do not post there because there's simply too much that the forum contains. If the concentration could be slightly more focused, perhaps there might be more activity from those people who don't particularly want to have to search through so many old threads to avoid repeats.

[COLOR="DarkRed"]Dagger[/COLOR], you're gonna have to help me out on the different anime/manga classifications (what since I don't exactly commit them to memory), but we could have two to four (however many works) subs devoted to different styles; one for new releases (or maybe a sticky for that discussion); and one for Classic Anime, like Big O and such.[/FONT]

[Dagger]

I think that's been discussed before, but I can't remember where... :animeswea

It's a great idea in itself; the problem is that genre is an incredibly gnarly issue when it comes to anime. You can apply American film/TV genres to anime (which works, albeit only to a certain extent), or you can go by the Japanese demographic categories (shounen, shoujo, etc., which end up feeling sort of meaningless because the only thing separating them is marketing, and each group encompasses examples of every imaginable genre), or you can go by generally recognized genres like magical girl and mecha and so forth, but that leaves a lot of less easily defined shows without an anchor.

What might work would be using time as a basis for splitting the forum--something like one forum for newly airing shows (or anything not yet released in overseas in some form... could be defined narrowly or broadly), and one for shows airing or being released overseas. There would be some questions to hash out with respect to that as well, but I think it'd create less somewhat confusion than genre grouping. It's a thought, anyway.

I do feel that talking about DVD releases, fansubs etc., and American & other foreign broadcasts all in the same forum is a little bit problematic. Might be just me, but I get a disjointed feel from it at times. Obviously this wasn't an issue in the past when fansubs weren't as big... I don't think it's a coincidence that discussions of American-aired anime have shrunk a lot for us in the past few years. Discussions of both JP-airing and foreign-sold/airing anime might do better if they were sorted out.

~Dagger~

[Allamorph]

[quote name='Dagger']It's a great idea in itself; the problem is that genre is an incredibly gnarly issue when it comes to anime. You can apply American film/TV genres to anime (which works, albeit only to a certain extent), or you can go by the Japanese demographic categories (shounen, shoujo, etc., which end up feeling sort of meaningless because the only thing separating them is marketing, and each group encompasses examples of every imaginable genre), or you can go by generally recognized genres like magical girl and mecha and so forth, but that leaves a lot of less easily defined shows without an anchor.[/quote]
[FONT=Arial]True, but then that's assuming that we'd be basically assigning each individual anime a specific forum, which seems kind of silly. :p Obviously any show with multiple classifications should be allowed to be discussed if they are relevant to a given topic, no?

Also, if we did this (bear with me; I know you suggested something else ^_^ ), we'd be lumping more than a single genre into a given forum, right? I think having a forum dedicated solely to, say, shounen-ai would be a bit too far for the moment, considering.

Basically what I was thinking was that if an anime wants discussion, then it could this way have a place to accommodate discussion without being lost so much in the other stuff. It might then be slightly more acceptable to have separate threads for, say, Eureka 7 in general and Eureka 7's characters, or sommat like that.

Time-wise separation might work, but then we'd run the problem of having to define time periods for anime. Categorization doesn't seem as problematic for me, speaking from a literary standpoint, since the easiest thing to do would be to take the most [I]predominant[/I] theme and use that for classification?again, lumping several types together in the same forum. Surely if one can classify a novel, one can classify an anime series, especially since we have multiple labels in both languages already.

But yeah. Point is, maybe not anime-specific forums, but at least more focused ones.[/FONT]

[Dagger]

[quote name='Allamorph'][FONT=Arial]Categorization doesn't seem as problematic for me, speaking from a literary standpoint, since the easiest thing to do would be to take the most [I]predominant[/I] theme and use that for classification?again, lumping several types together in the same forum. Surely if one can classify a novel, one can classify an anime series, especially since we have multiple labels in both languages already.[/FONT][/QUOTE]
Oh my gosh, don't get me started on publishing categories. :p

Disclaimer: it's entirely possible that I see problems with book/anime classification *because* I'm deeply into both of them. Might not be an issue at all for most people. :animeshy:

That having been said, novels are a pretty good example of the pitfalls of genre classification. As with anime, the clearest-cut (in the sense that you can't argue with them factually, not in the sense that they're immediately apparent) categories are marketing categories... YA, middle-grade, literary fiction, category romance, urban fantasy, inspirational, self-help, street lit, etc. The problem is that marketing categories have little to do with the true content of the book: literary fiction basically covers every genre imaginable from satire to sci-fi.

It sounds like you're suggesting that we divide things not by sales categories (no complaints there) but rather by "genres" like action-adventure, drama-romance... is that what you mean? I guess I feel like too many shows offer a little bit of everything; sure, we can talk about the same show's crazy mecha battles in one place and its stupid comedy somewhere else, but that seems kind of self-defeating.

Anyway, time periods might not have been the best way of putting it. Maybe unlicensed vs. licensed (in the US, for lack of a neater barometer) would be a clearer way of getting across what I meant. It would have essentially the same effect, since most unlicensed shows (that people would tend to discuss, anyway) are new, and most shows get licensed after they finish airing or even later.

Basically, it would give show discussions a chance to start fresh in a different forum when an anime starts airing/getting released outside of Japan. That might be more friendly for people who are experiencing the show for the first time that way (instead of being faced with already-established threads full of comments about the fansubs or whatnot).

I'm not strongly attached to that concept or any other, though--just wanted to explain myself properly.

~Dagger~

[James]

[font=franklin gothic medium]One option would be to start migrating franchises.

So for argument's sake, let's say the most popular anime on OB right now was Gundam.

What you'd do is create a Gundam forum, but all other anime would be relegated to Anime Lounge.

Then as the site grows and as interest grows, you migrate [i]another[/i] franchise across to its own forum. And so on.

This way the most active anime franchises have due attention and the smaller ones aren't left out.[/font]

[Allamorph]

[QUOTE=Dagger]Oh my gosh, don't get me started on publishing categories. :p

Disclaimer: it's entirely possible that I see problems with book/anime classification *because* I'm deeply into both of them. Might not be an issue at all for most people. :animeshy:[/QUOTE]
[FONT=Arial]Heh. :animesmil

[QUOTE][I]It sounds like you're suggesting that we divide things not by sales categories (no complaints there) but rather by "genres" like action-adventure, drama-romance... is that what you mean? I guess I feel like too many shows offer a little bit of everything; sure, we can talk about the same show's crazy mecha battles in one place and its stupid comedy somewhere else, but that seems kind of self-defeating.[/I][/QUOTE]
Pretty much, yeah I was. And yeah, I know shows have elements of everything hodge-podged together, 'cause books are the same way, but that's why I said to group them by their [I]predominant[/I] element. I hardly think Gundam would fall under Comedy, even though it may have comedic moments, just as I hardly think Fruits Basket would fall under Science Fiction, even though there is the Zodiac angle tied securely into the series.

And even then, one could still start a discussion about the use of comedic effect in Gundam while keeping it in that anime's forum, simply because the thread is about Gundam. What I meant by cross-foruming was more incidental mention in another, less anime-specific thread (like in General Discussion, perhaps).

[QUOTE][I]Anyway, time periods might not have been the best way of putting it. Maybe unlicensed vs. licensed (in the US, for lack of a neater barometer) would be a clearer way of getting across what I meant. It would have essentially the same effect, since most unlicensed shows (that people would tend to discuss, anyway) are new, and most shows get licensed after they finish airing or even later.

Basically, it would give show discussions a chance to start fresh in a different forum when an anime starts airing/getting released outside of Japan. That might be more friendly for people who are experiencing the show for the first time that way (instead of being faced with already-established threads full of comments about the fansubs or whatnot). [/I][/QUOTE]
Aye, that makes sense, but then you're faced with a continually resupplied New/Unlicensed forum and an ever-growing Licensed forum, which I feel would quickly reach the same essential state as AC is right now. Sure, discussion is fomented for newer stuff, but the older shows still end up buried.

[QUOTE][I]I'm not strongly attached to that concept or any other, though--just wanted to explain myself properly.

~Dagger~[/I][/QUOTE]
And I'm just trying to make sure we're both on the same page about what I'm thinking, while making certain what I'm thinking works and doesn't get too complicated, since apparently I have that tendency. :p If it is decided that my proposed solution is not viable, then I will certainly not take offense.

But I'm blithering, so I think I'd better shut up for a while. :p


[B]Edit:[/B] Frick. Sorry. :p
[QUOTE=James][font=franklin gothic medium]One option would be to start migrating franchises.

So for argument's sake, let's say the most popular anime on OB right now was Gundam.

What you'd do is create a Gundam forum, but all other anime would be relegated to Anime Lounge.

Then as the site grows and as interest grows, you migrate [i]another[/i] franchise across to its own forum. And so on.[/font][/QUOTE]
So what would happen as a franchise lost popularity? Would that basically mean a semi-constant forum rotation? I don't know; seems kind of ... meh, to me. I can't really put it into real words, though.

-A[/FONT]

[Shy]

[size=1]The easiest way to decentralize the Anime Lounge is by series, although the problem is of course deciding which series deserve their own forums. I remember at one point we had a lot of .hack//SIGN discussion, but when we created a dedicated .hack//SIGN forum it never took off.

I've been campaigning for 'Member Choice' forums, which could be swapped in and out on a regular basis. For example, we'd have a poll among a couple of different anime series and the series that receives the most votes would earn their own forum. This could be applied to video games/current events/whatever, let me quote myself from the last OB Survey.

[quote=Shy]I almost think that we should have a number of "flavor of the month" forums that are constantly rotating in and out. These could tie into big movies, video games, anime series, etc. that are popular at the time. Then when member interest has faded they can be merged back into one of our existing forums and create newer, more topical ones.

Adding a Halo forum or a U.S. Presidential Election forum might spark some interest, and if they didn't, we'd create new ones to replace them. The forum structure obviously isn't set in stone, you know?

Members could even vote to decide which "flavor of the month" forums are added next. If that's not a cool idea for an event, I don't know what is.[/quote]
From personal experience, I think if we create Series or Genre-specific forums, it's ultimately best for the members to decide what those series or genre are.

We're a discussion forum, and we're not always talking about the same four or five things. It only makes sense for the forum structure to change along with the conversation (and the times.)

-Shy[/size]

[James]

[font=franklin gothic medium]The only problem with that idea is that whenever you create the "flavor of the month" forum, someone has to migrate the relevant threads out of Anime Lounge...and then back again later. It could be a bit too complex. And it might confuse newer members.

I believe that the safest way to go is probably to begin migrating specific franchises out of Anime Lounge and into their own sub-forums.

We could have a lot of member involvement though - for instance, each month or two we could have a poll and the most popular franchise could receive its own forum.

The best part is that none of this is irreversible. We can try it...and forums that don't pick up can be relegated back to AL.

I would like to tie this in with stronger promotion on theOtaku.com, which is necessary to boost our anime community.[/font]

[quote]So what would happen as a franchise lost popularity? Would that basically mean a semi-constant forum rotation? I don't know; seems kind of ... meh, to me. I can't really put it into real words, though.[/quote]

[font=franklin gothic medium]It would mean nothing. Either a) the forum just stays where it is or b) we archive it.

The difference between this and the flavor of the month idea is that the former is not only easier to do, but it provides for the possibility of more growth because people aren't going to be worried that their new forum is going to be removed after a month.

In the past we haven't had much of a problem with anime going out of style. Dragon Ball was by far our most popular forum, but even in its "dying days", it still had decent activity levels. If nothing else, people could use it as an archive/information resource.

The alternative idea of dividing by genre just won't work in my view. There are going to be too many disagreements about what anime goes where. It's too cumbersome and unintuitive.

The only other concept I can imagine is simply doing what some forums do and having an "A-K" and "L-Z" division in Anime Lounge, while simultaneously allowing multiple threads for each franchise.

This is still too difficult though, in my opinion. At least separate forums keep things clean and organized.[/font]

[Desbreko]

[color=#4B0082]I don't like the idea of splitting up anime by genre because, like Dagger said, most series draw from a few different genres. I think the result would be people creating duplicate threads in different forums depending on which genre they see as dominant.

I also don't really like splitting by time or license status, though I think it would be better than by genre. I think it would just create confusion for members who don't always stay on top of the news and also more work for moderators to shift threads around.

If we're going to split things up into multiple forums I think it needs to be readily apparent where one will be able to find threads about a certain series. No one wants to have to do research or hunt through multiple forums just to find a thread.

So far I prefer James's idea of creating series-specific forums that would just be permanent, provided they got enough activity. Merging once-popular forums back into Anime Central after their time is up would create a disorganized mess of out of context threads. However, I do think having members vote on which series they want to get forums is a good idea. A setup I could see working well is having a main forum for the voting and whatnot, and within that have sub-forums for the series.[/color]

[DBZgirl88]

[COLOR="#004a6f"]Rather than having series or genre specific forums, how about sub-forums for the types of topics we discuss about each anime? One forum could focus on plot, one could focus on character analysis, etc. Each anime could have a thread in those sub-froums. It could help the threads to stay on topic.[/COLOR]

[ZeitGeist]

[quote name='Chabichou'][COLOR="#004a6f"]Rather than having series or genre specific forums, how about sub-forums for the types of topics we discuss about each anime? One forum could focus on plot, one could focus on character analysis, etc. [B]Each anime could have a thread in those sub-froums[/B]. It could help the threads to stay on topic.[/COLOR][/QUOTE]


Yeah, but then you're getting back to the 'one-thread-per-anime' stance with added sub-forum clutter.

[[Sound_Nin]]

[quote name='ZeitGeist']Yeah, but then you're getting back to the 'one-thread-per-anime' stance with added sub-forum clutter.[/quote]

[FONT=Book Antiqua][COLOR=Navy]That definitely reminds me of waaaay back when. But the question is... would that be progression or regression? It doesn't sound like a terribly horrible idea, but at the same time it might not be the best.[/COLOR][/FONT]