Assassination attempt, first of many?

[Drizzt Do'urden]

With the recent thwarting of the recent white extremist plan to eventually attempt to assassinate president Obama, it made me think. With how many white extremist groups out there, including the skin heads (neo-nazi's), the KKK, and all other less prevalent groups.

Do you think this is the first [I]real[/I] assassination attempt? (Yes I know it was over for them before it got started) Do you think this is a reason America's not ready for a black president...though a great man said "He's only Half-Black America. Just vote for the white-half."

I'm going to be back on in an hour or so to post my opinions.

[TimeChaser]

I heard about this on NPR today.

The story was rather interesting; they said Obama's run for president has split, rather than cemented, the white supremacist movement. People might find this odd, but some racists will actually vote for Obama, because they think that if he fails as president it will incite the "race war" they keep hoping for.

But hey, the votes of nutjobs are as good an anyone's. ;)

I have no doubt, though, that this isn't the last we've heard of assassination attempts. :animesigh

[desertphoenix]

[COLOR="DarkRed"][FONT="Verdana"]I think that the fact that Obama has made it this far in the election alone shows that American is ready for a black president, or at least can have one. I'm not really to fond of the expression, "ready for a black president", but that's a different rant of mine.

I understand that the last successful presidential assassination was fairly recent; almost fifty years ago. I am honestly depressed when I personally see people's strong belief that Obama will be assassinated. Like right after the acceptance speech assassinated.There will always be racism, prejudice, and supremacy, but people need to understand how extreme the secret service can be as well. Yeah, there are going to be way more attempts, but honestly what kind of group of people or person is going to be able to pull it off successfully in this day and age?

On a side note, I have a fifty dollar bet in paper with a friend that Obama will live through his first term if elected:animesigh.[/FONT][/COLOR]

[James]

[quote]though a great man said "He's only Half-Black America. Just vote for the white-half."[/quote]

[font=franklin gothic medium]A great man? Hm. That quote is probably one of the more idiotic things I've read, to be honest. lol

I mean really, shouldn't the quote be "you're voting for a man and his ideas, not the colour of his skin"?

Anyway, my feeling about this is pretty simple. I think that there are still a few parts of America where biggotry is deeply-rooted even today. [i]Most[/i] people will probably just express their views with a vote and with words...but there are obviously a very small few who are extremists and who will try to take things further.

Unfortunately I think that Obama still faces a lot of opposition due to silly things like race, or his name, or the fact that he grew up in Indonesia. All ridiculous of course, but still prevalent in many minds.

This is why I do not think that it's guaranteed Obama will win. The polls are closing again now.

Yes, he's very popular in the polls and has been consistently. But let's not forget that a [i]lot[/i] of voters will be making the call on election day itself. And I wouldn't be surprised if many sat on the side of caution and voted for McCain, simply because he isn't black.

So I do think that racism still plays an ever-present role when it shouldn't.

As for assassinations in general...if Obama is elected I'm sure he's at higher risk than, say, McCain. But still, progress is progress - Obama is a worthy candidate and I'm sure he'd be a good president. He will (and has) been able to demonstrate that race shouldn't be an issue.[/font]

[Drizzt Do'urden]

[quote name='James'][font=franklin gothic medium]A great man? Hm. That quote is probably one of the more idiotic things I've read, to be honest. lol[/font][/QUOTE]

It was meant to be, its from David Alan Grier's new show on Comedy Central.

As far as how I feel on the subject, I do agree that Obama has broken the race barrier down. I run a small UPS hub, and I can say this debate has come up. Especially since this whole assassination attempt has come about.

Its amazing to see how when the race first came out, the few McCain supporters swore up and down that there would be no way they would vote for Obama if he won the primaries. Now those same people now are swearing by Obama, only one or two have come out and said they didn't like the idea of a black man in office, which I guess if Obama's message changed their minds then I'm happy for them, but it's sort've sad it was that way to begin with.

I myself will be voting Democrate for the first time in my life, which isn't saying much since this is only the second time I'll be voting in the National election, but I've always been an avid Republican, not that I have anything against McCain personally, but I'd like to see how Obama works with what he's given.

As far as the assassination attempts go, I do think that Obama is going to be high risk, VERY high risk. [quote name='desertphoenix'] Yeah, there are going to be way more attempts, but honestly what kind of group of people or person is going to be able to pull it off successfully in this day and age? [/quote]

That's a misconception, sure the secret service has acquired new technology as time has gone on. Adversley, however, those same people who want to commit those attrocities have gained better and better technology as well. Thanks to things like Google Earth (which I believe they shut down), and mapquest bad guys have access to programs that give satellite images. Just an address or GPS coordinates and with these sites and a portable GPS unit you can find just about anyone anywhere. Also weapons have gotten more sophisticated, Sniper rifles with the capabilities of hitting targets over half a mile away (I believe the longest shot I've heard of is 1200 yards)

I think its a def. possibility it could happen, though I doubt it will.

[SunfallE]

[COLOR="RoyalBlue"][FONT="Lucida Sans Unicode"]There's always someone who's unhappy with the current president so hearing about this sort of thing doesn't worry me too much. I'd love to see people be more mature about it, but I don't see that happening just yet. I'm sure that if he's elected, the government will be doing what's necessary to prevent anything like that from happening.

In the long run, I'm more worried about him actually winning. The other, having people attempt to kill you or pull some stupid stunt, seems to be pretty standard. Unfortunately. [/FONT][/COLOR]

[Korey]

[FONT="Franklin Gothic Medium"]It looks like your worries may come true Beth, as Obama was ahead in the most recent poll I saw. While I do find that people will tell you all sorts of stuff to influence your decision on voting for Obama (his name, his race, his college roomates, where he grew up...etc) it's ultimately up to you. I'm not a fan of McCain or his policies. He has almost unamiously supported any War on Terror Legislation or stance George W. Bush. Stay the Course isn't in my agenda.

Now onto the assassination attempt. If this actually does happen and Obama is assassinated, I would probably find it to be the most idiotic and socially backtracking thing this nation has done in forever. "Americans aren't ready for a Black President". Erm, what? The mayor of DC was a black man (I believe he's still there at present). Obama served on the Senate, which has far greater power than the President does at this point. Why aren't we saying "Obama is dedicated to domestic change, which we badly need right now in our own country" ?

But it seems we'd rather not vote for someone based on the merit of the character, but the color of their skin.[/FONT]

[Lunar]

[COLOR="Blue"]Well, being an African American myself,
there's certain people in America, who wouldn't like to have a black president. I mean, they would rather have America go down the drain than have a black president. I mean, people who say things like "we don't want a black ****** in our [I]White[/I] house."

As for the assassination attempt, there are many people who want to kill the current president, but if Obama becomes president, he will be at risk more so because of his race.
I pray that Obama doesn't get assissnated. I mean, America's been America long enough for people to get over their issues with another race, right?
I agree with Korey. Some people would rather ignore the fact of what someone's going to do for our country and vote for them because the color of their skin.
By now, we should be more than ready for a black president. Considering how much we are advancing in certain things, it makes sense that we should be ready for a president of a different race. At least, I hope so.[/COLOR]

[Gavin]

[quote name='Europa'][COLOR="Blue"]I mean, America's been America long enough for people to get over their issues with another race, right?[/COLOR][/QUOTE]

[SIZE="1"]Given that racism plagues cultures that are thousands of years old at this point, I think the length of time America and other nations have existed has little to do in reality with overcoming these kinds of social issues. Granted more strides have probably been made in the last fifty years on a global scale than in the preceeding five-hundred towards the elimination of racism.

As Korey said more people need to vote based on stances on issues and policies rather than skin colour, gender or creed. Killing a man because of such things is moronic, and believe me I'm Irish so I know how retarded it sounds to kill someone because of one aspect of their overall being.[/SIZE]

[Vicky]

[quote name='Drizzt Do'urden']WWith how many white extremist groups out there, including the skin heads (neo-nazi's), the KKK, and all other less prevalent groups.

[/QUOTE]

[size=1]Correction, just 'Neo-Nazis' on its own, unless you say Nazi Skinhead. The vast majority of skinheads are completely aware that it's a contradiction to be a [i]Nazi[/i] Skinhead (as the music that inspired the culture was derived from reggae and other forms of black music). I just had to shove that in somewhere XD.

I don't understand why his race would be a problem, or anything else about him that doesn't relate to his opinions. If America is not ready for a black president, so to speak, then it was never ready to call itself the world's super power.

But like it's been said some people will always dislike the leader and it's common place for them to find something to use as an excuse or attack. I don't know, but I get a very very gritty feeling that Obama may not last that long, and it may not even be up to the American people anyway. And I think I'll blame the Zeitgeist movie for this opinion >_<.

But if you want me to be really paranoid, then perhaps it's not the KKK or the Neo-Nazis behind this, perhaps its the fact that if the people get what they want, the men behind the curtain want rid... *scratches head*.[/size]

[Darren]

I saw a segment on CNN that not too long ago that was addressing this very subject. They interviewed a man from Alabama and he gave this quote:

"The only change I ever saw a black man make, was carrying a cup."

And my eyes bulged and I started think how that was the most ignorant thing I had ever heard. All the names of black civil rights activists began racing through my head, and I almost turned off the TV.

It just makes me glad that it's not prejudiced people like that who actually make the decision. (It's all in the electoral college's hands)

And wasn't there a conspiracy that Obama would be assassinated at the DNC??? So, I'm sure this is the first of many attempts. I actually heard that Obama already has the same number of secret service members as Bush does and it's going to double if he's elected. (For good reason)

Oh, I also heard a funny joke (although I disagree with it) The reason why Obama chose Biden to be his VP was because no one likes Biden and everyone would rather have Obama than Biden.

Or, if he's really the antichrist like everyone in the bible belt seems to think, he will be assassinated and come back to life. (But I'm atheist, so you already know my views on that theory. If it does happen though, I'll crap myself.)

[Lunar]

[quote name='Darren']

Or, if he's really the antichrist like[U] [B]everyone in the bible belt[/B][/U] seems to think, he will be assassinated and come back to life. (But I'm atheist, so you already know my views on that theory. If it does happen though, I'll crap myself.)[/QUOTE]

[COLOR="Blue"]
I find that extremely offending.............[/COLOR]

[Allamorph]

[quote name='Europa][QUOTE=Darren]Or, if he's really the antichrist [B][U]like everyone in the bible belt seems to think[/U][/B], he will be assassinated and come back to life. (But I'm atheist, so you already know my views on that theory. If it does happen though, I'll crap myself.)[/QUOTE][COLOR="Blue"']I find that offending.............[/COLOR][/quote]
[FONT=Arial]Likewise. I may have grown up in an environment where racism was practically general consensus, but that doesn't make me one.

And I [I]love[/I] the implications that the majority of Christians are racist.


The awkward part about the assassination subject is that while I find it deplorable to attempt to kill a man who hasn't even been given the chance to prove his mettle, I don't really see what good could come from talking about it for more than, say, five minutes. Not that I don't care if he gets killed, but there's really not a whole lot I can do about it unless I just so happen to overhear some idiot conspiring against him (or any of the candidates, for that matter) and can alert someone who [I]can[/I] do something.[/FONT]

[SunfallE]

[COLOR="RoyalBlue"][FONT="Lucida Sans Unicode"][quote name='Korey'][FONT="Franklin Gothic Medium"]It looks like your worries may come true Beth, as Obama was ahead in the most recent poll I saw. While I do find that people will tell you all sorts of stuff to influence your decision on voting for Obama (his name, his race, his college roomates, where he grew up...etc) it's ultimately up to you. I'm not a fan of McCain or his policies. He has almost unamiously supported any War on Terror Legislation or stance George W. Bush. Stay the Course isn't in my agenda.
[/FONT][/QUOTE]Hmmm, I guess I can see how my statement wasn't clear. I'm not worried about him becoming president, in fact he's who I'll be voting for. What I'm worried about is people deciding last minute to bail on the idea of voting for him. So I'm concerned that he will lose when I want him to win.

Guys, I think it's a given that when someone is referring to the Bible Belt, they're referring to those who are on the extreme side of things instead of every single Christian in general. Though I'd say using the word everyone was in poor taste Darren, since sweeping generalizations don't help anything you know. [/FONT][/COLOR]

[James]

[quote name='Korey'][FONT="Franklin Gothic Medium"]I'm not a fan of McCain or his policies. He has almost unamiously supported any War on Terror Legislation or stance George W. Bush. Stay the Course isn't in my agenda.[/quote]

[font=franklin gothic medium]Not to re-tread too much old ground, but it's worth pointing out that McCain and Bush are very different people. In fact, McCain can't stand Bush at all, lol.

Not only did McCain reject at least one of Bush's budgets, but he frequently campaigned to change the strategy in Iraq because the previous strategy was failing. The largely successful troop surge was heavily influenced by McCain's constant badgering of Bush as well as his harsh criticisms of Donald Rumsfeld.

If you have seen the Senate hearings where Rumsfeld was being questioned, McCain was probably the most aggressive critic and demanded answers.

So just for the sake of fairness - since there seems to be a perception that McCain and Bush are one in the same generally - I thought I'd point that out.

This is partially why a [i]lot[/i] of conservatives have been anti-McCain. He's never really been considered a "real Republican" by the right wing of the party.[/font]
[quote]
But it seems we'd rather not vote for someone based on the merit of the character, but the color of their skin.[/FONT][/QUOTE]

[font=franklin gothic medium]Yeah, I think Hillary had a similar issue but related to gender.

I think it's a shame that so much is placed on personality or image, as opposed to actual positions/results. I guess personality is relevant, but image? Hm. It's probably not as relevant as what the candidate actually believes or what positions they take.

I mean I'd rather have a national leader who I may not [i]personally[/i] like, but who is intelligent and runs the country well...versus someone I really like personally, but who has no idea what they are doing.[/font]

[ChibiHorsewoman]

[quote name='Drizzt Do'urden']Do you think this is a reason America's not ready for a black president...though a great man said "He's only Half-Black America. Just vote for the white-half."
[/QUOTE]

[color=#9933ff]But I wanted to vote for the beige half! If I can't have that then dammit all I'm not voting.

Okay stupid random outbursts aside I think that this kind of thing is bound to happen because the United States is still filled with idiots who think that anyone who is a minority or has different beliefs ought to be hanged. It's a sad fact of life, but unfortunately we don't live in a utopian society where everyone gets along so something like this will happen sooner or later. The good thing is that these people were caught and since it isn't the 60's they will be tried with a federal offense of trying to kill a presidential nominee.

The story I read in my news paper (which was in the very back of the global news section) was that they were going to kill eighty-eight people beheading fourteen of them because fourteen and eighty-eight are important numbers in the Neo Nazi movement. I don't know why, maybe if we still had that white supremisist member from two years ago he could 'enlighten' us.

I don't know why we're so focused on race, or sex or religion (Case in point a few rumors going around that Obama is a Muslim) Would it make any difference if the guy was Atheist, Gay? Transgendered? Do those things really make you a better or worse president? A better or worse leader? History proves that this is not the case, so why are we as Americans who are supposed to be citizens of the most accepting free country making such a big deal about it?[/color]

[James]

[font=franklin gothic medium]Speaking of presidential qualities, I highly recommend [url="http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24572802-7583,00.html"]this article[/url] in The Australian. It's called "Big-ideas men not the best leaders" and it's written by Daniel Finkelstein.

It's a really interesting piece about what is called the "availability error" and how big speeches, reforms, wars, etc... rate far more highly for most people than the quiet achievers who manage government through consensus and negotiation.

It also covers the idea of a decision and an outcome not being inter-related at all times.

Very interesting read, especially related to some of the phenomena we've been seeing in this election campaign.[/font]

[Darren]

[quote name='Allamorph'][FONT=Arial]And I [I]love[/I] the implications that the majority of Christians are racist.[/FONT][/QUOTE]
Did not mean to offend anybody, but how does that imply christians are racist? I didn't imply that at all.

I mean, for the most part, my family is racist... And they're all christians. And everyone I know who lives in small uneducated towns in Arkansas and Oklahoma, (Which is in the bible belt) think Obama's the antichrist. But it's not because he's black. I guess the "Everyone" statement is a hyperbole, but surely you didn't think I meant every single person. After all, I live here and I think the exact opposite of most of my peer group and family. Sorry, get over it.

It's an opinion based on my personal observations. That's what the lounge is for.

[Nathan]

[FONT="Arial"]Well I'm sure it won't be the last, especially if he is elected next week. I certainly don't see a real issue with it though. I don't see racism disappearing anytime soon so I'm of the opinion that the possibility of an another attempt shouldn't even matter.

I certainly hope one doesn't succeed though, otherwise, that's going to make the US look very, very stupid. Not that we don't already at times (and no I'm not really going to go there) I just hate looking that way more than... [/FONT]