Aliens!

[The13thMan]

[FONT="Trebuchet MS"]Holy Crap!!!

Hah, that's just what you have to say if you ever hear anyone scream, "Aliens!" It's required...

What do you guys think about aliens? Do you think we've been visitied? Do you think they exist? Would you like them to visit us if they do exist? What sort of crazy alien technologies do you think their could be? Would you be one of the crazy people protesting at the top of a NYC building like in Independence Day (waiting to get vaporized)? Do aliens frighten you?

I don't want this to only be a question and answer thread. I'd like it if a decent debate got going about a number of these questions.

I personally don't believe aliens have ever visited us. There isn't currently any sufficient evidence for me to believe that we've been visited. I do think they exist somewhere in the universe. I also think it would be incredible if we were visited. I welcome them!

Because of the physical limitations of our universe i don't think we ever will see aliens. The universal speed limit is the speed of light, which means for any ET to visit us they'd have to have been traveling for a very long time... otherwise they'd be hiding from us. Though... the book Ender's Game did bring up an interesting concept - faster than light communication. Basically, in the book, there was a natural phenomenon that occured called philotic twining where one particle interacted the same as another somewhere else in the universe regardless of the distance between them. I've heard recently of a quantum phenomenon called quantum entanglement that seems similar. I'm no quantum physicist, so i don't know if you'd ever be able to use quantum entanglement practically, but it's fun to think about.

I had a conversation with a good friend of mine, and he said that he'd be afraid of aliens visiting. He thinks they'd likely be hostile. I disagree with him. If aliens were advanced enough to have acquired interplanetary travel then i'd imagine their society to be peaceful enough for the science to have come that far. Of course, it's pure speculation...

So, what do you guys think?[/FONT]

[Lunar]

[COLOR="Indigo"]Heck yes there are aliens! What do you think the other planets are for??? As for if we've ever been visited by them.......i don't think so, or if we have, we don't know it. I have no problem debating with someone over this subject. but as for appearances, i don't think they look anything like the movies depicted it, they are a completely different species.:catgirl: as for being scared of aliens, it may be something strange, but not really, no. [/COLOR]

[Gavin]

[SIZE="1"]Been a while since this thread cropped up. Suppose I'll break up your questions 13th and answer them individually.

[B]What do you guys think about aliens? [/B]
Way too vague to answer.

[B]Do you think we've been visitied? [/B]
Honestly, I don't know. All manner of scenarios are possible, some more probable than others. It boils down likely in my mind that we either have been visited and are being studied/observed for the moment or that we have not been visited at all. I genuinely believe actual alien communication would not be something any government would be able to keep secret.

[B]Do you think they exist? [/B]
This should really have been the first question given. Short answer is yes, based simply on the enourmity of the universe, logic and probability. It is nothing short of extreme arrogance to believe we are the only intelligent species in existence.

[B]Would you like them to visit us if they do exist? [/B]
It would depend on their intentions, obviously if they were coming here to enslave or exterminate mankind then of course the answer is no. However if they came in peace then of course the answer is yes. Funny thiNG is, I wonder how they would react to us.

[B]What sort of crazy alien technologies do you think their could be? [/B]
Anything and everything to give another short answer, depending on their level of advancement it literally could be our wildest dreams.

[B]Would you be one of the crazy people protesting at the top of a NYC building like in Independence Day (waiting to get vaporized)? [/B]
As far as I remember, they were welcoming the aliens weren't they ? Either way if they were coming in peace, I'd welcome them with open arms, but then I'm a pan-globalist, so integration into a larger galactic/universal community would be the next step.

[B]Do aliens frighten you? [/B]
Again depends on intentions, and I'm sure some of them could look pretty frightening depending on origins for example insects, but generally speaking, no.[/SIZE]

[Vicky]

[size=1]Of course there's 'aliens', but they're absolutely nothing like anything we could even imagine, I think. The factors and conditions needed for [i]life as we know it[/i] to evolve would be immensely difficult to find, and in the Universe we've mapped there's not many planets out there with the same conditions, let alone intelligent life (probably not even simple life). That, and, the nearest solar system is 4.2 light years away. If aliens did exist like the movies, it'd take too long for them to get here (you [i]really[/i] think objects can travel at light speed?).

The size of the Universe makes it entirely possible and probable for there to be aliens. That being said, the size of the Universe makes it nearly impossible for us to ever see, hear, let alone make contact with any of them. I'm not talking green men, I'm talking creatures whose very existence would be beyond anything we imagine - then again, you could argue that the Universe is so big that a duplicate planet is slightly possible as well. Nevermind.

Again, I'll bring up the fact that they'd probably be like nothing we've imagined. They might not have reasoning, they might not even have a [i]brain[/i], or intelligence, they might not even be there physically... anyone who thinks aliens who contact us will actually be able to communicate or even realise what the hell we are has a screw loose. If you think culture difference on this planet are vast, then just imagine the differences between two species who evolved under completely different conditions on other sides of the Universe with completely different...

You get me anyway.[/size]

[Allamorph]

[FONT=Arial]Borrowing [COLOR=DarkRed]Gavin[/COLOR]'s breakdown....[QUOTE=Gavin][SIZE="1"][B]What do you guys think about aliens? [/B]
[B]Do you think we've been visitied? [/B]
[B]Do you think they exist? [/B]
[B]Would you like them to visit us if they do exist? [/B]
[B]What sort of crazy alien technologies do you think their could be? [/B]
[B]Would you be one of the crazy people protesting at the top of a NYC building like in Independence Day (waiting to get vaporized)? [/B]
[B]Do aliens frighten you? [/B][/SIZE][/QUOTE]
....I wonder at the usefulness of debating a topic so heavily based on subjectivity and imagination.

As it stands, we've got no indicators either way for extraterrestrials (since aliens are also technically Canadians, etc...), so if they do exist then I won't be too surprised, and if they don't then I won't be surprised either. A visit would be cool, conquest not so much (the Mayans probably felt the same about Cortéz); technology wouldn't be all that crazy, considering that, well, it's tech and makes logical sense one way or another; considering I have no idea what extraterrestrials would look or be like if they [I]did[/I] exist, being frightened makes no sense.....

.....and weren't over half the people on the top of the buildings in Independence Day actually the Welcome Wagon? Or was that just me?[/FONT]

[The13thMan]

[FONT="Trebuchet MS"]I should really really be studying... but, naw.

To gavin:
Well, you kept saying that it depended upon their intentions. I guess the next logical question is, what do you think their intentions would be? Keep in mind that copping out by saying, "Oh, there is no way I could ever know!" is totally lame.

And feel free to organize my questions however you want next time.

To Vicky:
I don't understand why you think they'd be completely outside of the realm of our imagination. Certainly you could say that they'd probably be extremely different than ourselves, but out of the realm of imagination? I don't think so. There are only so many forms that life can take on. There are only as many elements in our universe as the ones in the periodic table of elements. That said, i do think they'd be pretty odd. But there are certain universal laws that limits the possibilities of what is and is not possible.

I also don't understand why you don't think they'd be able to communicate with us or vice versa. Have you ever seen the movie Contact? The aliens in that movie communicated through mathematics. 1+1=2 true, 1+1=0 false. That sort of stuff. There are, as i've already said, things that do not change in our universe. One of those things is mathematics. But i do understand where you're coming from, slightly. I read a book once where there was an alien species that communicated through manipulating DNA. They would send DNA to one another that would have a physiological effect on the other being and that would be their message. But then the real question that comes up is whether these creatures could be considered intelligent or not. [/FONT]

[Vicky]

[size=1]The problem is with humans we're insanely arrogant. We think we've got the Universe in a nutshell and, therefore, we've figured out the answer (like you said Maths doesn't change in the Universe - that's a human assumption). Our understanding might be completely wrong - you said that there's 'only elements in our periodic table'. How do you know? How do we know? We haven't even been outside the confines of our own solar system. We use telescopes and science - [i]human[/i] understanding - to make sense of something we can never touch or see with the naked eye. That, and, our own senses often deceive us.

I just think as a species we're very limited and set in the 'science proves all' theories. Science is our understanding, and it can make sense of the planet we live on, but the Universe is another story. That's why I think aliens are out of our wildest imagination, because we're too confined to our own little world of science and human knowledge that we probably wouldn't be able to comprehend anything that slightly breaks the laws of our 'truth'.

A lot of what we [i]think[/i] is logical and true could very well be completely stupid. Which pretty much neglects most of what I said in the first paragraph or so of my previous post, but I still stand with this explanation. The Universe might not even be that big at all - maybe it really is only as far as our eyes can see.

Give it a few millenia then maybe human understanding and our ability to make sense of things can be trusted. As of now, we've got nothing.[/size]

[chibi-master]

I'm right in the middle of YES and NO. There could be, there could not. I suppose that if they existed and came to visit us, I'd be suspicious and avoid them like the flu. And if I couldn't avoid them, I'd be fine as long as they didn't touch my stuff. They bother me, poke me, or take anything of mine and they'll be so dead that the body will rot ahead of time. Or maybe that'll just be an alien thing...:animedepr

[The13thMan]

[quote name='chibi-master']I'm right in the middle of YES and NO. There could be, there could not. I suppose that if they existed and came to visit us, I'd be suspicious and avoid them like the flu. And if I couldn't avoid them, I'd be fine as long as they didn't touch my stuff. They bother me, poke me, or take anything of mine and they'll be so dead that the body will rot ahead of time. Or maybe that'll just be an alien thing...:animedepr[/QUOTE]

[FONT="Trebuchet MS"]Hah, i can imagine you killing an alien for getting too close and starting an intergalactic war. You will be forever remembered in human history (if there is one after the war's over) as the one who started it all - domino number 1. [/FONT][quote name='Vicky'][size=1]The problem is with humans we're insanely arrogant. We think we've got the Universe in a nutshell and, therefore, we've figured out the answer (like you said Maths doesn't change in the Universe - that's a human assumption). Our understanding might be completely wrong - you said that there's 'only elements in our periodic table'. How do you know? How do we know? We haven't even been outside the confines of our own solar system. We use telescopes and science - [i]human[/i] understanding - to make sense of something we can never touch or see with the naked eye. That, and, our own senses often deceive us.

I just think as a species we're very limited and set in the 'science proves all' theories. Science is our understanding, and it can make sense of the planet we live on, but the Universe is another story. That's why I think aliens are out of our wildest imagination, because we're too confined to our own little world of science and human knowledge that we probably wouldn't be able to comprehend anything that slightly breaks the laws of our 'truth'.

A lot of what we [i]think[/i] is logical and true could very well be completely stupid. Which pretty much neglects most of what I said in the first paragraph or so of my previous post, but I still stand with this explanation. The Universe might not even be that big at all - maybe it really is only as far as our eyes can see.

Give it a few millenia then maybe human understanding and our ability to make sense of things can be trusted. As of now, we've got nothing.[/size][/QUOTE]

[FONT="Trebuchet MS"]I think it's arrogant of you to claim that our current understanding of the universe makes us arrogant. I say this because i'm quite certain that you do not know all of the current science about our universe. This isn't a, "you don't know science, haha" thing, it's that nobody can know all the science in all the science textbooks we've got out right now.

I doubt that you understand the amount of evidence that we have and the thoroughness of our understanding of the universe currently. How do i know that the elements on the periodic table are basically all there is? Well, first off, by definition if we were to discover a new element it would go on the periodic table of elements. Secondly because of the way its organized and its power to predict elements we have yet to discover. I'm sure you've heard of this, but if you haven't then ask and i'll tell you.

Why do i think the physics of the universe apply for all places in the universe? Simply because all the points in our universe that we have observed have shown that the physics are the same. What evidence is there that physics works differently in different parts of the universe? None, really. Sure, there's physics out there that we do not understand and are trying to figure out (the LHC coming online can atest to that), but so what? That does not mean that the physics in other places do not work or would be different. You're exhibiting the ad ignorantium logical fallacy.

[quote name='SGU']Ad ignorantiam - The argument from ignorance basically states that a specific belief is true because we don't know that it isn't true. Defenders of extrasensory perception, for example, will often overemphasize how much we do not know about the human brain. UFO proponents will often argue that an object sighted in the sky is unknown, and therefore it is an alien spacecraft. [/quote]

I understand your skepticism. Your skepticism alone is quite healthy and i commend it. But added with the logical fallacy and you've gone and turned the healthy skepticism into something different. Bottom line is that the amount of evidence that the laws of physics in our universe acts the way that we understand it is greater than the amount of evidence that the laws of physics changes or are different throughout the galaxy. Therefore, if one were to believe in that which shows more evidence, one would believe that the laws of physics are the same throughout the universe. If you want to add skepticism to that, then go for it, i sure as hell do.

So to wrap this back into the deal with aliens, i think that the way aliens will look and possibly develop [B]are [/B]within the realms of our imagination.
[/FONT]

[James]

[font=franklin gothic medium]I think life on other planets probably does exist. I mean, given the infinite size of the Universe, I just can't imagine that Earth is the only planet with life (especially given that scientists are aware of other planets that can potentially support it).

Having said that, I have no idea if we will ever really discover them or evidence of their remains.

I doubt they have visited Earth though.

One thing I find interesting is that if we do discover alien life, it would have profound religious implications (i.e. one would have to look at the book of Genesis in a completely different way, if one already views Genesis as absolute fact).

As far as whether or not they would be hostile (if they were advanced enough), it's really hard to say. I think we often look at these situations from a very human perspective (i.e. whether or not something is "friend or foe"). And we are naturally frightened and suspicious of what we don't understand.

I actually think it would be far more incredible if Earth were the only planet in existence to have fostered life. If that were true, it would be far more of a revelation than the idea that many planets support life.

It would also be kind of sad, actually. Just the thought of that is kind of empty and lonely, I think.[/font]

[chibi-master]

[quote name='The13thMan'][FONT="Trebuchet MS"]Hah, i can imagine you killing an alien for getting too close and starting an intergalactic war. You will be forever remembered in human history (if there is one after the war's over) as the one who started it all - domino number 1. [/FONT][/QUOTE]

Aw, heck yeah!!! Wait...maybe that's not too much of a good thing...

Yeah, but...I was recently watching a special on people claiming to have been abducted by aliens. And my verdict? THEY WERE ALL NUT-JOBS!!! So I think I can at least say that I don't believe aliens have ever visited us.

[The13thMan]

[quote name='chibi-master']Aw, heck yeah!!! Wait...maybe that's not too much of a good thing...

Yeah, but...I was recently watching a special on people claiming to have been abducted by aliens. And my verdict? THEY WERE ALL NUT-JOBS!!! So I think I can at least say that I don't believe aliens have ever visited us.[/QUOTE]

[FONT="Trebuchet MS"]Isn't it funny that all the people who claim to have been abducted by aliens are nut jobs? They're always like backwater rednecks with poor grammar. "'Dem aliens done took my baby! They took meh baby!" That's my impression of one of them.

Either aliens are super smart and have realized that we won't listen to these nut jobs or these nut jobs are really just nuts.

I said "nut" in this post too many times...[/FONT]

[James]

[font=franklin gothic medium]Also I do wonder how much aliens could possibly achieve by regularly probing humans.

At this point it's clearly entertainment for them, rather than science. :drunk:[/font]

[Lunar]

[quote name='chibi-master']Aw, heck yeah!!! Wait...maybe that's not too much of a good thing...

Yeah, but...I was recently watching a special on people claiming to have been abducted by aliens. And my verdict? THEY WERE ALL NUT-JOBS!!! So I think I can at least say that I don't believe aliens have ever visited us.[/QUOTE]


[COLOR="Indigo"]Nut-Job is a mean word!especially to the people who really believe it! besides.........i forgot something. if aliens ever were to come to earth, i think the would come because they are curious, just like we are. i highly doubt that they would be hostile and annihlate the whole human race............ well, maybe a 3% chance:catgirl:[/COLOR]

[Tetra of sound]

[quote name='The13thMan']Either aliens are super smart and have realized that we won't listen to these nut jobs or these nut jobs are really just nuts.[/QUOTE]

Yeah. Nut jobs. I live with people that are like that. I have to deal with these morons [I]every day!!!![/I] Heheh. I believe if Aliens that are incredibly advanced are out there, they would most likely have to be peaceful, and are probably watching us, but only for somewhat of amusement. How else can you get that far with weapons and violence? I mean, look at Man. We've killed off our own kind's best civilization's people, making it so that if aliens could travel space, they could do it earlier than us. Also, the South Park episode where Cartman gets a "probe" shoved up his butt. If anyone has seen the ending (where Earth is just a TV show, and we're all from different planets), it might just be true? What if time has gone on a lot longer than we think, or if they made this planet (literally [I]made[/I]) for their amusement?

[Sabrina]

[FONT="Tahoma"]Point of reference: Independence Day. They thought the aliens were friendly and weren't waiting to be vaporized. o_O Anyway...

Though I find the concept of Aliens interesting, I think we lack enough real knowledge to go on since everything we know or have seen has come from someone's imagination. All those science fiction shows out there and so forth.

So do I think they've been here? Don't know. Do I think they'd be friendly? I would hope so. O_o[/FONT]

[The13thMan]

[quote name='James'][font=franklin gothic medium]Also I do wonder how much aliens could possibly achieve by regularly probing humans.

At this point it's clearly entertainment for them, rather than science. :drunk:[/font][/QUOTE]

[FONT="Trebuchet MS"]Hey, it's just as entertaining to me as it is for them! I laugh my *** off about it all the time! Get it?!

As for time going on longer than we thought, i don't know, but i kinda doubt it. We know how old the universe is today because all the stellar objects that we can observe have a certain velocity (unless of course they're stuck in orbit). And if we reverse that velocity they all come back to a single point in space at a single point in time. This is how the big bang theory came about.

There's actually a person out there who believes that the current state of our economy is actually much better than it actually is because of a virutal reality created by aliens. And in reality we're all like in these messed up worlds or in the matrix or something insane like that. That guy really [B]is [/B]a nut job![/FONT]

[Drizzt Do'urden]

I doubt we'll ever have a chance to prove/disprove the topic. Being a scientific christian (yes we do exist) I do think life on other planets exists. I can't imagine a god creating everything, and taking the time to ever expand the universe for no reason more than to give us a playground over the next few millenia.

So I'm convinced there is life, I do think they are probably so far away so we won't discover them for many many many many years. And when we do they'll probably look/talk/act similar to us.

[Horendithas]

[COLOR="Indigo"]This topic reminds me of religion since it's so full of speculation and guesswork and no actual facts. All conjecture and no substance. Just what you [I]think [/I]might be. Though I'm sure some would argue otherwise for religion, but that's besides the point.

Anyway, my point being, as interesting as the concept is, I don't really think they do or don't exist, let alone any technology they might have. There just isn't anything to make me want to believe in such a thing. Because either it does exist or it doesn't. It's fun to imagine to a certain point but that's about it. Though a lot of the insane sci fi shows out there are amusing.

Oh and it does make me think of this:

[CENTER][IMG]http://images.icanhascheezburger.com/completestore/2008/9/16/128660806259082103.jpg[/IMG][/CENTER]

:blulaugh:[/COLOR]

[Gavin]

[quote name='The13thMan'][FONT="Trebuchet MS"]To gavin:
Well, you kept saying that it depended upon their intentions. I guess the next logical question is, what do you think their intentions would be? Keep in mind that copping out by saying, "Oh, there is no way I could ever know!" is totally lame. [/FONT][/QUOTE]

[SIZE="1"]13th, no offense but asking me what I think the intentions of the extra-terrestrials that might visit this planet is obviously impossible to answer. Anything I say is based on pure [b]human[/b] speculation which of course runs completely counter to the term [B]alien[/B]. It could be anything realistically, and would again depend entirely on how they view us and our planet, i.e. allies/resources/trash/whatever.

It's not a cop-out, it's simply a question I cannot answer, unless of course you're implying I'm actually an alien sent here to observe mankind, in which case you are going to be probed for my amusement at some point in the future. :p[/SIZE]

[The13thMan]

[quote name='Gavin'][SIZE="1"]13th, no offense but asking me what I think the intentions of the extra-terrestrials that might visit this planet is obviously impossible to answer. Anything I say is based on pure [b]human[/b] speculation which of course runs completely counter to the term [B]alien[/B]. It could be anything realistically, and would again depend entirely on how they view us and our planet, i.e. allies/resources/trash/whatever.

It's not a cop-out, it's simply a question I cannot answer, unless of course you're implying I'm actually an alien sent here to observe mankind, in which case you are going to be probed for my amusement at some point in the future. :p[/SIZE][/QUOTE]

[FONT="Trebuchet MS"]I'll let you probe me if you let me probe you. ;D

The keyword in my question to you was "think." What do you [B]think [/B]their intentions would be? Whenever a person doesn't have an opinion on something it's usually simply because they haven't thought about it enough. The amount of information you have on the subject is (to a point) irrelevant.

But no, if you haven't got any opinion at all on it i don't want you to force one. I was just curious what you thought.

By the way, you're taking a very agnostic approach to this alien stuff. [/FONT]

[Gavin]

[quote name='The13thMan'][FONT="Trebuchet MS"]I'll let you probe me if you let me probe you. ;D[/FONT][/QUOTE]

[SIZE="1"]Moving swiftly onwards. :animesmil[/SIZE]

[quote name='The13thMan'][FONT="Trebuchet MS"]The keyword in my question to you was "think." What do you [B]think [/B]their intentions would be? Whenever a person doesn't have an opinion on something it's usually simply because they haven't thought about it enough. The amount of information you have on the subject is (to a point) irrelevant.

But no, if you haven't got any opinion at all on it i don't want you to force one. I was just curious what you thought.

By the way, you're taking a very agnostic approach to this alien stuff. [/FONT][/QUOTE]

[SIZE="1"]It's not that I haven't thought about it enough 13th, it's simply I don't feel that I could make any kind of reasonable guess at what extra-terrestrial intentions towards Earth would be. The fact is there's just too many factors to take into account.

I mean one could take the line, if they're advanced enough to have interplanetary travel capabilities, then they must be peaceful. But that's countered completely by the fact that the vast majority of human technological progress has been made in times of war, so that could equally imply that they might be a conquering power.

You also have the level of individuality in their society to take into account. For example if they are insect, or similarly derived, you're talking about a tiny minority of the population controlling the species to action, who would not have any consideration of humanity's individual rights before the welfare of the whole. Of course they could also be the complete opposite whereby you reach catastrophic levels of bureaucracy in trying to accomodate everyone's civil opinion on an issue, i.e. extreme democracy where literally everyone has a valid opinion.

Aging, religious, economic, gender, biological, technological factors could all equally play a valid role if we are to assume alien species have the same levels of individuality that humans demonstrate (as opposed to an insect hive).

As I said, I'm not dancing around the question, it's simply a case they could be anything at all. I would hope, and I'm afraid this is as close to an answer you're going to get from me, that any extra-terrestrials who visit Earth would be peaceful and interested in trade and cultural exchanges. My biggest fear would be in that situation that humanity in it's infinite wisdom would react with the same kind of fear of the unknown that it usually does and take hostile action because of xenophobia.

Oh, and could you explain what you meant by "agnostic" ? I believe they exist, I just don't know where or what they are.[/SIZE]

[The13thMan]

[quote name='Gavin'][SIZE="1"]Moving swiftly onwards. :animesmil[/SIZE][/quote]
Not too swiftly, i hope.

[quote=gavin]
[SIZE="1"]It's not that I haven't thought about it enough 13th, it's simply I don't feel that I could make any kind of reasonable guess at what extra-terrestrial intentions towards Earth would be. The fact is there's just too many factors to take into account.

I mean one could take the line, if they're advanced enough to have interplanetary travel capabilities, then they must be peaceful. But that's countered completely by the fact that the vast majority of human technological progress has been made in times of war, so that could equally imply that they might be a conquering power.

You also have the level of individuality in their society to take into account. For example if they are insect, or similarly derived, you're talking about a tiny minority of the population controlling the species to action, who would not have any consideration of humanity's individual rights before the welfare of the whole. Of course they could also be the complete opposite whereby you reach catastrophic levels of bureaucracy in trying to accomodate everyone's civil opinion on an issue, i.e. extreme democracy where literally everyone has a valid opinion.

Aging, religious, economic, gender, biological, technological factors could all equally play a valid role if we are to assume alien species have the same levels of individuality that humans demonstrate (as opposed to an insect hive).

As I said, I'm not dancing around the question, it's simply a case they could be anything at all. I would hope, and I'm afraid this is as close to an answer you're going to get from me, that any extra-terrestrials who visit Earth would be peaceful and interested in trade and cultural exchanges. My biggest fear would be in that situation that humanity in it's infinite wisdom would react with the same kind of fear of the unknown that it usually does and take hostile action because of xenophobia.

Oh, and could you explain what you meant by "agnostic" ? I believe they exist, I just don't know where or what they are.[/SIZE][/QUOTE]

[FONT="Trebuchet MS"]You must have read the Ender series. =D Or some similar sci-fi.

By agnostic i meant that you are saying that one cannot know what intention these aliens might have. Some agnostics believe that one cannot know whether god exists or not. That is what i meant by you are being rather agnostic on the matter. But even agnostics have some guess as to the existence of god, at least on a subconscious level. To not have any opinion at all seems inhuman.

I actually don't think people would be so frightened of aliens. Let me clarify. I think people on the whole will be afraid. I think the typical person will have some level of fear. But i also think that there are people out there that will consider alien contact to be incredibly exciting and will go forth with extreme curiosity and caution. I also think that those will be the people that will have any contact with aliens - the scientists.

As for your war = technology deal. I will say that you might be confusing correlation for causation. I don't think technology increased in times of war because people wanted to invent weapons to kill each other with. I think people wanted to create weapons to kill people with but could not on their own, so they let those that could create them create them. Once again, these were the scientists and engineers of the world. I don't think they created the technology they did for the sole purpose of killing men. [/FONT]

[nezzyjean]

I definitely believe in aliens. The universe is simply way too elephantine for us to even have the gall to assume that we're the only life forms occupying it.

I think they are also aware of us being here, but are significantly more advanced and look down on our race as if it were a joke. As for those stories about abductions, I think it's just alien teenagers who get bored so they jet across the galaxy to screw with some stupid, lowly earthlings...kind of the equivalent to us humans going cowtipping or something.

Because I have been watching too many alien movies lately, the idea that they might invade scares the living daylights out of me...but i'm sure if they come in peace, like gavin said, I would welcome them with open arms.

[Sabrina]

[FONT="Tahoma"][quote name='The13thMan][FONT="Trebuchet MS"']Whenever a person doesn't have an opinion on something it's usually simply because they haven't thought about it enough. The amount of information you have on the subject is (to a point) irrelevant. [/FONT][/quote]Or because they feel that the information out there is what's irrelevant. They've looked at it, for example in the case of aliens, and come to the conclusion that there isn't enough reliable information. It's too easy for your statements regarding aliens to be full of misconceptions.

So, naturally many of us are going to be vague on it because we prefer to not stick our foot in our mouths with statements of, it will be like this or I think it will be like that. In the end it's silly fun and nothing more, in my opinion.

Trying to force an opinion on someone, doesn't really work you know, since you're making the faulty assumption that they've not given it any thought. [/FONT]