Barbie Vs Bratz

[ChibiHorsewoman]

[color=#9933ff]YEah I know I hardly come here any more. I have no idea who is who anymore. But I have a question to ask or whatever so here I go.

Between raising a three year old and going to the local toy museum (I live fifteen minutes from the Strong National Museum of Play and they have a toy museum- there's Sailor Senshi toys in there now!) And on a recent visit I saw that the Bratz have been added. True they don't have the space that Barbie does. But the fact that they've been added.. ick?

Also I've been visiting Deviant art and seeing all the drawings of Bratz vs Barbie. Some of them are funny, some are disturbing and there's one in my favorites. So I have to ask what is so great about Bratz? Okay you can also ask what is so great about Barbie? But at least Barbie does something besides go boy chasing and wear make up. She's been a doctor an astronaught (can't spell) ran for president a few times, been to war, been a pilot, a teacher, a dancer and a Top Model (check the toy stores- she's now a Top Model) to name a few things. But at least she's had careers. All the Bratz do is go crazy for being film stars, rock stars (Barbie's done that a few times) and clothing.

So in my opinion, who needs Bratz?

Uh anyone else? I promise sooner or later there will be a more direct debate about this.[/color]

[The13thMan]

[FONT="Trebuchet MS"]Popular dolls, like bratz, really disgust me nowadays. They're all about sex appeal aimed towards little girls! They impose this fake bs image onto these little impressionable girls that it's ok to dress like a slut and act like a ditzy retard. Barbie did this as well, but not nearly to the same extent (it seems). At least barbie did become a doctor or an astronaut from time to time. If i ever have a daughter i will never buy her a doll that puts those sort of images into her head.

Seriously though... have you seen those baby bratz?
[IMG]http://www.mgae.com/awards/images/_awards/baby_bratz.jpg[/IMG]
I am literally disgusted at this image! What the hell are these people thinking? Do they actually have babies that look like this? They're wearing all kinds of makeup, tiny shirts,...what seems to be a mix between diapers and underwear.

I hope i answered your question...[/FONT]

[Raiha]

[COLOR="DarkOrchid"][FONT="Times New Roman"]Clearly this is just another tool by the mainstream ruling class to sexualize female girls and create within them an inadequacy that leads them to use every material good produced to make them feel more 'beautiful,' thus promoting the evils of capitalism around the world.

OR

Someone tried drawing his ideal sex mate while smoking crack late one night and it leaked out somehow.[/FONT][/COLOR]

[Vicky]

[size=1]They're both as bad as each other. Granted perhaps Barbie is less, but she's still a twig with an abnormal sized head. Plus, despite having all these careers, the ***** got pregnant. All the little girls want to be like their Barbie. I never did play with Barbie though; Action Man was where it was at.

I think the Simpsons episode about Lisa Lionheart covers this subject, anyway XD.[/size]

[Cat]

I think that bratz are far worst then Barbies. I grew up with barbies while my little sister grew up with bratz. I never really had any of the special barbies except for the teacher barbie and a few Disney ones. My sister though had to have the special bratz where they were rock stars or someother theme. I couldn't understand how she wanted the special ones for a doll was so you can dress her up and you could buy the extra clothes sepurally instead of buying a new doll every time because they have certain clothes style.

If you were to look at Ken VS Bratz Boys. Then they are both as bad. I once had a ken doll that you could shave. Very strange indeed. The Bratz Boys to me are just as air headed as the girl. All they seem to do is follow the girls around and drool. Ken also followed Barbie around too however he did help out with some of Barbie careers not by much though.

[Sangome]

[SIZE="1"]Barbie > Bratz.

That is all.

...Okay, so I don't get harassed by our mods [...WHO ARE AWESOME :D], I'll add more. It's really no contest...Barbie promotes the thought of girls being able to grow up to be whatever they want! Doctor, pop star, teacher, vet...it's endless. Bratz...they're only concerned with their looks, looking like tramps. And finding boyfriends.

One thing that Barbie also has over Bratz as well are the collectible dolls that can be purchased. They're some of the most beautiful dolls I've seen, and I'd love to have one. I'd proudly display it in my room. Although the last time I saw one, I was a youngin', so I'm unsure if they even exist any more.[/SIZE]

[Sabrina]

[FONT="Tahoma"][QUOTE=Paramount][SIZE="1"]Barbie > Bratz.

That is all.

...Okay, so I don't get harassed by our mods [...WHO ARE AWESOME :D], I'll add more. It's really no contest...Barbie promotes the thought of girls being able to grow up to be whatever they want! Doctor, pop star, teacher, vet...it's endless. Bratz...they're only concerned with their looks, looking like tramps. And finding boyfriends.

One thing that Barbie also has over Bratz as well are the collectible dolls that can be purchased. They're some of the most beautiful dolls I've seen, and I'd love to have one. I'd proudly display it in my room. Although the last time I saw one, I was a youngin', so I'm unsure if they even exist any more.[/SIZE][/QUOTE]I think that covers what I think as well. The Bratz series just seems so... shallow. Though on some level, I think it's just a toy and people put too much thought into stuff like that. Probably because I think it's ultimately up to a parent to decide if they'll get something like that for their kids.

Anyway... I think you might be referring to something like this when you talk about them having really nifty dolls. [URL="http://www.barbiecollector.com/showcase/product.aspx?id=150086&t=modern&t2=alpha&x=alpha&y=g13&sort=name"][U]Example[/U][/URL] I know I wouldn't mind having something pretty like that to display. Pity they don't make that kind anymore. One of my friends who collects dolls told me that they don't make as many nifty ones like that anymore.[/FONT]

[visualkei]

Though I hate the way Bratz look, I could see why a child would like it. They're like chibis. Chibis are cute, right? Kids like chibis. But I think that most children don't read into Bratz like adults do. They see the sparkly and the shiny, and they think it's beautiful. If I went into a Pre-K class, wearing high heels, lots of makeup, cheap looking clothes, big fake earrings, many of the children would come up to me and tell me I'm beautiful.

Barbie is classic. And since Barbie is an adult, she can get away with looking glamorous, make-up and all. Bratz on the other hand, actually look like children. The dolls look like children wearing skimpy clothing and make-up, it's kind of hard for me to not be turned off when I see a Bratz doll.

Have you seen a living Bratz doll yet? How about one that moves and dances. You can see them when you walk by Libby Luu. They're... real.

[chibi-master]

[quote name='visualkei']Though I hate the way Bratz look, I could see why a child would like it. They're like chibis.[/QUOTE]

[FONT="Arial Black"][COLOR="Red"][SIZE="4"]WRONG!!![/SIZE][/COLOR][/FONT]:flaming:

I draw chibis, those trashy looking dolls are NOT like chibis. But that's just my opinion and I do respect yours.

Anyway, Barbies are better than Bratz. Bratz are easier to break, much less interesting than the care and sweat that goes into ruining Barbies. Plus, I think Barbies have much less make-up and a weensy bit more realistic proportions than Bratz, whos heads are the biggest things on their bodies, even if they are full of hot air.

[Drizzt Do'urden]

Comparing the two is like comparing the old Ninja turtle dolls to the new. Yeah for those of us that were around when the turtles were first in their boom stage we think you couldn't compare the two because it would be no contest.

Bratz are just the barbies of today. Sure barbie's still around, she's even a lawyer now suing the makers of Bratz for copyright infringment (Which sorta begs the question, was the movie [I]Legally Blonde[/I] destined to be a prophecy?)

Sure you don't see Bratz promoting "You can be what you want to be" But they mimick the direction society's going in. When barbie came out, there was the big push for women's equality. So they dipicted Barbie doing every single job out there, my sister had every special edition barbie on her wall that came out. So I remember athletic barbie, teacher barbie....and the list goes on.

Nowadays since women's equality has been settled (Anyone who wants to start a new thread stating otherwise I will be happy to throw my two cents in on the issue.). So when you look at the bulk of younger gils nowadays, (Now this next point doesn't include the wonderful young women of Otakuboards), they're only interested in attaining the attention of boys, dressing like "movie stars", which of course means dressing like whores, wearing make-up much to young.

It's sad, but the Bratz emulate that to the extreme. So you really can't compare the two. And as far as the "sexest" thing goes, let it go. Yes barbie may have been anatomically incorrect. But her creators didn't do anything that hadn't been done already. When she came out there were already "barbies" in show business. Big boobs, skinny, "perfect" (now just incase that's hard to figure out for someone, the quotes over perfect are because that's what it's supposed to be. But real men don't want barbie dolls. They want real women, natural and beautiful. Not full of plastic and poison.

[Gelgoog Pilot]

While I think most of this banter is very interesting, I'd like to throw in my opinion as to why there are even in that museum. These Bratz toys are the representation of a period of time, much like how Barbie was an establishment in the past. The reason they are in a display is simply because they are popular and symbolize the line of thought that has taken over our current society.

Lets face it, we brought it on ourselves. They are casting a poor light on the way to view women or how all little girls should look as they age. We as a society did nothing to prevent this, in fact the population as a whole cheers it and begs for more. The only proof you need is to watch the news on any given day. What you'll see is a few segments on local events, some national issues and they of course some retarded story on a celebrity and how they are now pregnant.

Now, I agree that comparing them is very foolish, however, I go with Barbie. I only say this because Barbie has had time to 'clean up her act'. She has been given so many career opportunities to help girls see that they can aspire to anything. Bratz, just hasn't had the time to redeem itself, but who is to say Bratz will.

[Rachmaninoff]

[quote name='Raiha'][COLOR="DarkOrchid"][FONT="Times New Roman"]Someone tried drawing his ideal sex mate while smoking crack late one night and it leaked out somehow.[/FONT][/COLOR][/QUOTE]Sounds about right. =P

However, in all honesty, it's a toy. And if I'm going to try and point fingers for something messing with the way kids see themselves. I'd be more inclined to look at the parents and what they do when it comes to teaching them about not taking things like silly dolls seriously.

If someone really thinks it's giving the wrong impression, then why do they buy them and give them to their kids? In the end, it's just a toy. And blaming a toy for something like poor self esteem seems as pointless as blaming video games for violence. :/

[Aaryanna_Mom]

I've always though the argument over Barbie or any other Doll somehow turning our children into needy girls/boys suffering from poor self esteem was a bit of a stretch. The biggest influence, in my opinion, is a child's parents.

I don't even know how to properly explain it really. I do know that I don't consider one worse than the other. If you haven't taken the time to explain to your kids that they're not real in any sense of the world, then you've failed as a parent.

It's not that hard to simply not buy such things for your kids if you really think it would be harmful. So if anyone is allowing this so called influence, it's yourself for purchasing it and putting it in your kids hands.

So it got added to a display in a museum, so what. I fail to see how showcasing how toys have changed over the years really matters at all.

[The13thMan]

[FONT="Trebuchet MS"]A few people brought up the point that it's not the doll's fault as much as it is the parent's fault. This, to me, feels like a tu quoque logical fallacy.

[quote name='SGU']Tu quoque - Literally, you too. This is an attempt to justify wrong action because someone else also does it. "My evidence may be invalid, but so is yours." [/quote]

I'm not certain if it's exactly the same thing, perhaps someone could help me. Regardless, i wanted to say that yes it could be moreso the parents' fault but that does not excuse the faults of the doll. Regardless of what the parent does i think the doll is intrinsically in fault here because of the way it looks and what it promotes. And i think it has more of an effect than people realize. When kids are young enough to play with dolls they're extremely impressionable.

I do agree, though, that it is mostly the parents' responsibility to raise the child. If a parent thinks the dolls are messed up, then they shouldn't buy them. I sure as heck know i won't buy dolls for my girl unless i aprove of the message they're sending. I just didn't want that point to be misunderstood as an excuse for the dolls. [/FONT]

[Sara]

[quote name='Drizzt Do'urden']Nowadays since women's equality has been settled (Anyone who wants to start a new thread stating otherwise I will be happy to throw my two cents in on the issue.). So when you look at the bulk of younger gils nowadays, ([b]Now this next point doesn't include the wonderful young women of Otakuboards[/b]), they're only interested in attaining the attention of boys, dressing like "movie stars", which of course means dressing like whores, wearing make-up much to young.
[/QUOTE]Nice try, but your sexism is showing.

[Gelgoog Pilot]

I would think they are more after the acceptance of their peers than just boys. I myself may have sought attention of only girls when I was younger but, I know not every guy was doing the same. Plus since I was on the majority unsuccessful at attracting girls, I like to think they were after other things ( At least I think that for my pride's sake :) ).

[Lunar]

[COLOR="Indigo"][FONT="Book Antiqua"]Ok,
actually, i have no interest in neither. i've had barbies, but all i've really done is throw them and make them fight each other. *laughs*
anyway, i would have to choose barbie. i mean, how old are the bratz again? they're a little young to be wearing make up to me. and all they care about is fashion and a stupid band. (not all bands are stupid). and they avertise them so much. every day there's something new about bratz! but i can say the same about barbie........barbie's better because she actually [I]does[/I] something instead of dress up and sing. my lil' sisters have had bratz dolls. they come apart. blech.:animedepr[/FONT][/COLOR]

[Gelgoog Pilot]

True, but Bratz has GLITTER! Can you say you're not attracted to glitter?

Nah, actually I agree with that completely. The Bratz only have material pleasures to offer, while Barbie presents us with some important ideals.

[Lunar]

[COLOR="Indigo"][FONT="Book Antiqua"]Exactly! except for the fact that recently they had a movie about friendship.............. being loyal. i've been there before. friends don't last forever.
another thing about barbie......when did they start making movies??? oh boy, that song's in my head again. "Connected, protected........" anyway, did bratz ever fight each other, i mean [I]physically[/I]?[/FONT][/COLOR]

[Gelgoog Pilot]

I think to see that kind of action you'll have to watch robot chicken. I'll check out my movie folders, maybe I have it somewhere. Lol I would love to see it though, even just one slap or back-hand.

[ChibiHorsewoman]

[quote name='Lunar'][COLOR="Indigo"][FONT="Book Antiqua"]anyway, did bratz ever fight each other, i mean [I]physically[/I]?[/FONT][/COLOR][/QUOTE]

[color=#9933ff]Maybe somewhere on youtube or deviant art. But sadly never in a show/ Well except for Girls Really Rock- Yes I watched that on Nick a few weeks ago- sadly no fist fights. Although these twins called the 'Tweevils' have punched eachother a few times. BUt I would love to see the Bratz beat eachother up. Maybe I'll do that with the Bratz dolls my friend is giving to my daughter for the sole purpose of her destroying them.

As for Barbie- in the doll's defense she was created from a German doll called Bild Lili who enjoyed the good life and would do anything to get it and was sold as a gag gift for the man who had everything. In the past fifty years she's been everything from a Mod Teen to a Rockstar to a Vet and an Airline Pilot. And she's actually got accessories that you can buy separately and different outfits unlike the Bratz where you have to buy a new friggin' doll for every new outfit! Sorry but the single mom on a budget here is definately not made out of money- stress maybe, but not money.

Concerning the Bratz and Barbie in the Toy Museum- they're mostly there to show different toys played with through the years, different trends and mile stones things like that. Just a few rows down from Bratz and Barbie are a shedload of antique doll houses and an exhibit called: When Barbie Dated GI Joe Growing Up in the Cold War Era. It goes through different parts of life from Post WW2 to the Cold War and Vietnam. Really if any of you ever end up in Rochester you should check out the Strong Museum (If it's any selling point you can play Wii and DDR there for free)[/color]

[Lunar]

[COLOR="Indigo"][FONT="Book Antiqua"]Hey, bratz always have [I]one [/I]outfit. :rolleyes: just imagine the moms who have bratty little kids who always ask for bratz every [I]day[/I].[/FONT][/COLOR]

[visualkei]

[quote name='chibi-master'][FONT="Arial Black"][COLOR="Red"][SIZE="4"]WRONG!!![/SIZE][/COLOR][/FONT]:flaming:

I draw chibis, those trashy looking dolls are NOT like chibis. But that's just my opinion and I do respect yours.[/QUOTE]

lol, funny how otakus react. Chibis- a little person, usually with an oversized head and big eyes. They're like american drawn chibis.

I agree with some of the people here who brought up the fact that the dolls reflect the times. Anyone here ever watched Mean Girls? There's this one scene where Lohan drops by this blonde girl's house, and her mother is plastic, and her little sister is watching MTV or something, and dancing erotically to the music video. Yeah, a lot of truth in that.