Amphion Posted June 24, 2002 Share Posted June 24, 2002 [QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Juuthena [/i] [B]But we still need to do everything we can to help the things we love, but not kill everything you hate. [/B][/QUOTE] Thats a good quote. I only wish everyone lived by that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juu Posted June 24, 2002 Author Share Posted June 24, 2002 Thanx! I just thought of it.... but yeah, life would be so much eaisier that way. but the sad thing is... as long as humans walk the earth, there will never be peace. so.... don't expect it to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Matt Posted June 24, 2002 Share Posted June 24, 2002 [color=red][b]So true. Humans are so ignorant that there will never be peace. We can't even have peace in the US, we have different political parties. They are constantly arguing.[/b][/color] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Transtic Nerve Posted June 24, 2002 Share Posted June 24, 2002 [QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Amphion [/i] [B] No, its not the US as a whole, its the FEW goverment officials that think that. Yes we beileve that our country is better off than alot of other countries. It is. And I am not sure what you mean by we present ourselves to be perfect, how do we do that? [/B][/QUOTE] Well... good question lol How do I put this. Well why I'm thinking let me address the first part of your post. There are alot more people, citizens and goverment officials alike that think this. Perhaps perfect is not the word I'm looking to use here. But... Better than everyone else to a far extent that pride becomes prejudice.... thats probably what I'm trying to say. And pretty much every high level government official and politician will say that to you. They think this country is the best in all ways and anything in comparison is just a waste of time. How do we present ourselves to be perfect.. or well not perfect but what I said above.... Everything from post World War II till present time should explain this. We made ourselves the "world's police"... we involve ourselves in every conflict imaginable. It was that pride and prejudice that got us involved in Korea and Vietnam. We want everything and everyone to be like us and if it's not, then it's an enemy, as this thread suggests in itself. Perhaps thats more clear on what I'm trying to say.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amphion Posted June 24, 2002 Share Posted June 24, 2002 Okay, I think you explained it better in that post. I agrea that we have done some stupid stuff "for the sake of demcocracy" or whatever. Im not sure though. I think that the US is better off then most countries but I dont mean that in a we are superior way. But with Vietnam and Korea was mainly the US trying to take the threat of comunism away. You have to remember back then people were terrified of comunism taking hold in america. But I dont think alot of our efforts since then has been like that. I am all for helping people but it needs to be for that reason only. not to take shots at comunists. But yes I think I see your point now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Macaiodh Posted June 24, 2002 Share Posted June 24, 2002 [COLOR=darkblue]hmmm... let me bring up something that i don't think anybody mentioned. i find it very curious that bush referred to these countries as an "axis of evil." he had to have known that, during world war 2, the hilter/mussolini/stalin combo was called the "axis powers." & president bush doesn't really say much that his speech-writers & advisors don't tell him to say. someone put thought into the name axis of evil, & they did it for a reason. whether the name similarity was a coincidence or not (& i don't really think it was), the US is going to war, & it's not going to be a small war, & there's nothing we can say or do to stop it. this is exactly why i'm moving to australia in the dead center of about 500 acres so i never have to see another person again if i don't want to. i'm not kidding, either.[/COLOR] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GotenksSSJ343 Posted June 24, 2002 Share Posted June 24, 2002 Uh during World War 2 I though it was Hitler, Mussolini and (I can't spell his first name) Tojo <---------He was the dictator of Japan. Because Stalin and the Soviets were on the allied side with Great Britian and U.S during World War 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juu Posted June 25, 2002 Author Share Posted June 25, 2002 What is happening now is many countries are declaring war. The sad thing is, it could be the start of world war III. But hopely in this war, (if there is one) as justin said, let the soliders be soliders and leave civillians be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delian Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 Unfortunately, In every war there will always be civillian lives lost. Enemies will want to wipe each other out, not just soldiers. In a place like Palestine/Israel, that includes women and children. That's where war crimes occur. You can always be assured that innocent lives will be lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amphion Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 Yes delian is right. theres always going to be civilain lossess. Most of the time they are inccidental or unavoidable, which is just part of war. But Things like carpet bombing citys is just not exceptable. But WAR is just that, its war. Anyone who thinks its possible for countries to work things out all the time and never have to have civialians killed is ignorant. Main thing is, a Country should target another countries War effort, not their civialians. Palestinians are targeting Civilians. You never see them blow up any thing military related. The Israelies are going straight for the extremists, whuixh is exactly what they should do. If these extremist where even somewhat smart they would attack Israeli military targets so they want beable to respond with these raids. but like I said, its stupid for a Goverment to sit and watch its people die. So I dont see anything wrong with what the Israeli's are doing and I hope they do more of it. I dont know where you get your stories of Israeli masscres Delian, but you should have hard proof of these things before you start saying stuff like that. Peace should always be the first option, but if you cant gain peace through negotiations you have to result to negotiation by force. You attack and force them into peace. Thats the only way it can happen. Israel has been blown to bits long enough. They sat and did nothing about it at first. what happend? The attacks kept coming. When they did attack the extremist the attacks stopped. War is never the answer but you have to understand that it is necesarry sometimes. sorry, I know this is a bad illustration, but it has a whole lot of truth to it. Look at the Sank Kingdom in Gundam Wing, Thats exactly what I am talking about. If the other side does not want peace, people will continue to die, sometimes you just have to fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 [color=royalblue]Amphion, that post is absolutely full of holes and ignorance. I don't have the time for an in-depth response right now, but I will be more than happy to go through the issue momentarily. I'm sure someone else will step in before I do, though.[/color] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amphion Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 Are you referring to my post? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delian Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 Amphion you must be one of the most pathetically ignorant, narrow minded people I have come across. My proof is that I saw footage of this happening. I saw a soldier kill that boy. His head fell on his father's lap, His father is now in a mental hospital. I've seen footage of Palestinian houses get destroyed by enemy soldiers because the desperate people (majority of whom are women and children) living inside refused to give the only thing they have left...their homes... How would that make you feel? Joyful...yeah I don't think so... Like I said before, I watch as much news as I can, even foreign news channels. I see both Governments are as bad as eachother. Both are to blame for the violence and hatred. But the destructive power lies with Israel. The Palestinian people are desperate. Where do you get your misguided information from???? A talk show maybe... Please do not insult me by posting up your garbage. I have respect for everyone's opinion here, but yours is highly misinformed I can't believe I'm even justifying myself to a someone like you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kainashi Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 I think its wrong how the president acts. God, if only Al Gore won.... @_@ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juu Posted June 25, 2002 Author Share Posted June 25, 2002 I'm not really sure what would happen really.... but really what bush is doing... erm... I'm totally against the axis o evil thing but.... he's not THAT bad of a guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amphion Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 [QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Delian [/i] [B]Amphion you must be one of the most pathetically ignorant, narrow minded people I have come across. My proof is that I saw footage of this happening. I saw a soldier kill that boy. His head fell on his father's lap, His father is now in a mental hospital. I've seen footage of Palestinian houses get destroyed by enemy soldiers because the desperate people (majority of whom are women and children) living inside refused to give the only thing they have left...their homes... How would that make you feel? Joyful...yeah I don't think so... Like I said before, I watch as much news as I can, even foreign news channels. I see both Governments are as bad as eachother. Both are to blame for the violence and hatred. But the destructive power lies with Israel. The Palestinian people are desperate. Where do you get your misguided information from???? A talk show maybe... Please do not insult me by posting up your garbage. I have respect for everyone's opinion here, but yours is highly misinformed I can't believe I'm even justifying myself to a someone like you. [/B][/QUOTE] Your the narrow minded one my freind. You insult me over an opinion I stated. I did not see this Video you speak of. But innocent people die in WAR. You a fool if you think otherwise. But there is a difference between the normal civilian deaths in a WAR and massacres. I was simply stating that your trying to say Israel is massecreing people when you have no proof. One boy getting shot in the head, and it was probably unintentional, is not massecreing people. Therefore, you dont have proof so you are wrong. You dont know everything. Just cause you watch all the news channels still doesnt mean you know everything. You dont know everything unless you experience everything. All the news that you see is going to favor one side. So some of the stuff you see your not goin to know the full story on. So shut up. Your just making your self look dumb. I dont like you so please do not talk to me again. Its like no one cares what is happening to the Israeli's. They only care about the Palestinians rights. Thats fine, but your putting everything off the Israeli's are going though. I never said that WAR is great. But it is true that sometimes WAR is the only answer. And just becaus ethe Palestinians wont organize any kind of army to fight Israel, doesnt justify in killing innocent people day after day. What did this all start over anyway? Their would be no raids if they would stop blowing up. Israel is not thier land anyway. Like I said in another post. Anybody who knows there history, klnows that the Jews where run out of Israel by the Romans. Afterwards the Palestinians moved in. So the Palestinians have no right to claim it as rightfully theirs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delian Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 First of all I am not your friend. I do not claim I know everything. I try my hardest to see the big picture.... Besides i've already stated that innocent people get killed during war in an earlier post that you referred to so how could you even say that i'm ignorant to that fact. You have not seen what i've seen. You have not lived in a country during it's war time. I have. You know nothing and what you are saying is nothing. You yourself say that you haven't seen the footage, so how can you say that it's wrong? How can you say that i'm wrong? If you're hinting that I made this up, then you must be really sick minded. Your argument is falling apart. Any country that involves itself in War has to hold some responsibility, some more than others...But deliberate acts of killing innocence cannot be tolerated. Besides, every news does show favouritism (sp?). That's why not all are trusted. As for you not liking me and all other insults...well I can only laugh and shake my head at your extreme immaturity... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amphion Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 Okay, so now we all know that you can not read either. I said in my post do not talk to me. I never said killing inoccent was right. I never hinted at what your where saying to be made up. Your probably right. My country is at WAR right now. I thought you watched the news. We had to develop a warning scale to tell us each day how much of a threat is posed to us by terroists. Pretty soon we will be as bad off as the poor Israeli's. So see, you dont know what your talking about. ITs not immature to not like someone. We all have people we dont like. See there you go again. Let me try this one more time. Dont waste my time and board space talking to me. [color=red][size=1]I advise you to calm down, Amphion. Read my advice to Delian and follow it yourself. -Justin[/size][/color] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 Amphion, allow me to point out some weaknesses in your arguement. Palestine and Isreal have been fighting for centuries. On a broader scale, Jews and Muslims have been fighting for centuries. It won't ever stop. Even if Palestine stopped the terrorism, there would ALWAYS be trouble. Both sides are at fault for that. Now, I have heard of the stories of Isreali soldiers killing innocents, and though I'm sure some are untrue, it is impossible to dismiss them just because the American media leans toward Isreal. And there are no differences in atrocities in war-time and artocities during peace-time. ALL are criminal acts, no matter how they are justified, and killing a child is an atrocity. I don't care what his father did, where he was from, what have you. Also, don't you think the reason the Palestinians haven't organized an army is because Isreal would know as soon as they began recruiting soldiers? I don't know what else James would've said, but if I'm sure he'll show you soon enough. Now for Delian... I'm over the conflict we had earlier, so don't think anything I say has to do with that. Now, I know you are overwhelmingly out-numbered here. I can only imagine how that feels. But you have to remain calm and cool. I expect as much from you, because you're older and I believe that you can. You've calmed down a lot since this topic started, as I have, and the more calm you become, the more powerful your opinions become. -Justin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amphion Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 Thank You Justin. You point out some good things. Maybe you can bring this topic back to order. I hope I did not seem like I was trying to justify the killing of the kid. Im just trying to say theres no proof of Israel massecreing people. Like you said, yes I do beleive some things happen like that. In WWII mad america soldiers who just saw their buddy get blown away would kill Germans who surrendered. This is wrong but it happens in every army. And on the organization of an Army, Im just saying theres other ways besides killing innocent children. That by no means is justifiable under any circumstances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delian Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 As stated before conflict of views regarding these issues will always arise. That is unavoidable..I'm not trying to change anyone's views. I do respect other people's opinions, whatever they may be. All I asked was that you try to see where I'm coming from and what my point is. I realise that I am highly out-numbered. I can't do much about that. However, I stand by all that I have stated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 As you should, Delian. Phew...another day...another conflict solved. :) -Justin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GotenksSSJ343 Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 Wars is bad no matter what the cause because in war people die and especially when you launch bombs and just start shooting battles in cities because you can't decide who lives or who dies it just kills everything in its path. Now I see why we went in WW2 we hate Hitler. But Vietnam was just a waste of time and we lost alot of men out there and now were at of one of those wars today were we have to stop somebody from killing more innocent people which I think is right to blame some countries for attacking us. But right now people thinking lets blow up Bin Laden and his friends plus his country. those people who think getting revenge by blowing up all the countries that attacked us are not thinking right to me beacuse the action of one leads some people into hateing the race of all the people just because of that one or couple person/people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Transtic Nerve Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 [QUOTE][i]Originally posted by kainashi [/i] [B]I think its wrong how the president acts. God, if only Al Gore won.... @_@ [/B][/QUOTE] Lol, thats really bad... It wouldn't be much different... A president has their dity to "please to masses"... thats why they were elected. If a president couldn't have taken appreopiate action upon terrorists and the countries who harbor them, there would be alot of upset people... so Gore would have most likely done the same, if not more of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 i say that atleast g.w. bush is willing to stand up to these people and not back down to the political correctness that is ruining america. screw the extremist and screw the whinners. the world isnt gonna stop when we ask it to and these people arent gonna go away if we pretend to be their friends. they hate us, and we americans dont have the patience to hate them. i say we do what washington said. we stay on our side of the ocean and we dont make any alliances, unless the alliance is only temporary. i say we dont need them for anything. i also think that conflicts the communist and other naive idealistic people start will be the down fall of human kind. the axis of evil is a true statement and bush should be praised for sticking up for the free world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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