Death Penalty

[itsoverninek]

wasn't this thread about the death penalty? when did we get on this tangent about whether animals are people or not? lol weird

[Korey]

[quote name='itsoverninek']wasn't this thread about the death penalty? when did we get on this tangent about whether animals are people or not? lol weird[/QUOTE]

[FONT="Franklin Gothic Medium"][COLOR="Indigo"]Because the natural course of human discussion may bring up multiple facets about the topic that's being discussed. We're not talking about animals are people, but rather how certain ethnicities had been considered "Animals" by other ethnicities in racially divided times. Please refrain from backseat modding and trying to bring the topic back on track without fully reading the posts.

~~~~~~~

Anyways, to bring up ChibiHorseWoman's point, the offender in this case couldn't be tried as an adult because he's under the legal age in most states. I don't know New York law, but here in Texas it's 15. Now the question really is how [B][I]IS[/I][/B] he going to be punished because he committed this crime in cold blood, without regard to human life. So the punishment would probably be the worst he could get with the death penalty off the table, because he's a minor. Regardless of past criminal activity, the bad tendency test was struck down a long time ago. So it's hard to say "Well he's been a criminal in the past, so let's execute him to stop the bleeding now." I personally live with the fact that some people are beyond redemption and will continue to do bad things regardless of any attempts to correct that behavior, but executing someone on the basis of prior criminal history, especially if the prior arrests were non-murder related charges is rather barbaric in my opinion.[/COLOR][/FONT]

[AbbeyLiz]

Rachmaninoff, I feel you're being quite offensive.. almost saying that my way of thinking is childish..?
If you think Ishmael is a work of fiction (indeed it is) and that people shouldn't really listen to it then what can you tell me about the Bible? Is the Bible not fiction? Only because Catholics read and believe it doesn't make it real, it doesn't make it anymore real to me.

And who said I'm trying to convince someone of something? I intentionally stated that I understand people's ways of thinking for the purpose that I would not be coming off that I want to change anyone. My intentions are not to change, but possibly enlighten. If you don't wish to listen to my "enlightenment" then don't listen to it. I, honestly, enjoy hearing other's opinions and like being "enlightened".

What I'm really getting at, is that one life isn't superior to another one. If you kill a bug it is still killing a life. A life is a life, in my opinion.

If your thoughts differ..please do tell :]

[yuuki desu]

[COLOR="DarkOrchid"]tbh....i dont agree with the death penelty but i can see its use
for a start it does work as a deterent....so hopefully less people would commit less major crimes (well thats the theory anywayz)
it does also clear up prisons
BUT i do view it as murder and i cant justify murder pretty much ever
and there is the potential of killing an innocent person (its happened in the past and its not like you can revive the person and go oops sorry about that)...and yes i do know that they cant sentance to someone to death without unarguable evidence
and then theres the whole idea is it better to make them suffer by making them live for the rest of their lives with the knowledge of their actions or just to cut their life short
^^; heh sorry i do philosophy at school and couldnt resist getting into the debate[/COLOR]

[Korey]

[quote name='AbbeyLiz']Rachmaninoff, I feel you're being quite offensive.. almost saying that my way of thinking is childish..?[/quote]

[FONT="Franklin Gothic Medium"][COLOR="Indigo"]You say tomato.....

It all depends on how you read Rach's post and how you interpret it. It would also depend on the maturity and age of the person reading it. I didn't see anything besides Rach stating his opinion (which he's allowed to have, btw). You can feel free to disagree with it. Rach doesn't have to believe what you want, nor does he have to be nice in the way he disagrees with you. He's not calling you childish, nor does he imply it. He thinks your way of thinking is silly, end of story.[/COLOR][/FONT]

[quote name=' AbbeyLiz']If you think Ishmael is a work of fiction (indeed it is) and that people shouldn't really listen to it then what can you tell me about the Bible? Is the Bible not fiction? Only because Catholics read and believe it doesn't make it real, it doesn't make it anymore real to me.[/quote]
[FONT="Franklin Gothic Medium"][COLOR="Indigo"]
The Bible may or may not be fiction, it all depends on what you choose to believe in. It's also not just Catholics that follow the words in the Bible. There's Protestants, Lutherans, Methodists, Presbyterians...etc. You're certainly entitled to believe what you want though.
[/COLOR][/FONT]

[quote name=' AbbeyLiz']And who said I'm trying to convince someone of something? I intentionally stated that I understand people's ways of thinking for the purpose that I would not be coming off that I want to change anyone. My intentions are not to change, but possibly enlighten. If you don't wish to listen to my "enlightenment" then don't listen to it. I, honestly, enjoy hearing other's opinions and like being "enlightened".[/quote]

[FONT="Franklin Gothic Medium"][COLOR="Indigo"]Then why try to justify it? If you understand that people are capable of having a different opinion, then don't worry if they post accordingly.Your views are certainly welcome here and we encourage members to post their own ideas up, but don't be offended if someone decides to question your way of thinking or think lowly of it. Trust me, there are worse members than Rach (no offense Rach) that could have blown your post to smithereens in a not as friendly way.[/COLOR][/FONT]

[quote name=' AbbeyLiz']What I'm really getting at, is that one life isn't superior to another one. If you kill a bug it is still killing a life. A life is a life, in my opinion. [/quote]

[FONT="Franklin Gothic Medium"][COLOR="Indigo"]Well, if your dog was vicious and killed many animals, would you put him on Death Row? Obviously not, and obviously that's a bit of a stretch, but I think that as the Human race we hold oursevles to a higher ethical standpoint than that of an animal. It's practically a given that animals will kill each other. Rules of the game they play, sadly. However, to hold something like a human's life, where humans are able to reason, is a different ball game than an animal who kills because they want to eat. It's apples and oranges really.
[/COLOR][/FONT]

[quote name=' AbbeyLiz']If your thoughts differ..please do tell :][/quote]
[FONT="Franklin Gothic Medium"][COLOR="Indigo"]
Done ANNNNNNNNNNNNND done.[/COLOR][/FONT]

[Raiha]

[COLOR="DarkOrchid"][FONT="Times New Roman"]I'm not sure which Bible you are referring to here and exactly how you think it's applicable, but I have to tell you. There is no book of Ishmael in the Bible. Sorry.

There's a character NAMED Ishmael in the Bible but he didn't get a book named after him.[/FONT][/COLOR]

[Rachmaninoff]

[quote name='AbbeyLiz]Rachmaninoff, I feel you're being quite offensive.. almost saying that my way of thinking is childish..?[/QUOTE]I think the word you're looking for is idealistic. You're views, in my opinion, are idealistic instead of factual.[QUOTE=AbbeyLiz]If you think Ishmael is a work of fiction (indeed it is) and that people shouldn't really listen to it then what can you tell me about the Bible? Is the Bible not fiction? Only because Catholics read and believe it doesn't make it real, it doesn't make it anymore real to me.[/QUOTE]Okay, again you're making the same mistake as before. Ishmael is a work of fiction. I didn't say people shouldn't listen to it, I said it shouldn't be taken as factual when it's not. Also, bringing the bible into this is a mistake. For one thing I, along with many people, are not religious and don't use a book like that to help determine how we think or act. From that standpoint I could say it's fiction, but that opens up a can of worms that goes a bit too far off topic here so I'm going to leave it at that.[QUOTE=AbbeyLiz]And who said I'm trying to convince someone of something? I intentionally stated that I understand people's ways of thinking for the purpose that I would not be coming off that I want to change anyone. My intentions are not to change, but possibly enlighten. If you don't wish to listen to my "enlightenment" then don't listen to it. I, honestly, enjoy hearing other's opinions and like being "enlightened".[/QUOTE]And who's to say that my purpose is not the same? Obviously we do not agree, but if I wish to counter with what I think in an attempt to possible enlighten you, you certainly don't have to listen to it. But it is my opinion and just as you are entitled to yours, I am entitled to mine.[QUOTE=AbbeyLiz]What I'm really getting at, is that one life isn't superior to another one. If you kill a bug it is still killing a life. A life is a life, in my opinion.[/QUOTE]That's straightforward enough. I don't really agree with it, but it's still to the point.[QUOTE=AbbeyLiz']If your thoughts differ..please do tell :][/quote]You know, that [I]is[/I] what I did with my last post. Just saying.[QUOTE=Raiha][COLOR="DarkOrchid"][FONT="Times New Roman"]I'm not sure which Bible you are referring to here and exactly how you think it's applicable, but I have to tell you. There is no book of Ishmael in the Bible. Sorry.

There's a character NAMED Ishmael in the Bible but he didn't get a book named after him.[/FONT][/COLOR][/QUOTE]I believe they are referring to this Raiha: [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ishmael_(novel)"][U]Ishmael[/U][/URL] It's just a work of fiction.

[AbbeyLiz]

No offense, but I think trying to justify myself on the internet is nearly impossible. I'm not sure if its the way I'm wording my things or the way people interpret it or whatever, but I apparently can't do it. haha

Thank you guys for expressing your views, but I'm just going to end it there because I don't feel like trying to talk. haha

Anyways, have fun. :]

[Allamorph]

[quote name='AbbeyLiz']No offense, but I think trying to justify myself on the internet is nearly impossible.[/quote]
[FONT=Arial]Never stopped me.

And also no offense, but it's not. It's easier than doing so in real life, in fact, since you can devote much more time to your own thoughts and reasonings and justifications than you can in conversation.

But eh. My lines have been drawn earlier in the thread. So.[/FONT]

[AbbeyLiz]

[quote name='Allamorph'][FONT=Arial]Never stopped me.

And also no offense, but it's not. It's easier than doing so in real life, in fact, since you can devote much more time to your own thoughts and reasonings and justifications than you can in conversation.

But eh. My lines have been drawn earlier in the thread. So.[/FONT][/QUOTE]

Well, to each his own I guess. But for me personally, I can get what I want to say across so much easier in person.