Gaming The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword

[Petie]

[quote name='Katie!' timestamp='1322156811' post='710328']
I'm thoroughly enjoying it so far, it's the first RPG I've played on a Wii (unless story mode in Brawl counts) so using the Nunchuck has taken a bit of time to get used to using. My dad is enjoying laughing at me as I swing my Wiimote and Nunchuck around to attack things.
[/quote]
[color="#0000ff"]Yeah, especially if you're not used to the controls yet, this can be pretty amusing to watch :)[/color]

[color="#0000ff"]-------------------------[/color]

[color="#0000ff"]As for me, I am just about to the second temple. I'm at the front door and just need to unlock it now but that's all I could get up to before we left for my aunt's house for Thanksgiving dinner. Overall though, I'm really enjoying the game though I do agree with Des that, considering the focus on Wii MotionPlus, there could be a bit more combat. I'm not really taking that as a complaint though because it hasn't detracted from the game for me - it would just add to it if there was more to fight.[/color]

[Katie!]

[quote name='Petie' timestamp='1322165610' post='710330']
[color="#0000ff"]Yeah, especially if you're not used to the controls yet, this can be pretty amusing to watch :)[/color]

[color="#0000ff"]-------------------------[/color]

[color="#0000ff"]As for me, I am just about to the second temple. I'm at the front door and just need to unlock it now but that's all I could get up to before we left for my aunt's house for Thanksgiving dinner. Overall though, I'm really enjoying the game though I do agree with Des that, considering the focus on Wii MotionPlus, there could be a bit more combat. I'm not really taking that as a complaint though because it hasn't detracted from the game for me - it would just add to it if there was more to fight.[/color]
[/quote]

I'm fine with the lack of combat for now, since whenever I see something come into my screen, my mind enters panic mode and I start wailing the controllers everywhere. It's really effective?

[Desbreko]

[color=#4B0082]Yeah, don't get me wrong; the game's still been fun. It just starts off slower than other Zelda games.

It looks like the combat is picking up in the second dungeon now, too. I've only gotten part way through it â?? yay for save points inside dungeons â?? but I've fought several Lizalfos and they're much more fun than anything else I've encountered so far. Though ironically, the motion+ control doesn't actually play much part in fighting them. They can block your sword with their shield, sure, but most of the time they'll just autododge if you swing at them from a direction they're not protected. By far, the easiest way to hit them is to just swing at them a few times until you see their attack animation begin, backflip away to dodge, and counter while their guard is down after the attack. This is actually really similar to how you fight them in OoT, just a little more complicated and requiring faster reflexes. I managed to land jump attack + fatal blow combos on all of them I fought by doing that.[/color]

[Petie]

[quote name='Desbreko' timestamp='1322169501' post='710334']
[color="#4B0082"]Yeah, don't get me wrong; the game's still been fun. It just starts off slower than other Zelda games.
[/color][/quote]
[color="#0000ff"]Yeah, I felt the same way. The beginning was extremely slow but I can understand why too. They need to introduce new players to some Zelda standards and all players to the new controls. The game definitely picks up after that and I'm now definitely looking forward to starting this second temple.[/color]

[The Spectacular Professor]

[quote name='Desbreko' timestamp='1322169501' post='710334']
[color=#4B0082]Yeah, don't get me wrong; the game's still been fun. It just starts off slower than other Zelda games.

It looks like the combat is picking up in the second dungeon now, too. I've only gotten part way through it â?? yay for save points inside dungeons â?? but I've fought several Lizalfos and they're much more fun than anything else I've encountered so far. Though ironically, the motion+ control doesn't actually play much part in fighting them. They can block your sword with their shield, sure, but most of the time they'll just autododge if you swing at them from a direction they're not protected. By far, the easiest way to hit them is to just swing at them a few times until you see their attack animation begin, backflip away to dodge, and counter while their guard is down after the attack. This is actually really similar to how you fight them in OoT, just a little more complicated and requiring faster reflexes. I managed to land jump attack + fatal blow combos on all of them I fought by doing that.[/color]
[/quote]
[font="Comic Sans MS"]Lizalfos are actually what taught me to use the shield properly. A well-timed block knocks your opponent off-guard and gives you plenty of time to lay into them. Most enemies have tells before they attack which allow you to time it right, so figuring those out is often the easiest way to deal with some enemies. Lizalfos specifically have that sweeping tail attack that's especially easy to time a block on because of how long it takes for them to set it up.

Other enemies are a bit trickier with this. Stalfos tend to alternate between leaving obvious openings and trying to slice you somewhat quickly, so shield bashing is a bit tougher to pull off sometimes.

One more quick tip; Skulltulas are a massive pain to fight while they're still dangling, so the easiest method I've found is to use the beetle to cut them down, then do a vertical upwards spin attack (flips them over every single time) followed by a finishing blow.

I just finished the fourth dungeon myself and from a few quick message board browses, I feel like I'm the only one who likes Fi. Granted, she does tend to pop out at you once or twice in annoying moments, but those are pretty rare and I'm actually pretty fond of her whole robot girl manner of speech.[/font]

[James]

[font=palatino linotype]I've been following what you guys have been saying really closely. I'm [i]hopefully[/i] going to be picking up Zelda today, if the store where I preordered is open long enough! We shall see.

It does sound like the initial stages of the game are going to be a bit of a chore, but I'm hoping that once it's over, the rest of the game is actually reasonably large.

I'm also very curious to know something specific about [i]Skyward Sword:[/i] do you guys find that it's uncomfortable to play for too long or anything?

Basically I'm thinking about this because some comments from players around the 'net have sort of suggested that it can be a bit tiring to keep having to wave your arm around all the time, for long periods. With something like [i]Wii Sports[/i], you might only play for half an hour - but obviously with [i]Skyward Sword[/i], longer play sessions are likely.

Is this a game where you can comfortably sit down and do smaller wrist movements? Or does it really work better if you're behaving as though you're actually holding the sword?

I'm very curious about that. [/font]

[Petie]

[color="#0000ff"]I sort of alternate between sitting and standing but for the most part, use somewhat smaller motions regardless. So yes, it's entirely possible to play the game from a sitting position using small flicks instead of full out swings. That said, I find it a bit easier to handle some of the more intricate stuff while standing (though I'm still not flailing the controllers).[/color]

[James]

[quote name='Petie' timestamp='1322194042' post='710340']
[color="#0000ff"]I sort of alternate between sitting and standing but for the most part, use somewhat smaller motions regardless. So yes, it's entirely possible to play the game from a sitting position using small flicks instead of full out swings. That said, I find it a bit easier to handle some of the more intricate stuff while standing (though I'm still not flailing the controllers).[/color]
[/quote]

[font=palatino linotype]Cool. That sounds good. I have a feeling that when I fight bosses, I'm going to be standing... haha.

My other problem is that I just moved my TV and it's now in an akward spot... it's kind of a bit too high if I'm sitting down - just slightly too high. Should be OK, but I definitely want to have the best experience possible.

Life is going to get very insular soon. Between [i]Skyrim[/i] and [i]Skyward Sword[/i], I'm going to be in trouble. And I'm trying not to even think about [i]Super Mario 3D Land[/i] just yet...[/font]

[Desbreko]

[color=#4B0082]I've been playing the game entirely while sitting and it's worked fine. But then, my chair doesn't have arm rests to get in the way, so that makes it easier. I wouldn't want to play in a chair with arms rests, since stuff like looking or aiming downwards or rolling bombs, where the remote needs to be pointed downwards at a steep angle, is really hard if you can't hang your arm down by your side.

Your movements have to be bigger than what you could get away with in Twilight Princess, where even tiny flicks of the wrist would make Link swing, but not by a whole lot. You can still get by entirely on wrist movement for sword control.

In my first play session, I clocked about six hours and my wrist was a bit tired afterward, but it didn't hurt at all. In fact, I didn't really notice until I went to work that evening and using the feather duster required more effort than usual. :p But a lot of that initial play time was just spent running around Skyloft for the intro section, so it wasn't full of action.

And oh yeah, I have a shield, don't I? I've kept it disequipped all through Eldin Province because I didn't want to get ambushed by some random Fire Keese and have it burnt up. [/color]

[Petie]

[quote name='Desbreko' timestamp='1322204618' post='710349']
[color="#4B0082"]And oh yeah, I have a shield, don't I? I've kept it disequipped all through Eldin Province because I didn't want to get ambushed by some random Fire Keese and have it burnt up. [/color]
[/quote]
[color="#0000ff"]You can get an iron shield now that you're there :)[/color]

[Katie!]

[quote name='James' timestamp='1322191718' post='710339']
[font=palatino linotype]

Is this a game where you can comfortably sit down and do smaller wrist movements? Or does it really work better if you're behaving as though you're actually holding the sword?

I'm very curious about that. [/font]
[/quote]

I usually stay sitting for running around and minor combat but usually, whenever I enter combat, it's a lot easier to jump up and start swinging it around, mostly because I'm very graceful with my flailing of the Wii mote.

[Desbreko]

[quote name='Petie' timestamp='1322233165' post='710350'][color="#0000ff"]You can get an iron shield now that you're there :)[/color][/quote]
[color=#4B0082]I noticed that in the shop... after I got back from beating the Earth Temple. So I bought one, upgraded it once, and took it out to Lanayru Desert. Suddenly, enemies with electric attacks. orz But I have a fully upgraded wooden shield going into the Lanayru Mining Facility now.

Of course, I tried using my shield on other Lizalfos in the Earth Temple and found myself getting hit more often than if I just dodged, so I didn't end up using it in there anyway.[/color]

[Petie]

[color="#0000ff"]Yeah, I gave up on shield bashing them as well. Found it much easier to dodge, jump attack, and fatal blow.[/color]

[Katie!]

Would it be a waste to upgrade my shield if I'm still in Faron Woods? Just wondering if something better would be coming along shortly and if it'd be a waste of mats if that's the case.

[Petie]

[color="#0000ff"]Upgrading is always worth it when you can do it. That's all those items are for anyway. You won't need your wooden shield for the next area (don't follow in Des' footsteps and make sure you pick up your iron shield before you go) but you'll need the wooden shield again later so having it up to date early definitely can't hurt.[/color]

[Ellerby]

[quote name='The Professor' timestamp='1322182330' post='710338']
[font="Comic Sans MS"]Lizalfos are actually what taught me to use the shield properly. A well-timed block knocks your opponent off-guard and gives you plenty of time to lay into them. [/font]
[/quote]
[color="#696969"][font="Tahoma"]O_o Really? The [spoiler]sparring trainer[/spoiler] (not really a spoiler but meh) at the beginning of the game taught me that. In fact he said almost the exact same thing... "a well-timed block knocks your opponent off-guard etc." You practice it on the swinging log after he teaches you. I guess you didn't check with him after you got your shield. :P I'm only at the entrance of the first dungeon now so I guess when I eventually fight these Lizalfo things I'll be well prepared, heh. ^_^;

As for my 2 cents on what I've played thus far, there's only a few things I wish to add that hasn't already been talked about in detail. One is the beginning. It really wasn't that long (2 and a half hours flew by for me) so unless I'm not quite as close to the first dungeon as I think I am, it won't be a [i]chore[/i] to play the introduction. In fact, this is the first Zelda game to really capture me story-wise and it was thanks to the "long" introduction (TP's dark tone bored me and Windwaker's tiny island felt too cramped IMO). It reminded me of wandering around Kokiri Forest the first time in OoT without having to worry about some great destiny right away, just casually figuring out the controls, meeting new characters and exploring the town. By the time I was ready to leave, the time had come. That being said it probably helps that I'm a big animal lover. :P

Second I just want to touch on the controls topic. Or rather seating positioning. I've got my TV on a dresser at the end of my bed, and it's kind of raised so even though I have my sensor bar at the bottom, it's still a bit awkward to aim downwards (especially during the flight parts) and I kept having to raise my Wii Remote quite a bit in order to aim properly on screen. It was only slightly annoying at first, but after an hour or 2 it really started bothering me. I eventually gave up on sitting on my bed, turned my TV to the right, and am now playing sitting in my computer chair... and it's made a [i]world[/i] of a difference.

So my suggestion for when you start playing is just to make sure that when you sit down, you have at least a little bit of room below you to aim the Wii Remote downwards and that you don't need to lift the remote in order to aim at the screen. This may seem like Wii Basics 101, but I haven't needed to do anything like this since Twilight Princess so I'd forgotten. ^^; Here's a [b]horrible[/b] picture to show you the difference: [url=http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/6105/lolzelda.png]clicky[/url].

All in all, I'm loving this game so far. ^^[/font][/color] Edited November 27, 2011 by Happy

[Desbreko]

[color=#4B0082]You don't actually need to point the remote at the screen for aiming. Except for the initial motion+ calibration where it makes you point at the center of the screen, or if you recalibrate from the pause menu, the game doesn't seem to use the sensor bar at all. All aiming is done through controller movement with the motion+, so you can be pointing completely away from the screen and it still works. And if you shift the position of the remote and the aiming becomes awkward, you can just recenter it with down on the d-pad.[/color]

[Petie]

[quote name='Desbreko' timestamp='1322424163' post='710374']
[color="#4B0082"]You don't actually need to point the remote at the screen for aiming. Except for the initial motion+ calibration where it makes you point at the center of the screen, or if you recalibrate from the pause menu, the game doesn't seem to use the sensor bar at all. All aiming is done through controller movement with the motion+, so you can be pointing completely away from the screen and it still works. And if you shift the position of the remote and the aiming becomes awkward, you can just recenter it with down on the d-pad.[/color]
[/quote]
[color="#0000ff"]Ah, I didn't know that but it would certainly explain why pointer movement is sluggish when compared to movement on the Wii menu or on a game that does use the sensor bar.[/color]

[Ellerby]

[quote name='Desbreko' timestamp='1322424163' post='710374']
[color=#4B0082]You don't actually need to point the remote at the screen for aiming. Except for the initial motion+ calibration where it makes you point at the center of the screen, or if you recalibrate from the pause menu, the game doesn't seem to use the sensor bar at all. All aiming is done through controller movement with the motion+, so you can be pointing completely away from the screen and it still works. And if you shift the position of the remote and the aiming becomes awkward, you can just recenter it with down on the d-pad.[/color]
[/quote]

[color="#696969"][font="Tahoma"]Aah, that [i]does[/i] make sense. That actually explains my problem then. I was resting my hands on my legs because of how low I was sitting, so in order to properly aim I had to akwardly raise my hands and recenter it almost every single time I wanted to do something. But while sitting in the chair, my hands are already in the perfect position so I don't need to adjust at all. ^^[/font][/color]

[quote name='Petie' timestamp='1322424316' post='710375']
[color="#0000ff"]Ah, I didn't know that but it would certainly explain why pointer movement is sluggish when compared to movement on the Wii menu or on a game that does use the sensor bar.[/color]
[/quote]
[color="#696969"][font="Tahoma"]Yesss, I noticed this as well. I'm wondering if there's a way to change the sensitivity of it like I would on my mouse.[/font][/color] Edited November 27, 2011 by Happy

[James]

[font=palatino linotype]I picked this up on Friday and I've had the chance to play a little bit over the weekend. I only just reached the Earth Temple.

It's hard to really draw any major conclusions at this point, but I kind of feel like Nintendo achieved a better puzzle/combat balance with this Zelda. That is to say, the puzzles seem to be a bit less obtuse (and less difficult/frustrating as a result), but they are still challenging and logical. And they are generally pretty good fun, which was not always the case with puzzles in previous Zeldas, I think.

And on the other side of the coin, I'm really pleased with the combat, in the sense that it's much more front-and-center in this game than in previous Zeldas. I read somewhere that the combat is not [i]difficult[/i] but it is [i]challenging[/i]. I agree with this. It's not so much that you lose lives fighting (it took me a while to beat the first boss, for example, but thanks to the abundance of hearts in jars I never died). But although I didn't die, I still found the fight challenging and stimulating - it kept me on my toes, I had to really pay attention, and I was on the edge of my seat throughout.

So there's this whole sense of added nuance with the combat that I am really apprecating. I definitely think it feels better than the combat in any previous Zelda game.

I really have to agree with Des about the game's opening, though. Honestly, it felt a little torturous at times, haha. It just lasts way, way too long. And there are giant mountains of text to flick through.

I've never been someone who cares either way about voice acting in a Zelda game, but the mountains upon mountains of texts and prompts at the beginning of [i]Skyward Sword[/i] are painful. I get the feeling that all this text exists in part to ease in people who are new to Zelda, but honestly, I think it could end up turning new players away. For those of us who know how awesome Zelda can be, we tend to be prepared to wade through it to get to the good stuff - but if you've never played a Zelda game in your life, I can't imagine you'll bother putting up with it all (unless you're somehow really engrossed by the early story, which I can't imagine being the case for many people).

Luckily things really do pick up after that (thank god), but I do find [b]Fi's[/b] constant interjections and pearls of "wisdom" to be pretty irritating. Even if you ask for advice, you tend to get only the most broad and generic comments, which relate to things you already know. I don't feel that the system works terribly well, at least so far.

Having said that, [spoiler]I adore the moment where you first meet Fi and you have to follow her at night - the music is wonderful[/spoiler]. That was really the first moment in the game where I felt like something special was in store.

In general, I'm loving the very different world layout, too. Although there are still defined start and end points for temples, I'm enjoying the fact that the areas surrounding the temples are themselves rich with puzzles and exploration. For me this is one of the most refreshing things about [i]Skyward Sword's[/i] approach.

I'd be lying if I said that it was not a little jarring to go from [i]Skyrim[/i] on a nice big, HD screen to [i]Skyward Sword[/i] - it did take a moment to adjust. But I have to admit that I'm developing a real affection for the art style. Skyloft is much more interesting than Clock Town was, I think (although I can't say that it beats Hyrule proper), but the surface areas are pretty awesome generally. I really loved the art style in the first temple, as well (and so far, the Earth Temple is looking pretty striking, too).

In some ways, I think this really feels like the most accomplished art direction for a Zelda game. I'm enjoying it much, much more than the relatively drab palette of [i]Twilight Princess[/i]. Despite its increased vividness, it still has moments of darkness and mystery - it just works really well I think.

I have to say, my biggest overall gripe with [i]Skyward Sword[/i] has nothing to do with the game itself - it's that damn Wii MotionPlus! I mean, it generally works beautifully - I really do love the sword control - but I'm finding that I need to re-center the controller relatively often. That I have to re-center it at all is sort of annoying.

It's not a game-breaker or anything - I can live with it - but it feels a little unpolished in that sense. A little un-Nintendo. It's sort of mildly disappointing.

Anyway, now that I'm just a little further in, I'm really loving the game more and more. Some parts of it feel a tad archaic (especially the overall story presentation, at least so far), but I am really thoroughly enjoying the overall experience. At the very least, I'm already enjoying [i]Skyward Sword[/i] more than [i]Twilight Princess[/i] I think. We'll see whether or not it'll become my favourite 3D Zelda (which is a pretty big call, thanks to [i]Majora's Mask[/i]).[/font]

[Desbreko]

[color=#4B0082]So, anyone else finding that skyward strikes are incredibly easy to abuse? I beat the third dungeon boss without getting hit earlier, and while I did avoid a few attacks with nicely timed dodges, I mostly just spammed skyward strikes for the first part of the fight. Not only do they let you keep your distance, they're also a lot easier to hit with when you need to swing in those tricky diagonal angles.

Still, despite completely owning the thing, that boss was the most fun of the three so far. It felt like a classic 2D Zelda boss where you have to both attack and defend at the same time instead of the same old stun-and-slash pattern nearly every other 3D Zelda boss uses. I hope to see more like it.

Also, I found [url="http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/9683/tingledoll.jpg"]this little Easter egg[/url]. [/color]

[The Spectacular Professor]

[font="Comic Sans MS"]I just finished the game.

I am deeply satisfied with where my seventy dollars went. There's nothing more to say except good job, Nintendo. I think it's safe to call this one the absolute best thing the Wii has going for it. Not sure where it fits on my Zelda rankings, but it's certainly the finest Wii game I've ever played.[/font] Edited November 29, 2011 by The Professor

[James]

[quote name='Desbreko' timestamp='1322478610' post='710381']
[color=#4B0082]So, anyone else finding that skyward strikes are incredibly easy to abuse? I beat the third dungeon boss without getting hit earlier, and while I did avoid a few attacks with nicely timed dodges, I mostly just spammed skyward strikes for the first part of the fight. Not only do they let you keep your distance, they're also a lot easier to hit with when you need to swing in those tricky diagonal angles.
[/color]
[/quote]

[font=palatino linotype]I'm not very far in, but I haven't really found that I can abuse skyward strikes very much. When used on most enemies, they are simply blocked. I find that, generally, even regular enemies require a degree of patience that negates "spamming" (although I know that it's still possible to "spam" an enemy if you really want to). But playing the game that way is just not fun (and ironically requires more effort in some sense) for me. I say "more effort" because you have to pause and wait for the strike to ready itself. Doing that frequently would really irritate me - I'm too impatient, haha.

Having said that, I've only just fought the second boss. I really enjoyed that boss, even though it was pretty easy to beat. I think what I enjoyed most was that the overall design of the fight was somewhat unique by Zelda standards (although [spoiler]a boss taking a deep breath and then Link promptly throwing a bomb into its mouth is not exactly a new idea[/spoiler]).

I think as time goes on I'm enjoying [i]Skyward Sword[/i] more and more. It definitely has this way of gradually unfolding in front of you, and it seems to become increasingly interesting as time goes by. And I know I haven't yet encountered all the truly interesting stuff!

I'm kind of hoping that Nintendo do something to improve MotionPlus in the future though. This need to re-calibrate and re-center just doesn't feel right. I'm not sure what they can feasibly do, but it would be great if they introduced a new Wii Remote alongside the Wii U or something. [/font]

[Desbreko]

[color=#4B0082]Some enemies aren't as vulnerable to skyward strikes, yeah. But even against some stuff that can block, like Bokoblins, it's not hard at all to abuse. Just charge up a strike as you're running up to it, shoot the beam when you get to the edge of its range, and the Bokoblin usually won't get its guard up in time. It's an easy, no risk knockdown that lets you hit it with a fatal blow afterwards. (On the other hand, a dash jump attack usually also works because Bokoblins aren't exactly quick.) Skyward strikes also make quick work of those three-headed snake monsters. Normally, it's pretty tricky to catch all three heads in a single slash even if you get the angle right, since you have to do as large a swing as possible to reach all three, but the range and size of the skyward strike always gets them as long as you swing at about the right angle. Basically, against anything that doesn't block constantly or require something special, like flipping over Skulltulas, keeping your distance while firing off skyward strikes makes for an easy victory.

About the motion+, you're never going to get away from the need to recenter the cursor. When you go into a pointing view, it takes wherever the remote is currently pointing as center and goes from there for any movement. But then if you move your arm to some other position to get better range of motion or something, you need to recenter to take into account the new positioning because the game has no way of telling that you're just shifting position instead of aiming.

Recentering was really weird for me too at first, because I was expecting it to act like a mouse, where the cursor stays in the same place when you lift it up and move it back to the center of the mouse pad, but I've gotten used to it by now. And I'll take motion+ pointing over sensor bar pointing any day, where you're locked into a single position that's usually awkward unless you're at least six feet away from the screen. The motion+ is also a lot more precise; you no longer have to deal with your aim jumping around like it always did in TP when trying to hold it still to hit small targets.

Having to recalibrate the motion+ every now and then [i]is[/i] annoying, though. Mainly, it's because it can be hard to tell when you need to do it. I sat at the second dungeon boss door for, like, two minutes trying to get the stupid key to rotate the right way before I thought to recalibrate, and then I got it immediately. I found a pretty good way to tell when it's gotten off and needs recalibration, though. Just open up the item circle by holding B and move the cursor around the circle; if you can't get to each item slot easily, or if getting to one side of the circle is harder than the others, you need to recalibrate.

I wonder if the new remotes with the motion+ built in are any better about this.[/color]

[James]

[quote=Desbreko]About the motion+, you're never going to get away from the need to recenter the cursor. When you go into a pointing view, it takes wherever the remote is currently pointing as center and goes from there for any movement. But then if you move your arm to some other position to get better range of motion or something, you need to recenter to take into account the new positioning because the game has no way of telling that you're just shifting position instead of aiming.[/quote]

[font=palatino linotype]Yeah, that's absolutely right. I know [i]why[/i] there's a need for re-centering, but that doesn't make re-centering okay as far as I'm concerned. I just think it feels sloppy. To some extent, it goes against Nintendo's own design principles.

So, to answer your following point, I would much prefer if MotionPlus incorporated the sensor bar in its design. I'm sure there's a middle-ground to be had here - rather than using the sensor bar exclusively to aim, perhaps the sensor bar could simply automatically re-center the controller every time you point at the screen (and then the controller disengages from it once centered). This [i]might[/i] be an elegant way of solving the problem, at least in part. Although I'm sure Nintendo's thought of that, at any rate.[/font]

[quote=Desbreko]Having to recalibrate the motion+ every now and then is annoying, though. Mainly, it's because it can be hard to tell when you need to do it. I sat at the second dungeon boss door for, like, two minutes trying to get the stupid key to rotate the right way before I thought to recalibrate, and then I got it immediately. I found a pretty good way to tell when it's gotten off and needs recalibration, though. Just open up the item circle by holding B and move the cursor around the circle; if you can't get to each item slot easily, or if getting to one side of the circle is harder than the others, you need to recalibrate.[/quote]

[font=palatino linotype]Good tip there. But yes, the re-calibration is also annoying. It somehow feels like I'm doing the work that should be done invisibly behind the scenes by the hardware and software.

So in a sense, I feel like MotionPlus has some advantages, but it also feels like a troublesome compromise. And if it frustrates me - a so-called "core gamer" - I can imagine it being extremely irritating for the "non-gamer" market that Nintendo is aiming for.

(Where's Alex when you need him - he might not believe that I actually have a critical word to say about Nintendo, haha).[/font]

[quote=Desbreko]I wonder if the new remotes with the motion+ built in are any better about this. [/quote]

[font=palatino linotype]Nope, they are no better - at least, they very much fit your description as well as mine. I got the gold Wii Remote with Skyward Sword, which has MotionPlus built in...and yeah, no better unfortunately. -_-[/font]

[quote=Desbreko]Basically, against anything that doesn't block constantly or require something special, like flipping over Skulltulas, keeping your distance while firing off skyward strikes makes for an easy victory.[/quote]

[font=palatino linotype]Interesting. The funny thing is, this whole scenario simply never occurred to me. I guess that's why I haven't included it as a criticism of the game in my own comments - it simply hasn't occurred to me to try to snipe enemies from afar using the skyward strike.

Even so, it just seems like a really un-fun way to play the game. I can see why you'd want to avoid it, mostly.[/font]