What are your thoughts on organized religion?

[Transtic Nerve]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Shinji v2.0 [/i]
[B][SIZE=1][COLOR=darkred]Hehehe, sorry, I didn't read any of the posts :P It just looked like you and Zanza arguing, lol.

Peace, Love, and Anime
Shinji (^_^)/[/COLOR][/SIZE] [/B][/QUOTE]

Oh, well... yeah... we do that alot too... we have a LONG line of debating... back from dubbed anime and subbed anime, to religion, to why Rocket Dive by hide sucks @ss! :) It's a year and then some of debated between him and I... and now we are best friends :) it's amazing the road we've been on.... but I'm glad I was on it... he's a great friend.... anyway..... what was I saying............. hmm oh well

[Shinji v2.0]

[SIZE=1][COLOR=darkred]Oh, Zanza is a he.

Peace, Love, and Anime
Shinji (^_^)/[/COLOR][/SIZE]

[Guest zanza]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by James [/i]
[B]To anyone who uses simple logic. I understand belief and why people believe in religion...but I just don't understand why more people don't use common logic.[/B][/QUOTE]

I understand you're an admin so I'll refrain calling you any names, even though you have in a way done so to me.

Non-Christians often make the statement "I don't mind Christianity as long as they don't force it on me." OK. I've never forced it on anyone; I've given some encouragement to do so, but when they declined the first time, I've stopped.

Now what's this? Oh. YOU trying to tell me that I'm basically retarded believing in Christianity. You know what? You just made a hypocrite of yourself. Can't ban me for that, I'm just pointing out what you did.

I don't care what you think of Christianity. I know God exists, just like Desert Shadow does. Think what you want of God, just don't tell me I'm stupid for it.

[Guest zanza]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Shinji v2.0 [/i]
[B]Anyways, I'm sure I'm not the only one who's noticed this, but if I remember correctly, one of the things God, or Jesus, or whoever it was, said not to make false idols or something...In simple terms, not to idolize anyone because you think they are 'better than you'. Than why the **** do Christians idolize Jesus, or whoever it is? Odd stuff. Odd, odd stuff.[/B][/QUOTE]

It's the second commandment. I don't know the line precisely but it's something to this effect: "Do not create false idols to take my place." In other words, do not love anything more than God, especially worldly possessions, example: gold.

[Transtic Nerve]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by zanza [/i]
[B]

It's the second commandment. I don't know the line precisely but it's something to this effect: "Do not create false idols to take my place." In other words, do not love anything more than God, especially worldly possessions, example: gold. [/B][/QUOTE]

So I can't love anyone but god...... I guess I'll have to hate my boyfriend and family........................... that was a joke... cause I know thats not what you meant.... just trying to lighten up the mood!

Anyway, religion is too much of a personal issure with alot of people.... i think those personal problmes get in the way of acting in a civil manner and watching what you say cause it might offend one person or another as it has done... that goes for me, you, all of us, and the cows to your right....

That brings another question up.... do animals worship god? They lack the ability to reason in their brain.. apart from Apes and Dolphins, but do they have a god?... does god love them, well obviously he does or he wouldn't have put them on the arc.... but like... how do we know they know and love god?.... what if I wanna worship god like a cat!.... they don't go to church... well some do, but.. yeah.... oh well.... thats an interesting question....

[Anna]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Transtic Nerve [/i]
[B]

So I can't love anyone but god...... I guess I'll have to hate my boyfriend and family........................... that was a joke... cause I know thats not what you meant.... just trying to lighten up the mood!

Anyway, religion is too much of a personal issure with alot of people.... i think those personal problmes get in the way of acting in a civil manner and watching what you say cause it might offend one person or another as it has done... that goes for me, you, all of us, and the cows to your right....

That brings another question up.... do animals worship god? They lack the ability to reason in their brain.. apart from Apes and Dolphins, but do they have a god?... does god love them, well obviously he does or he wouldn't have put them on the arc.... but like... how do we know they know and love god?.... what if I wanna worship god like a cat!.... they don't go to church... well some do, but.. yeah.... oh well.... thats an interesting question.... [/B][/QUOTE]

.....................lol :laugh: whoooa, okay I doubt that animals are subject to anything of that nature since it is quite obvious that they lack the intelligence humans have (and I know your whole view of the stupidity of humans, but we [i]do[/i] have [i]some[/i] mental capacity :D ) Since I'm not a cat myself, I don't really worry about how far their intellect reaches ..... :laugh: :D

[Ice Dragon v2]

lettme ask u this
Do all humans have limits to their intelligence??????

[k9*]

i haven't read all of this topic, but i have something to say.

i look at the universe, and the 'history' of it, and what i see is something that could not have come to be without some sort of outside influence. i'm not argueing against evolution, in fact i know it's still occurring, i'm just saying that according to science, evolution would be impossible, because of the increase in energy of the system that would b required for it to happen.
i have choosen to belive in Jehovah as that outside and divine force. i also believe that most other religions and sects provide a good basis for the morality of their faithful followers.

[Alexander]

I am currently in the proccess of writting a story, maybe even a book that uses a sence of Christianity like that found in Neon Genesis Evangelion. That means huge differences between it and the 'normal' christian texts. An entirely different and dark viewpoint. For all I know this book could be blasphemy, but I don't care. I'm writing it, and there is no one in the world who can stop me from writing what may become my greatest work.

[James]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by zanza [/i]
[B]

I understand you're an admin so I'll refrain calling you any names, even though you have in a way done so to me.

Non-Christians often make the statement "I don't mind Christianity as long as they don't force it on me." OK. I've never forced it on anyone; I've given some encouragement to do so, but when they declined the first time, I've stopped.

Now what's this? Oh. YOU trying to tell me that I'm basically retarded believing in Christianity. You know what? You just made a hypocrite of yourself. Can't ban me for that, I'm just pointing out what you did.

I don't care what you think of Christianity. I know God exists, just like Desert Shadow does. Think what you want of God, just don't tell me I'm stupid for it. [/B][/QUOTE]

Hold on a moment, don't get so uptight about this. My grandparents are highly religious so believe me, I live around it myself.

Let me just say that I am not stating that you are stupid for believing in God. All I'm pointing out is that it's a belief and not a fact. If you [i]want[/i] to believe in God...then that's okay with me, you do whatever you want.

You can't take any of my comments personally. Just as you are insisting that God exists and basically biting my head off for my opinions on life. I never specifically mentioned you, nor am I saying or implying that you're an idiot.

It can be very difficult to look openly at religion and criticize its many inaccuracies because of this...you get such a strong reaction as soon as you open your mouth. Well I'm sorry, but I'm not at all a hypocrite...I've stated that people can believe what they like.

All I said was that I prefer to look at fact and thus, that makes it difficult for me to follow any particular religion.

Some advice: next time don't take any general statements or opinions so seriously. They aren't a personal attack on you at all, they are merely my observations of religion. Take them or leave them, that's your choice. But I never spoke directly of you and it's unfair to flame me due to misinterpretation on your part.

[Guest zanza]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by James [/i]
[B]Some advice: next time don't take any general statements or opinions so seriously. They aren't a personal attack on you at all, they are merely my observations of religion. Take them or leave them, that's your choice. But I never spoke directly of you and it's unfair to flame me due to misinterpretation on your part. [/B][/QUOTE]

Misinterpretation? Not quite. Let's review a bit:

"Basically, it goes like this. The bible is a book written thousands of years ago by suspicious and superstitious people who were uneducated. It's in the same style as Zeus or the Cyclops...people actually believed it in those times. The only difference is that people still believe some of those things to be true. Sure, it's a shame...but that's just how life works."

OK. At first I just thought you were stating your opinion on the Bible; you basically think it's written by a bunch of lunatics. And it very well appears to me that you think it is a shame that some people (example: me) believe in it. Yeah, that's a bit offensive to me, but I only figured that it was just your opinion on things. So I made that clear and said,

"To you, that is."

Now, I said that because personally I disagree with your opinion, very much so in fact. I was trying make the idea very concrete that the original quote here was merely your opinion. While I may not like the fact you seem to look down on me for my belief in the Bible (and you do, you said it was a shame) I can't do anything about that. But no, apparently it wasn't just your opinion.

"To anyone who uses simple logic. I understand belief and why people believe in religion...but I just don't understand why more people don't use common logic. "

Oh, so basically, that's saying anyone who uses simple logic would realize that the Bible was merely written by superstitious people way back when. I don't think that way; so basically you're saying I don't use simple logic, and don't use common logic. To me, that's STUPIDITY. Thus, I, and anyone who believes in the Bible, was just called stupid, by you. I must say I don't see where the misinterpretation comes in.

[James]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by zanza [/i]
[B]

Misinterpretation? Not quite. Let's review a bit:

"Basically, it goes like this. The bible is a book written thousands of years ago by suspicious and superstitious people who were uneducated. It's in the same style as Zeus or the Cyclops...people actually believed it in those times. The only difference is that people still believe some of those things to be true. Sure, it's a shame...but that's just how life works."

OK. At first I just thought you were stating your opinion on the Bible; you basically think it's written by a bunch of lunatics. And it very well appears to me that you think it is a shame that some people (example: me) believe in it. Yeah, that's a bit offensive to me, but I only figured that it was just your opinion on things. So I made that clear and said,

"To you, that is."

Now, I said that because personally I disagree with your opinion, very much so in fact. I was trying make the idea very concrete that the original quote here was merely your opinion. While I may not like the fact you seem to look down on me for my belief in the Bible (and you do, you said it was a shame) I can't do anything about that. But no, apparently it wasn't just your opinion.

"To anyone who uses simple logic. I understand belief and why people believe in religion...but I just don't understand why more people don't use common logic. "

Oh, so basically, that's saying anyone who uses simple logic would realize that the Bible was merely written by superstitious people way back when. I don't think that way; so basically you're saying I don't use simple logic, and don't use common logic. To me, that's STUPIDITY. Thus, I, and anyone who believes in the Bible, was just called stupid, by you. I must say I don't see where the misinterpretation comes in. [/B][/QUOTE]

Uhh...okay.

I think you're taking things just a little too seriously here. You have to remember that I'm basing all of my knowledge on fact as well as providing my own observations.

I do think that it's a shame that many parts of the bible are taken literally, as obviously, they aren't designed for that. Perhaps I should have said this instead. Does that statement make more sense to you?

I am not making the sweeping statement that Christians are stupid. I have many Chrisitian friends who are highly intelligent people.

Belief is such a personal issue...and as I mentioned earlier, it's important for people to find their own personal truths.

All I was pointing out was that the bible itself is full of elements which have no basis in reality or fact. Having said that, the bible is also something that people can interpret for their own well being, it's something that you can take your own lessons from and use them in your daily life.

So I'm not at all stating that all Christians are stupid or ignorant. I'm merely pointing out the problems with taking 100% of the bible literally.

I'm sorry if I didn't make that clear enough for you. But I hope that this post clears you up as to my intentions.

[Guest zanza]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by James [/i]
[B]I do think that it's a shame that many parts of the bible are taken literally, as obviously, they aren't designed for that. Perhaps I should have said this instead. Does that statement make more sense to you? [/B][/QUOTE]

Yes it does. It seems quite different to what you've said in the past but I'll take it.

I'd like to ask which parts of the Bible you think are taken literally and shouldn't be, however.

[James]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by zanza [/i]
[B]

Yes it does. It seems quite different to what you've said in the past but I'll take it.

I'd like to ask which parts of the Bible you think are taken literally and shouldn't be, however. [/B][/QUOTE]

Okay, I'm glad that you now understand what I'm talking about here.

There are many parts of the bible which are taken literally and shouldn't be (simply for lack of fact), but as I mentioned earlier, the absolute best place to read about it is in a book called "Telling Lies for God" by Ian Plimer.

If you read that book, it will really open your mind on issues of religion :)

[Guest zanza]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by James [/i]
[B]There are many parts of the bible which are taken literally and shouldn't be (simply for lack of fact)[/B][/QUOTE]

Does not the whole Bible lack a lot of fact? I mean, really, there's no real way to prove the Bible is true to what it says.... just one of those things you either believe or you don't.

[James]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by zanza [/i]
[B]

Does not the whole Bible lack a lot of fact? I mean, really, there's no real way to prove the Bible is true to what it says.... just one of those things you either believe or you don't. [/B][/QUOTE]

You make a good point there...but actually, many parts of the bible are disproven in the book I referred to earlier. It's a great book.

Personally, I feel that there haven't been a great many studies or investigations into the truth of the bible. This is mainly because a lot of researchers themselves are Christian and are perhaps afraid that they might uncover the idea that their "beliefs" aren't actually true.

Of course, there are many other reasons.

But the book I told you about goes through the bible and discusses various aspects, and then disproves many of them in great detail.

I strongly recommend that you borrow the book from your local library and take a look.

[Guest Voodookanaka]

Ok. going back to what was said earlier on about being brainwashed. Dont u think its a bit of a coincidence that if your Christian, sos generally your family or its part of your culture (same applies to other religions) If your part of an alt' sect' your a pagan....etc.... YOur all bleeding conformist especially u so called punks from the moment u say 'Im a punk'

If u dont understand with what im on about u never will!

[Desert Shadow]

[b](all the italized quotes are from Transtic Nerve)

"[i]The best thing that I could get to understanding is from watching Dogma, as bad as that may sound.... it may be a comedy but if you look deep inside it's meaning, it is one of the best written plots and has some of the best ideals I've ever seen....[/i]"

Lots of people seem to get their thoughts about religon from movies, magazines and books. Kinda sad really....

[i]"This is more focused around the Christian belief than any other.... why not talk about Judaism.... they believe in Jesus Christ and god... but do they believe in heaven?... No.... there is not after life... whats makes them different from Christains... essentially to be Christian is to follow Christ.... don't the Jewish peopel do that? But why are they seperate... why is their religion wrong? Believe in the same person/people.... Judaism isn't that much different from Christianity.... aside from the countless holidays and no after life..... Samething goes for Muslims.... they believe in God... they call him Alah (sp?) but essentially it's the same god.... so what makes them different?...[/i]"

I've always understood it that Jews don't beleive that Jesus was the Son of God, and that they are still waiting for Him to come to earth. And i also thought, or assumed, they beleived in afterlife too... Maybe not. Is there any Jews that could clear this up?

And Muslims don't think Jesus was the Son of God either, but jes' a prophet. And they have lots of other different beleifs. I don't like to say that they are all the same. Because I already know God, and He is the God of... 'christianity' i guess you could say. That's the best word to describe it i guess... But the term 'christianity' is used way to loosely these days. I don't consider most catholics christian. I don't consider mormon's christian. Because their beleifs are so radically different. Applying one word to different beleifs leads to confusion.

[i]"Does not the bible say "Do not judge people" but I'll be damned if it doesn't say Homosexuality is wrong. IS THAT NOT JUDGING??? What a bucnha BS! Again, it says do not judge people.... yet people who believe in other religions are shut out and hated because what they believe isn't "right".... I'm sorry but thats judging.... I mean, right there, the bible goes against itself... the BIBLE just committed a sin.... at least thats how I see it...."[/i]

I don't like it when people misquote scripture either... It makes me have to explain it to them.
The Bible says not to judge people, because we aren't supposed to. It's God's job, He is the only one worthy to judge people. The bible says that man shouldn't judge each other, because it's not their place.

Psalm 75
"6
No one from the east or the west or from the desert can exalt a man.
7
But it is God who judges: He brings one down, he exalts another."

Matthew 7
"1
'Do not judge, or you too will be judged.
2
For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.'"

It doesn't say being a homosexual is a sin. It says that homosexual activity is a sin. You can be a homosexual but still not engage in such activity. I have evil tendencies too, but i shouldn't engage in those. I see it the same way. It's a desire to sin.[/b]

[Guest zanza]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Voodookanaka [/i]
[B]Ok. going back to what was said earlier on about being brainwashed. Dont u think its a bit of a coincidence that if your Christian, sos generally your family or its part of your culture (same applies to other religions) If your part of an alt' sect' your a pagan....etc....[/B][/QUOTE]

Of course it's that way.... if you're raised up to be a Christian by your family, you're probably going to stay a Christian. Not because you're "conforming" to your family, but because you were brought up that way. It's not hard to admit that it's difficult to accept a religion if you haven't been brought up that way; but I've seen it happen.

[Aya]

Eh. Some people remain Christians because that's the what they were told to be, and don't know if they're Christians because of the way they were raised, or who they actually are.

I [B]am[/B] a Christian... I'm just a really shitty Christian...

[conpiracymonki]

[b]Just a point out, but uh,..it's Allah. It comes from two words which are joined together,...Al (meaning 'the') and Ilah (meaning 'God'), so Al-Ilah is shortened to Allah. And the word Allah can't be used loosely to make male and female gods or even plural form, ie; you can't have a Allahess, Allahs etc,...that's why we Muslims tend to use that instead of the word God, regardless of the fact that we know English...anyways,...I [i]would[/i] say somthing about Jesus AS, (nothing bad) but y'all probly won't believe me, or might even flame me and so on...so I'll keep quiet for now...[/b]

[Transtic Nerve]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Desert Shadow [/i]
[B][b]It doesn't say being a homosexual is a sin. It says that homosexual activity is a sin. You can be a homosexual but still not engage in such activity. I have evil tendencies too, but i shouldn't engage in those. I see it the same way. It's a desire to sin.[/b] [/B][/QUOTE]

Well, men still judge another men. Every person does it eithe rout loud or in thier mind. You judged me above as acting possibly stupid when yuo said that I quoted the bible wrong and that means you have to explain it to me.

Regardless.... an act of homosexuality is nothing... I will quote something for you!... this comes from a man by the Name of Steven Carter: "It's only love, what is everyone so afraid of?"... to engage in homosexual sex is not different from heterosexual sex. it' still an act of love just between two males/females and not between the two opposite sexes. There's not differece whether you think so or not. That would be judging on your part. An act of love is an act of love no matter who it's done with. Kissing, holding hands, hugging, sex, oral sex, whatever..... it's all the same, and it's just love being expressed so why is it sooooo wrong? It's almost ludicrous that god can love so many people but people can't love one another.... that goes against nature!

And again, I still am pretty sure the Jewish don't have an afterlife, and they do believe in Jesus, he just isn't the Messiah, he was a prophet, as the same in the way i do believe as AJ2K1 said. But I'm not 100% sure on the afterlife thing.

[Desert Shadow]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Transtic Nerve [/i]
[B]
Regardless.... an act of homosexuality is nothing... I will quote something for you!... this comes from a man by the Name of Steven Carter: "It's only love, what is everyone so afraid of?"... to engage in homosexual sex is not different from heterosexual sex. it' still an act of love just between two males/females and not between the two opposite sexes. There's not differece whether you think so or not. That would be judging on your part. An act of love is an act of love no matter who it's done with. Kissing, holding hands, hugging, sex, oral sex, whatever..... it's all the same, and it's just love being expressed so why is it sooooo wrong? It's almost ludicrous that god can love so many people but people can't love one another.... that goes against nature!
[/B][/QUOTE]


[b]Does that make rape an act of love?[/b]

[Guest Soft mush]

I think I'll start a religion. Where ducks wear hats and nothing is as it seems . . .

[Desert Shadow]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Shinji v2.0 [/i]
[B]

[SIZE=1][COLOR=darkred]Punk music isn't what's cool. Trust me. And yes, Religion is a form of ****ing conformity.

Anyways, I'm sure I'm not the only one who's noticed this, but if I remember correctly, one of the things God, or Jesus, or whoever it was, said not to make false idols or something...In simple terms, not to idolize anyone because you think they are 'better than you'. Than why the **** do Christians idolize Jesus, or whoever it is? Odd stuff. Odd, odd stuff.

Peace, Love, and Anime
Shinji (^_^)/[/COLOR][/SIZE] [/B][/QUOTE]



[b]It's Exodus 20:3

"You shall have no other gods before me."

Thats where the no idol thing came from. There are other places too. It basically says not to have any other gods... Jesus is God, so "before me" in the verse means no other ones, and He is the one.[/b]